Lockdown modeller rabbit hole story...

firepaulmusic

This is my lockdown story of disappearing down the modeller rabbit hole, not too much tech content just my thoughts and final conclusions.....

So when we were all locked down and the gigs dried up I thought I’d do something I had needed to do for ages. This was to finally see which of the modellers I thought was the best for going direct. In the distant past I had used a Roland GP100, Marshall JMP1, Rocktron Prophesy, Line 6 HD500, Yamaha DG Stomp, Roland VG8, Fractal Axe FX 1 and for the past 3 years Fractal AX8. I dabbled with Two Notes units and pedals, which on reflection was quite successful. The best being a TN Cab Rack with my Bogner Shiva head, no cab.

So now we were locked down and the first thing I spotted was the Strymon Iridium. Expensive for a small pedal but everyone was rating them. I also bought the a Multi Switch to make it giggable. Thought it was a great unit, easy to get sounds, no menus and it felt like an amp with some realistic sag. Really pleased with this one.

Atomic Amplifire 3 and 12 were next. Both easy to programme if the PC software is a bit clunky. Some of the sounds were up there with my AX8, the Friedman in particular. The Michael Britt patches really bring these to life. Sold the AF3, kept the 12 as a backup for my AX8, not that I need it now I suppose which you’ll read later. Very nice units which don’t get the attention they deserve.

Next up I wanted to revisit the Helix and found a used Gold Edition. Loved the user interface, had great fun building sounds. Ultimate hook up flexibility, built like a tank, real quality. I bought some a Michael Britt patches to see what he had done with it. In the end I just couldn’t get what I wanted out of it so it had to go. There are loads of people who love this unit but for some reason the sounds didn’t do it for me.

Then I got hooked on Shaun Tubbs’ Revv D20 videos, remembering how good the Two Notes stuff was before. First I bought the Two Notes Captor X and hooked it up with my Marshall Jubilee combo. Initially thought “this is it”, real amp feel, the sound was perfect through a PA cab and headphones. Then it hit me that I would need to convert my combo to a head and hook up a processor in 4-cable method to make it giggable, way too much hassle.

So the D20 must be the answer, found a used one. I’m still playing with this amp and finding what it can do. So far I’ve found that it’s a wonderful amp in it’s own right, even before you start getting into the TN software. Seriously good for studio guys, I don’t think anything can beat it. There are no digital artefacts, it’s the perfect solution and loads of fun to use the software. Needs MIDI and pedals for gigging though...

Trouble is that as soon as the D20 turned up my mate offered me his nearly new Kemper Stage for a good price. Now after a couple of days playing with it I’m totally hooked and converted. It’s the perfect solution to my long search for going direct to PA. I’m playing at a local tribute festival on Sunday 27/9 and have already programmed in 2 performances. If it goes well I’m hoping this is it. The wonderful D20 is still sitting there waiting to be fully explored, it’s a fab bit of kit and it was only sidelined by timing...

kennedydream1980

I’ve been on a similar journey and not just during lockdown. I’ve gigged for around the last 6 or so years using various modellers. All have worked to some degree. Some easier than others. 

For me there is always something missing in the mids, with a valve amp there is something magical in the mids which no modeller for me has been able to replicate. The Kemper was the closest out of the big 3.

I’m no longer gigging but still try to play as much as I can. I have limited space at home so I need a good sounding compact setup.

I ended up with the Revv G20. It’s the best direct solution I’ve ever used. The feel and the magical mids are there. It’s versatile in that I can hook it up with my TC Nova System in the effects loop and run out of the direct out on the amp into my interface. Or I can run out of the direct out on the Rev into the Nova, then out in stereo to my interface so I can get nice stereo delays and modulation.

The Nova also changes channels on the amp via midi.

Ive only ever ran the amp direct, Ive never felt the need to use a cab as it feels and sounds so good direct. 

The irony is this is the best sounding direct solution I’ve ever had and after 20 or so years of regular gigging I no longer play in a band.

I would love to hear it through a big PA 

firepaulmusic

kennedydream1980 said:

I’ve been on a similar journey and not just during lockdown. I’ve gigged for around the last 6 or so years using various modellers. All have worked to some degree. Some easier than others. 

For me there is always something missing in the mids, with a valve amp there is something magical in the mids which no modeller for me has been able to replicate. The Kemper was the closest out of the big 3.

I’m no longer gigging but still try to play as much as I can. I have limited space at home so I need a good sounding compact setup.

I ended up with the Revv G20. It’s the best direct solution I’ve ever used. The feel and the magical mids are there. It’s versatile in that I can hook it up with my TC Nova System in the effects loop and run out of the direct out on the amp into my interface. Or I can run out of the direct out on the Rev into the Nova, then out in stereo to my interface so I can get nice stereo delays and modulation.

The Nova also changes channels on the amp via midi.

Ive only ever ran the amp direct, Ive never felt the need to use a cab as it feels and sounds so good direct. 

The irony is this is the best sounding direct solution I’ve ever had and after 20 or so years of regular gigging I no longer play in a band.

I would love to hear it through a big PA 

Yes, sounds like we have similar experiences, mine is over the past 20 odd years since the GP100 came out. I only plugged the D20 into a guitar cab for the first time yesterday, what a fabulous pushed clean sound. I’ve got a Nova System here so will try that as a simple setup although I’ve also programmed a 4CM patch for it on my AX8, hows that for overkill? I need to climb out of the rabbit hole now so just keeping the Kemper, D20 and AX8.

kennedydream1980

kennedydream1980 said:

I’ve been on a similar journey and not just during lockdown. I’ve gigged for around the last 6 or so years using various modellers. All have worked to some degree. Some easier than others. 

For me there is always something missing in the mids, with a valve amp there is something magical in the mids which no modeller for me has been able to replicate. The Kemper was the closest out of the big 3.

I’m no longer gigging but still try to play as much as I can. I have limited space at home so I need a good sounding compact setup.

I ended up with the Revv G20. It’s the best direct solution I’ve ever used. The feel and the magical mids are there. It’s versatile in that I can hook it up with my TC Nova System in the effects loop and run out of the direct out on the amp into my interface. Or I can run out of the direct out on the Rev into the Nova, then out in stereo to my interface so I can get nice stereo delays and modulation.

The Nova also changes channels on the amp via midi.

Ive only ever ran the amp direct, Ive never felt the need to use a cab as it feels and sounds so good direct. 

The irony is this is the best sounding direct solution I’ve ever had and after 20 or so years of regular gigging I no longer play in a band.

I would love to hear it through a big PA 

Yes, sounds like we have similar experiences, mine is over the past 20 odd years since the GP100 came out. I only plugged the D20 into a guitar cab for the first time yesterday, what a fabulous pushed clean sound. I’ve got a Nova System here so will try that as a simple setup although I’ve also programmed a 4CM patch for it on my AX8, hows that for overkill? I need to climb out of the rabbit hole now so just keeping the Kemper, D20 and AX8.

I really loved the D20 clean sound. Like you say it’s a lovely pushed clean sound. I just couldn’t replicate the G20 drive channel using any pedals with the D20. That included the Rev pedals G2 & G3. In the end I had to have the G20 drive channel so I swapped my D20 for a G20.

I’ve managed to get the G20 clean channel to work for me in that I can get that pushed sound with the wide switch engaged and winding the master volume up to 2 o’clock.

What really surprised me was how good the TC Nova sounded wired up in stereo as described earlier. It beat out a Full fat helix, a helix effects and a Fractal fx8. 

firepaulmusic

kennedydream1980 said:

kennedydream1980 said:

I’ve been on a similar journey and not just during lockdown. I’ve gigged for around the last 6 or so years using various modellers. All have worked to some degree. Some easier than others. 

For me there is always something missing in the mids, with a valve amp there is something magical in the mids which no modeller for me has been able to replicate. The Kemper was the closest out of the big 3.

I’m no longer gigging but still try to play as much as I can. I have limited space at home so I need a good sounding compact setup.

I ended up with the Revv G20. It’s the best direct solution I’ve ever used. The feel and the magical mids are there. It’s versatile in that I can hook it up with my TC Nova System in the effects loop and run out of the direct out on the amp into my interface. Or I can run out of the direct out on the Rev into the Nova, then out in stereo to my interface so I can get nice stereo delays and modulation.

The Nova also changes channels on the amp via midi.

Ive only ever ran the amp direct, Ive never felt the need to use a cab as it feels and sounds so good direct. 

The irony is this is the best sounding direct solution I’ve ever had and after 20 or so years of regular gigging I no longer play in a band.

I would love to hear it through a big PA 

Yes, sounds like we have similar experiences, mine is over the past 20 odd years since the GP100 came out. I only plugged the D20 into a guitar cab for the first time yesterday, what a fabulous pushed clean sound. I’ve got a Nova System here so will try that as a simple setup although I’ve also programmed a 4CM patch for it on my AX8, hows that for overkill? I need to climb out of the rabbit hole now so just keeping the Kemper, D20 and AX8.

I really loved the D20 clean sound. Like you say it’s a lovely pushed clean sound. I just couldn’t replicate the G20 drive channel using any pedals with the D20. That included the Rev pedals G2 & G3. In the end I had to have the G20 drive channel so I swapped my D20 for a G20.

I’ve managed to get the G20 clean channel to work for me in that I can get that pushed sound with the wide switch engaged and winding the master volume up to 2 o’clock.

What really surprised me was how good the TC Nova sounded wired up in stereo as described earlier. It beat out a Full fat helix, a helix effects and a Fractal fx8. 

I’m really keen to try this Nova System thing now. It was hard to decide between the D and G model. The D20 came up at the right time so that’s what decided it. I’d love to try a G20 to see which I prefer.

thomasw88

I'm kinda going down the same rabbit hole..

I'm on the stomp at the moment , and eyeing up the TN captor X, headrush/GT1000 next...  Particularly keen to try the Captor X..

I',m going to go into a rehearsal studio  next week and see if I can get the stomp to  sound as good  as my Hotrod deluxe iv, which works perfectly for me as a pedal platform.  Appreciate it's not a particularly fancy amp but I love stomp boxes and I like the clean on the amp.

 If I can do that then next would be to see if I can get a patch to do a good crunch sound.  

firepaulmusic

thomasw88 said:

I'm kinda going down the same rabbit hole..

I'm on the stomp at the moment , and eyeing up the TN captor X, headrush/GT1000 next...  Particularly keen to try the Captor X..

I',m going to go into a rehearsal studio  next week and see if I can get the stomp to  sound as good  as my Hotrod deluxe iv, which works perfectly for me as a pedal platform.  Appreciate it's not a particularly fancy amp but I love stomp boxes and I like the clean on the amp.

 If I can do that then next would be to see if I can get a patch to do a good crunch sound.  

I thought the Captor X with a Mesa Mk5:25 would be a great little direct rig...

thomasw88

firepaulmusic said:

thomasw88 said:

I'm kinda going down the same rabbit hole..

I'm on the stomp at the moment , and eyeing up the TN captor X, headrush/GT1000 next...  Particularly keen to try the Captor X..

I',m going to go into a rehearsal studio  next week and see if I can get the stomp to  sound as good  as my Hotrod deluxe iv, which works perfectly for me as a pedal platform.  Appreciate it's not a particularly fancy amp but I love stomp boxes and I like the clean on the amp.

 If I can do that then next would be to see if I can get a patch to do a good crunch sound.  

I thought the Captor X with a Mesa Mk5:25 would be a great little direct rig...

But you sold it?

What was the attenuator like?  The one thing putting me off.  Having a variable attenuator would have made it so more usable.

firepaulmusic

thomasw88 said:

firepaulmusic said:

thomasw88 said:

I'm kinda going down the same rabbit hole..

I'm on the stomp at the moment , and eyeing up the TN captor X, headrush/GT1000 next...  Particularly keen to try the Captor X..

I',m going to go into a rehearsal studio  next week and see if I can get the stomp to  sound as good  as my Hotrod deluxe iv, which works perfectly for me as a pedal platform.  Appreciate it's not a particularly fancy amp but I love stomp boxes and I like the clean on the amp.

 If I can do that then next would be to see if I can get a patch to do a good crunch sound.  

I thought the Captor X with a Mesa Mk5:25 would be a great little direct rig...

But you sold it?

What was the attenuator like?  The one thing putting me off.  Having a variable attenuator would have made it so more usable.

Actually I returned it within 30 days as it proved to me that the Two Notes software worked really well, I realised that the Revv D20 was a neater solution than having a separate amp and attenuator. The Captor X is the most cost effective way to get into it if you are happy with your amp and pedals...

firepaulmusic

Update - played a small festival on Sunday, first time out with the Kemper. Used my Redsound for stage monitoring. Got to say I loved every minute, the sounds were great, just like any quality valve amp I’ve ever played. I was able to wind the volume up a bit so that probably helped as well. 

NelsonP

So Kemper beats Revv D20, Marshall Jubilee+ two notes captor , Helix, Iridium and Atomic Amplifire? Must be good!

firepaulmusic

NelsonP said:

So Kemper beats Revv D20, Marshall Jubilee+ two notes captor , Helix, Iridium and Atomic Amplifire? Must be good!

For me yes. Helix was a non-starter as far as amp tones goes. Iridium was great but the UI was fiddly. D20 needed pedals, couldn’t be bothered going that way. Marshall and TN Captor X was great and will possibly go that way again some time. 

Wazmeister

Yes, Ive found the Kemper the best of the bunch too...

NelsonP

New neural thingy looks good in the Andertons vid....
But then so did every other modeller when they did videos on them.

firepaulmusic

NelsonP said:

New neural thingy looks good in the Andertons vid....
But then so did every other modeller when they did videos on them.

To me it doesn’t look as if it will be as flexible for live gigs as the Kemper. If the sounds were so much better it may be worth a look but I doubt it’ll be that much better than Kemper...

spir4L

NelsonP said:

New neural thingy looks good in the Andertons vid....
But then so did every other modeller when they did videos on them.

Exactly