What Turntable Do You Use To Play Your Records On ?

Grumpyrocker

Man, £500 for a little needle. Would love to know how much they cost to make. 

richman6100

Michell Orbe SE here.

steveledzep

Grumpyrocker said:

Man, £500 for a little needle. Would love to know how much they cost to make. 

I guess you're referring to my post ?  I'd love to know too.

£500 for a quality MC cartridge is at low budget level, up to and beyond £10k is possible .  Trouble is, once you've become accustomed to the sound, it's difficult to lower your standards.
Vast majority of my records are from the 1970s, so there isn't much of an option really.  Some were released on cd in the 80s, but the quality is mostly dire.

freakboy1610

Nad 5120 that I bought in 1987. It's had a new cartridge but still works perfectly fine. 

viz

Grumpyrocker said:

Man, £500 for a little needle. Would love to know how much they cost to make. 

I think they cost quite a bit in labour. Maybe not 10k! But for example you can buy a 250 quid cartridridge and get the diamond and cantelever upgraded by Expert Stylus for an extra 300 quid. The process is quite laborious - you can see videos of similar builds on youtube (there’s one of Van den Hul doing one).

Though I agree, it’s definitely a luxury item with very small orders, and you’re paying for the experience of a tiny number of experts. I suppose it’s a bit like having guitar lessons with someone well-known - 500 quid wouldn’t buy you much.

i do know that retipping a cartridge with a “paratrace” diamond (which has a much better profile to the groove so protects your records and sounds incredible) costs like 250, whereas reattaching an existing diamond is around 100, so the diamond itself is pretty pricey. 

Romain

Any mid-budget recommendations for a newbie who is keen to purchase one? 

steveledzep

Romain said:

Any mid-budget recommendations for a newbie who is keen to purchase one? 

Rega Planar 2 or 3 with Rega RB250 or RB300 arm is where I'd start.  Good, solid, reliable engineering.  They hold their value though, so not cheap.
Something like this:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rega-Planar-3-Turntable-with-RB300-Arm/264980082669?hash=item3db20b2fed:g:PXgAAOSwJX5f20Rg
(nowt to do with me)

TheMarlin

Alterlifeson said:

TheMarlin said:

Alterlifeson said:

Pro-Ject Debut Carbon here. Mid range but suits me perfectly. Might go for the 2M blue as an upgrade in the near future.

Don’t get a 2M blue. I’ve had one, it’s ok, but for the same money you can get a Nagaoka MP200, which kicks the 2M Blue in the ass all day long. It’s a phenomenal cart for the money. 

I’d even take a Nagoaka MP100 over the 2M Blue. 

Thanks for the info. I had been recommended the blue as it is a simple drop in replacement for the red but I will look into the MP200 if it would be a more significant upgrade.

If you want a simple option, the blue is fine. 

It is easier than installing the Nagoaka.  The stylus is hard to see under the body, so getting the alignment correct can be a pain in you don’t have a decent setup cartridge alignment protractor. 

TheMarlin

UnclePsychosis said:

I mean, don't get me wrong I still buy several dozen vinyl records every year but every time one of these threads pops up I can't get this cartoon out of my head :-D

https://www.newyorker.com/cartoon/a19180

This is my favourite 

roberty

viz said:

Grumpyrocker said:

Man, £500 for a little needle. Would love to know how much they cost to make. 

I think they cost quite a bit in labour. Maybe not 10k! But for example you can buy a 250 quid cartridridge and get the diamond and cantelever upgraded by Expert Stylus for an extra 300 quid. The process is quite laborious - you can see videos of similar builds on youtube (there’s one of Van den Hul doing one).

Though I agree, it’s definitely a luxury item with very small orders, and you’re paying for the experience of a tiny number of experts. I suppose it’s a bit like having guitar lessons with someone well-known - 500 quid wouldn’t buy you much.

i do know that retipping a cartridge with a “paratrace” diamond (which has a much better profile to the groove so protects your records and sounds incredible) costs like 250, whereas reattaching an existing diamond is around 100, so the diamond itself is pretty pricey. 

Cutting and attaching the diamond is a non-trivial process. More expensive cartridges have more complicated diamond shapes with higher tolerances, and more esoteric materials in the cantilever and body. Cheaper cartridges have the diamond glued in, more expensive ones have "nude" diamonds which are shoved into a tiny hole in the cantilever with no adhesive. Plus these days with them being a niche product there is no economy of scale like there once was. I do agree though that £500 is eye watering bordering on insane, speaking as someone who has spent this and is likely to again lol  

TheMarlin

steveledzep said:

Romain said:

Any mid-budget recommendations for a newbie who is keen to purchase one? 

Rega Planar 2 or 3 with Rega RB250 or RB300 arm is where I'd start.  Good, solid, reliable engineering.  They hold their value though, so not cheap.
Something like this:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rega-Planar-3-Turntable-with-RB300-Arm/264980082669?hash=item3db20b2fed:g:PXgAAOSwJX5f20Rg
(nowt to do with me)

Cheaper option, is keep an eye out for a used NAD 533 on eBay. Same deck as the RP2, but with an MDF platter, and a Goldring Elektra cartridge. 

I’ve got two in my garage, paid less than £100 for both on eBay. As they stand, they’re fine decks, but both mine are extensively modded.  One is a gift fot a friend,the other for my daughter. Both waiting for lockdown to end so I can install along with corresponding Hifi system. 

The Goldring Elektra is one of my favourite budget carts. It’s not actually made by Goldring, it’s made by Nagoaka for Goldring to a Nagoaka design. It’s very close sounding to the Nagoaka MP100, so her high praise from me. 

TheMarlin

Grumpyrocker said:

Man, £500 for a little needle. Would love to know how much they cost to make. 

It’s all relative. Some people pay thousands for an R8, and I see little reason why you would do that, when you can get a Vintage AFD model for under £200 lightly used. 

If you ears can appreciate the difference, and you have the funds to spend, and you enjoy the results, more power to you. 

roberty

+1 for Nagaoka too, they are fantastic cartridges

sweepy

This thread is giving me terrible HiFi Gas, you terrible people

the_jaffa

sweepy said:

This thread is giving me terrible HiFi Gas, you terrible people

I have an on/off relationship with an LP12 forum on Facebook. That really is terrible for my hifi gas. I've started thinking that a £750 cartridge that I needed a new phono stage for and a £750 main bearing for my deck are actually justifiable things.

Bet I'll barely be able to tell the difference if I do get them too.

viz

the_jaffa said:

sweepy said:

This thread is giving me terrible HiFi Gas, you terrible people

I have an on/off relationship with an LP12 forum on Facebook. That really is terrible for my hifi gas. I've started thinking that a £750 cartridge that I needed a new phono stage for and a £750 main bearing for my deck are actually justifiable things.

Bet I'll barely be able to tell the difference if I do get them too.

Nothing wrong with spending big bucks on getting the right placebo!

the_jaffa

viz said:

the_jaffa said:

sweepy said:

This thread is giving me terrible HiFi Gas, you terrible people

I have an on/off relationship with an LP12 forum on Facebook. That really is terrible for my hifi gas. I've started thinking that a £750 cartridge that I needed a new phono stage for and a £750 main bearing for my deck are actually justifiable things.

Bet I'll barely be able to tell the difference if I do get them too.

Nothing wrong with spending big bucks on getting the right placebo!

That pretty much sums it up really.

Diminishing, if evident at all, returns

roberty

TheMarlin said:

Grumpyrocker said:

Man, £500 for a little needle. Would love to know how much they cost to make. 

It’s all relative. Some people pay thousands for an R8, and I see little reason why you would do that, when you can get a Vintage AFD model for under £200 lightly used. 

If you ears can appreciate the difference, and you have the funds to spend, and you enjoy the results, more power to you. 

That is true, turntable cartridges are one place where you do get objectively better performance for your money. Not so much in hifi electronics or guitars

strumjoughlamps

Project Debut Carbon for me with 2M Blue and Acrylic-it upgrades.

2M blue is a simple upgrade and well worth it IMO.

roberty

the_jaffa said:

viz said:

the_jaffa said:

sweepy said:

This thread is giving me terrible HiFi Gas, you terrible people

I have an on/off relationship with an LP12 forum on Facebook. That really is terrible for my hifi gas. I've started thinking that a £750 cartridge that I needed a new phono stage for and a £750 main bearing for my deck are actually justifiable things.

Bet I'll barely be able to tell the difference if I do get them too.

Nothing wrong with spending big bucks on getting the right placebo!

That pretty much sums it up really.

Diminishing, if evident at all, returns

You could get some decent room treatment for that money