The Definition Of Punk.

breakstuff

Can a band not considered punk still be classed as 'punk'.

As someone who grew up listening to the Pistols as a ten year old in the late seventies, and still class them as one of my top five favourite bands of all time, they where always the absolute definition of what punk was, and should be. Is punk more than just and image or sound, and can if be retrospectively be assigned to other genres /sounds that fall outside of the recognised definition.

Now forgetting said accepted definitions, what are your favourite non punk 'punk,' performances.

I'll nominate this performance of The Bends by Radiohead.

Deadman

To me, it’s a song you can comfortably pogo to. It obviously has to rock, but not ‘be’ rock (as it also needs an aggressive edginess to it) and generally comes from a band with ‘punk’ as one of its influences. 

RHCP, PEARL JAM and QOTSA generally fit the bill.

https://youtu.be/g3CTuGLgG5M

https://youtu.be/D5MU7ywlioo

https://youtu.be/dOsmG-sufNc

Kilgore

The Pixies.

 

slacker

Punk was two things. It was music by the sex pistols and the clash. It was an attitude of beg borrow or steal some basic gear and just play.

I was a teenager in 76 and wasn't a punk but was inspired to pick up an instrument or two.

axisus

breakstuff said:

I'll nominate this performance of The Bends by Radiohead.

I don't like radiohead, so no vested interest personally, but assuming that is supposed to be a link, it isn't working. Video links get lost if you re edit your post, you have to put the link back in again.

breakstuff

axisus said:

breakstuff said:

I'll nominate this performance of The Bends by Radiohead.

I don't like radiohead, so no vested interest personally, but assuming that is supposed to be a link, it isn't working. Video links get lost if you re edit your post, you have to put the link back in again.

Sorted, thanks @axisus ;

ronnyb

Green day, basket case. Released in 1994 punk was long gone.

Hurling_Fruitmig

breakstuff said:

Can a band not considered punk still be classed as 'punk'.

As someone who grew up listening to the Pistols as a ten year old in the late seventies, and still class them as one of my top five favourite bands of all time, they where always the absolute definition of what punk was, and should be. Is punk more than just and image or sound, and can if be retrospectively be assigned to other genres /sounds that fall outside of the recognised definition.

Now forgetting said accepted definitions, what are your favourite non punk 'punk,' performances.

I'll nominate this performance of The Bends by Radiohead.

Interesting thoughts. Mrs F asked the same question after we watched a bit of Radiohead performing at Glastonbury last night. I thought it was an ecumenical matter.

merlin

If the Punk band is British and they sing with an American accent.... instantly not punk.

slacker said:

Punk was two things. It was music by the sex pistols and the clash. 

And The Slits. And Penetration. And Subway Sect. And Crass. And Siouxsie and the Banshees, The Adverts, Anti Nowhere League, The Damned... The list goes on and on. 

Rocker

As I understand it, punk was more or less confined to London, Dublin and Glasgow.  There were a number of punk bands from Dublin, The Boomtown Rats being the best known.  Attitude and a rebellious nature combined with irreverence for the music business defines punk in my opinion.

EricTheWeary

I do think that Punk was of it’s era and past a certain point nothing new was punk anymore. My son ended up in some online debate about wether Billy Eilish is punk and well no she isn’t. She’s borrowed a bit of the look. If I put an antimacassar on my sofa I don’t become a Victorian. That dream catcher from Aldi isn’t going to make me spiritually connected to the great white buffalo. Punk wasn't a musical style per se, you can't show me the punk chord progression. 

Rocker said:

As I understand it, punk was more or less confined to London, Dublin and Glasgow.  There were a number of punk bands from Dublin, The Boomtown Rats being the best known.  Attitude and a rebellious nature combined with irreverence for the music business defines punk in my opinion.

Bob Geldof makes an argument that Punk was essentially Irish. But there were scenes in many places - the more they are footnotes in the history of punk possibly the more punk they actually were. 

merlin

Rocker said:

As I understand it, punk was more or less confined to London, Dublin and Glasgow.  There were a number of punk bands from Dublin, The Boomtown Rats being the best known.  Attitude and a rebellious nature combined with irreverence for the music business defines punk in my opinion.

I would argue that The Boomtown Rats weren't Punk at all. Stiff Little Fingers on the other hand... (see what I did there?) 

JezWynd

This...

What you choose to do with those chords is up to you.

axisus

EricTheWeary said:

 That dream catcher from Aldi isn’t going to make me spiritually connected to the great white buffalo. 

[bins dreamcatcher]

joneve

merlin said:

If the Punk band is British and they sing with an American accent.... instantly not punk.

Like Neck Deep? 

Still, good band with some catchy songs 

merlin

joneve said:

merlin said:

If the Punk band is British and they sing with an American accent.... instantly not punk.

Like Neck Deep? 

Still, good band with some catchy songs 

They are pretty far away from any idea I've ever had of punk.
Catchy and highly mainstream for sure.
Challenging, discordant, angry, rebellious? Not even close. 

russpm

Rocker said:

As I understand it, punk was more or less confined to London, Dublin and Glasgow.  There were a number of punk bands from Dublin, The Boomtown Rats being the best known.  Attitude and a rebellious nature combined with irreverence for the music business defines punk in my opinion.

My understanding is that it was inspired to some degree by the New York Dolls....

russpm

merlin said:

Rocker said:

As I understand it, punk was more or less confined to London, Dublin and Glasgow.  There were a number of punk bands from Dublin, The Boomtown Rats being the best known.  Attitude and a rebellious nature combined with irreverence for the music business defines punk in my opinion.

I would argue that The Boomtown Rats weren't Punk at all. Stiff Little Fingers on the other hand... (see what I did there?) 

I agree with this. The Rats were know as’ plastic’ punks and didn’t have much credibility on the punk scene in England. 

Neill

Defining any musical genre is fraught with problems, - what was the first Rock & Roll record...?  That's a question guaranteed to stimulate strong opinions.

The first time I heard the term "Punk Rock" was about 1974, and it was used to describe a certain sound, largely the product of American "garage" bands.  Folk often cite songs like The Count Five's "Psychotic Reaction" as examples.  It sounds nothing like the Sex Pistols or The Damned of course, but it does remind you of the sort of music that was beginning to emerge from what we now call "Pub Rock" bands, I well remember Dr Feelgood in the early days being labelled Punk Rock.

The earliest use of the term is usually taken as 1972 and attributed to Lenny Kaye, who is probably best know for being Patti Smith's lead guitarist, but he had a wide range of talents and was a prolific rock music journalist/writer.

Quite when or why the term became synonymous with the emerging UK scene in the late 70's I don't know but for most of us around at the time The Ramones were the definition of Punk. 

Personally I don't think it means anything any more, in fact by 1977 most of us preferred "New Wave" to describe the vast spectrum of bands that were kicking out the old guard, along with Bob Harris and good riddance it was too.   

ICBM

russpm said:

The Rats were know as’ plastic’ punks and didn’t have much credibility on the punk scene in England. 

Like how Blondie were looked down on by 'proper' punks in New York...

Neither of them were punk, they were New Wave. Both bands wrote great songs that have stood the test of time better than most of the 'proper' punks though, so who cares?

Woodenhead

Neill said:

... most of us around at the time The Ramones were the definition of Punk.

Yeah, the term Punk makes me think of The Ramones, short, straight to the point, uptempo and simple riffs.

I always thought Metallica's St. Anger would've made a great punk album had the songs been ~3 minutes long.