New car (electric) - lease or buy?

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We're in the fortunate position to be considering a new car and want to go for an EV or not bother at all. We've tried a few things and have got down to a couple of vehicles - Nissan Leaf N-Connecta 40kWh or an MG ZS EV Exclusive. The MG is a surprisingly nice car.

Anyway, it seems that both are very similar prices for PCP or lease, despite the MG having 0% PCP finance it seems the residual value (balloon payment) after 4 years is lower than that of the Nissan so the monthly payments work out almost identical.

Essentially, we're looking at a £2-4k desposit followed by £275-£300 for PCP, or £250-£275 for a lease, both ofer 4 years.
The MG would cost £9,500 balloon, the Nissan would be £11,500.

The question is should we lease or buy? Leasing is going to be £1,200 cheaper over the 4 years (roughly speaking 48x£25). But with PCP we'd be able to buy the car at the end for a guaranteed price which could be a bargain. Especially with the MG which is 0% finance.

I think leasing looks like a waste of money, but my boss who has been in the car industry for many years thinks it's the only sensible option, based on his belief that the battery tech will be old hat and undesirable so may as well save the cash. He also says not to buy an MG.
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  • IamnobodyIamnobody Frets: 6887
    I agree with your boss, I’ve been leasing for 5 years now and hope to never own a car again.
    Previously known as stevebrum
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  • roundthebendroundthebend Frets: 1129
    Iamnobody said:
    I agree with your boss, I’ve been leasing for 5 years now and hope to never own a car again.
    Why so? Just keeps the cost down and if you always want a new car then you're never worried by that final payment?
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  • munckeemunckee Frets: 12255
    Iamnobody said:
    I agree with your boss, I’ve been leasing for 5 years now and hope to never own a car again.
    Me too, I don't want to buy a 4 year old car at the end of the deal which has been driven badly by me!
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  • FunkfingersFunkfingers Frets: 14322
    Owning a car outright seems to be a thing of the past. Nobody ever finishes paying for their current car. They just pay monthly instalments ad infinitum.

    The market offers two entry points: Brand new or approved used. Either way, the business model works on customers not keeping any vehicle for more than three years.

    Any semi-presentable vehicle approaching its seventh birthday will be accepted by a dealership as down payment on a new car but, once your back is turned, it will be swiftly consigned to the independent trading sector.

    I think leasing looks like a waste of money but my boss, who has been in the car industry for many years, thinks it's the only sensible option, based on his belief that the battery tech will be old hat and undesirable so may as well save the cash. He also says not to buy an MG.
    I agree with your boss.

    Resale or trade-in value on a Nissan is always going to be better than an MIC MG.

    Buying a battery powered car in 2021 has a direct parallel with buying a computer (especially Apple). The technology is improving all the time but, it is going to be superseded before you are ready to dispose of it.

    Of necessity, charging rates, storage capacities and maximum ranges will increase.

    My father almost went electric with his most recent change of car. He decided against because a round trip to the nearest major hospital was right on the limit of the car's range. Factor in traffic delays, heating, air-con or headlamps and it would have been necessary to recharge somewhere along the route. 
    Be seeing you.
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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 16253
                      Funkfingers said:
    Owning a car outright seems to be a thing of the past. Nobody ever finishes paying for their current car. They just pay monthly instalments ad infinitum.

    The market offers two entry points: Brand new or approved used. Either way, the business model works on customers not keeping any vehicle for more than three years.

    Any semi-presentable vehicle approaching its seventh birthday will be accepted by a dealership as down payment on a new car but, once your back is turned, it will be swiftly consigned to the independent trading sector.

    I think leasing looks like a waste of money but my boss, who has been in the car industry for many years, thinks it's the only sensible option, based on his belief that the battery tech will be old hat and undesirable so may as well save the cash. He also says not to buy an MG.
    I agree with your boss.

    Resale or trade-in value on a Nissan is always going to be better than an MIC MG.

    Buying a battery powered car in 2021 has a direct parallel with buying a computer (especially Apple). The technology is improving all the time but, it is going to be superseded before you are ready to dispose of it.

    Of necessity, charging rates, storage capacities and maximum ranges will increase.

     
    I started typing an answer but really most of that ^. Even if you buy this one I'd almost guarantee that you won't the next one along. Because the way it is going nobody will be buying new vehicles in 6 years time apart from more specialist ones ( wacky sports car, camper vans, etc). 
    Tipton is a small fishing village in the borough of Sandwell. 
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 24601

    I'd go the lease route. With the likes of Jaguar, Renault, VW and BMW going all electric by 2030  the battery tech is going to improve exponentially. If you buy now you could be left with a car that’s worth virtually nothing after five years. If you lease can can chop the car in for a newer model in say three years that will probably charge faster and have a greater range.







    Remember, it's easier to criticise than create!
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  • TheMadMickTheMadMick Frets: 239
    I wouldn't buy just now for a number of reasons - mainly risk reduction:

    1. Battery technology is starting the plateau but won't be essentially flat for another couple or more years
    2. Battery life is not a given just yet
    3. Resale values are far from cartain
    4. If you make a decent offer at the end of the contract (should you want the vehicle) the lessor will almost certainly entertain it.

    This from someone who prefers to buy his cars.
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  • IamnobodyIamnobody Frets: 6887
    Iamnobody said:
    I agree with your boss, I’ve been leasing for 5 years now and hope to never own a car again.
    Why so? Just keeps the cost down and if you always want a new car then you're never worried by that final payment?

    I did my time running around in second hand motors of various quality and age. I’m not handy on the spanners so just got sick of the inevitable unexpected repair bills and age related shit.

    Leasing just brings it all down to a fixed monthly payment that’s affordable and the convenience of having a reliable, safe and new car. I don’t have to think about tax or MOT - just insurance and 1 service. And no asset means no hassle of selling it at the end. 

    I accept it doesn’t suit everyone but it works for me. I’m a low mileage user as well which keeps cost sensible. 

    I’m not a car lover, it’s transport so I shop on price and go for a decent deal over brand and colour etc. 

    Most of the ones I’ve taken are comparable to the depreciation hit on buying the same car and keeping it for the same length of time. I’ve had Hyundai, Skoda and a BMW.

    I’m not loaded so my modest savings also stay put in the offset mortgage account where I want them to be.

    You've said the lease works out cheaper for you so that’d be decision made for me - and as others have said a 4 year old EV isn’t something you’d really want to own. Go for the Leaf lease.

    Previously known as stevebrum
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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11413
    Fretwired said:

    I'd go the lease route. With the likes of Jaguar, Renault, VW and BMW going all electric by 2030  the battery tech is going to improve exponentially. If you buy now you could be left with a car that’s worth virtually nothing after five years. If you lease can can chop the car in for a newer model in say three years that will probably charge faster and have a greater range.







    The car might be capable of that, but the charging infrastructure won't.

    There will be even more demand for lithium in three years. That will put upward pressure on prices.  You might find the final payment on the PCP looks very good three years down the line against the cost of a new car.

    Even if the cars available in three years time are better, it would still be cheaper in the long run to take out a bank loan and keep driving this car than replacing it with a new car.  Just buy it outright and run it into the ground.
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  • FretwiredFretwired Frets: 24601
    crunchman said:

    The car might be capable of that, but the charging infrastructure won't.

    There will be even more demand for lithium in three years. That will put upward pressure on prices.  You might find the final payment on the PCP looks very good three years down the line against the cost of a new car.

    Even if the cars available in three years time are better, it would still be cheaper in the long run to take out a bank loan and keep driving this car than replacing it with a new car.  Just buy it outright and run it into the ground.

    There's lithium to be mined in Cornwall so the UK may benefit. China will just dig it out of the sea - so much for the eco friendly credentials of electric.

    The charging infrastructure is improving and rapid charging is now available. It's not an issue at the moment as there are so few electric cars on the roads. If everyone went out tomorrow and bought an electric vehicle the National Grid would collapse. Luckily that's impossible.

    From the MG website:

    What is rapid charging?

    There are three different types of charging methods available: slow, fast and rapid. And, as you can guess, rapid charging is currently the fastest way to charge an electric vehicle. It’s worth noting that with most, they’ll only charge your vehicle to 80% rapidly, in order to preserve your car’s battery life, before dropping to a slower pace.

    At the moment, there are two versions of rapid charging: alternating current (AC) which offers more power than fast car chargers at 43kW. The other way is via direct current (DC), with this, it provides DC straight to the car so there’s no need for a converter, allowing the vehicle to be charged at a much faster rate.

    What’s the difference between rapid and fast car chargers?

    Fast car chargers come as two varieties either 7kW – the most popular option found in homes or 22kW – commonly found in supermarkets and shopping centres. 7kW takes between 4 to 6 hours to fully charge, whereas 22kW will take around 1 or 2 hours. Most fast devices will be AC, but a few providers are now creating DC ones too.

    Additionally, the majority of fast car chargers are untethered, meaning the cable isn’t attached to the device, so you can use your own. This can sometimes be more convenient than rapid chargers which have tethered cables, so only vehicles which are compatible with that connector will be able to use that particular device.

    How can I find rapid car chargers?

    Usually you can find rapid chargers at most motorway services, which makes it more convenient than ever. So, whilst you nip in for a cup of coffee or a quick bite to eat, you can leave your car charging and be on the road again in under an hour.

    The best way to find rapid charging points near you is with Zap Map. This handy tool allows you to quickly and easily locate ones near you and they even have a route planner feature – perfect for longer drives if you’re worried about running out of juice.

    At the moment there’s not as many DC rapid chargers when compared to AC, slow and fast car chargers, but this is set to boom with more and more people choosing to go electric.
    Are all cars rapid charging friendly?

    To be able to rapidly charge your car, it’ll need to have rapid charging capabilities. For chargers that use AC, your car will need to have a type 2 connector in order to use one. DC chargers on the other hand use CCS or CHAdeMO connectors, so you’ll only be able to use one of these if your car is compatible.


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  • crunchmancrunchman Frets: 11413
    It will take a lot more than 3 years to get lithium mining in Cornwall up and running on an industrial scale.

    Demand for lithium is going to be higher than supply in the coming years, and the price of batteries (the most expensive bit of an electric car) is likely to go up.
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  • RolandRoland Frets: 8590
    I wouldn't buy just now for a number of reasons - mainly risk reduction ... This from someone who prefers to buy his cars.
    This. EVs is a new product/market. Let someone else take the risk. 

    My father was in the motor trade. We would always buy our cars with 15 to 24 month on the clock, and run them until they became uneconomic. I wouldn’t do that with an EV.
    Tree recycler, and guitarist with  https://www.undercoversband.com/.
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  • chotu495chotu495 Frets: 356
    Leaseloco has a new leaf on 10k pa at £2400 down and £200pcm.

    Likely to be Mg’s on there too.

    If an EV works for you, go for it. Personally, i’d go 3 yrs to avoid the MOT implications, but i’m probably being overcautious.

    Cut your own path. I got bored of hearing “oh, range anxiety”, “how long do the batteries last”. Yawn yawn yawn.

    New car, leased. If you can swallow the £, you’ll never look back  :)
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  • EricTheWearyEricTheWeary Frets: 16253
    chotu495 said:
    Leaseloco has a new leaf on 10k pa at £2400 down and £200pcm.

    Likely to be Mg’s on there too.

    If an EV works for you, go for it. Personally, i’d go 3 yrs to avoid the MOT implications, but i’m probably being overcautious.

    Cut your own path. I got bored of hearing “oh, range anxiety”, “how long do the batteries last”. Yawn yawn yawn.

    New car, leased. If you can swallow the £, you’ll never look back  :)
    Even the lower end ranges are 150 miles and most now greater than that. Probably not many of us who drive more than 150 miles without stopping twenty minutes for a pee and a coffee let alone on a regular basis. And if you do you won’t be buying an EV. 

    Tipton is a small fishing village in the borough of Sandwell. 
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  • Axe_meisterAxe_meister Frets: 4612
    Personally I would lease god knows where the electric car market will be in 3 years time, new battery technology may become available or there may be a breakthrough in fuel cell technology. Electric car technology is still very young. You could end up in the same situation we did with diesel. Great one year then crap the next. I'd hate to be sitting on a car that suddenly depreciates massively because technology has moved on.
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  • MikeCMikeC Frets: 447
    anyone suggest a good EV leasing company then? 
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  • jellyrolljellyroll Frets: 3073
    I’d buy. Then you can change in two, three, four or ten years.  Whatever suits you. 

    Resale value MAY drop if technology moves on. But you might decide to keep it for 10 years and have great value out of it. 
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  • WazmeisterWazmeister Frets: 9445
    edited July 2021
    PCPs usually work best over 3 years.

    The advantage of them is a warranteed car with no disposal worries at the end, providing you havent exceeded the mileage. The optimun deal with a pcp is low mileage and low deposit.

    Your deal of £2k - £4k deposit is a poor one, as you would need to find that again in 3/4 years time to go for a similar dEal in the future.

    Avoid the MG as that will bE worth no where near £9500 in 4 years time.

    I was a business manager in the tradE in a previous life, and used to structure PCPS, so im happy to help.


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  • LegionreturnsLegionreturns Frets: 7965
    Have you actually tried buying atm? 

    I'm currently trying to get a van and none of the dealers can get hold of vehicles due to the computer chip shortage and factory shutdowns. 

    I'm looking at April next year regardless of buying / leasing. Very few companies have any stock.

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  • roundthebendroundthebend Frets: 1129
    Have you actually tried buying atm? 

    I'm currently trying to get a van and none of the dealers can get hold of vehicles due to the computer chip shortage and factory shutdowns. 

    I'm looking at April next year regardless of buying / leasing. Very few companies have any stock.
    That's definitely a potential issue.
    MG say they can supply in 6 weeks in any spec and colour. 
    Nissan are nearer to Xmas. 
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