How big a factor is resonance in what makes a good electric?

poopot

Said it before will say it again…

none of it matters for shit once the drummer starts hitting his shinny bits… and no one listening cares!!!!

v12cat

WezV said:

here is a comparison of a wood and aluminum guitar neck as one example that disproves the first statement, but supports the second.  Slight, but definite differences.  

The possible difference in scale length is  much more likely to affecting the tone to be honest, as that directly affects pickup placement on the string. This IS measurable and scientifically predictable. 

From what I can see the ally neck is 24.75", the T60 25.5".

WezV

v12cat said:

WezV said:

here is a comparison of a wood and aluminum guitar neck as one example that disproves the first statement, but supports the second.  Slight, but definite differences.  

The possible difference in scale length is  much more likely to affecting the tone to be honest, as that directly affects pickup placement on the string. This IS measurable and scientifically predictable. 

From what I can see the ally neck is 24.75", the T60 25.5".

scale length certainly would cause a differnce.   Are you sure these are different scales though, did i miss it in the vid? 

v12cat

WezV said:

scale length certainly would cause a differnce.   Are you sure these are different scales though, did i miss it in the vid? 

It wasn't in the vid but from what I can see the EGC500, which has that neck is 24.75" and the T60 is listed at 25.5".  Obviously the ally neck in the video could be longer than that but it would certainly account for a noticeable tone difference if it were a standard EGC500 neck.

I'm not BTW getting involved in the tone wood debate, just an observation on this particular comparison.

I've asked in the video comments. 

WezV

v12cat said:

WezV said:

scale length certainly would cause a differnce.   Are you sure these are different scales though, did i miss it in the vid? 

It wasn't in the vid but from what I can see the EGC500, which has that neck is 24.75" and the T60 is listed at 25.5".  Obviously the ally neck in the video could be longer than that but it would certainly account for a noticeable tone difference if it were a standard EGC500 neck.

I'm not BTW getting involved in the tone wood debate, just an observation on this particular comparison.

I've asked in the video comments. 

definitely worth checking as I agree scale length would have a more noticeable impact.  I think EGC specifically make these as drop in's for Fender's, with the appropriate scale length.   The EGC 500 neck is a completely different design, it goes all the way to the bridge for one thing.

I would be very surprised if it was a 24.75" scale though. It would certainly render the comparison obsolete, as well as be unlikely to play in tune. 

Unless it was specifically built as a conversion neck, but it doesn't look like one of those to me as they are both 21 fret necks with a similar gap between 21st and end of neck.  24.75" Conversion fender style necks with 21 frets have that last fret sitting nearly on the end of the board... like this  (edit., bad example it had 22frets and an overhang.  point is the spacing on the two necks above looks the same)

dindude

poopot said:

Said it before will say it again…

none of it matters for shit once the drummer starts hitting his shinny bits… and no one listening cares!!!!

I really hate this lazy statement

Offset

dindude said:

poopot said:

Said it before will say it again…

none of it matters for shit once the drummer starts hitting his shinny bits… and no one listening cares!!!!

I really hate this lazy statement

Possibly, but it's fairly accurate :-)

v12cat

WezV said:

Unless it was specifically built as a conversion neck, but it doesn't look like one of those to me as they are both 21 fret necks with a similar gap between 21st and end of neck. 
[....]

... I didn't count the frets so yes, you are probably right!

thegummy

dindude said:

poopot said:

Said it before will say it again…

none of it matters for shit once the drummer starts hitting his shinny bits… and no one listening cares!!!!

I really hate this lazy statement

That's understandable; referring back to an earlier post I made, a "poor" tone or sound quality won't stop good music being enjoyable but good tone can make it even better. And while a lot of people listening might not even notice, some will and appreciate the nice tone if it's there.

It's kind of like the fact that most people who listen to music probably wouldn't appreciate deeply poetic lyrics and there's plenty of good music with shallow lyrics but it's no reason to just throw in the towel and compile a bunch of cliches instead of writing something you find worthwhile.

TrentGuitars

I like them to sound characterful unplugged, I think its a psychological thing.

JezWynd

thegummy said:

Can't help wondering why people are playing their electric guitars unplugged anyway... 

I always play an electric guitar unplugged in music stores. If a guitar sounds and feels good unplugged, then it will work plugged into an amp (ime). Also, being a crap player, I don't need to amplify my failings.

Philly_Q

TrentGuitars said:

I like them to sound characterful unplugged, I think its a psychological thing.

This.  I think if a guitar feels "alive" (stupid word, but I don't know what else to use) then it's more enjoyable to play. 

I don't know how much that translates into the amplified sound, and I don't know if there's any practical difference between "live" and "dead" guitars in a recording or gigging environment - I'm never likely to find out.

As for whether or not there are scientifically measurable differences between guitars made of different woods, or different materials generally, I honestly don't care and I don't understand why people get so worked up about it.  I just buy guitars I like.

Lewy

TrentGuitars said:

I like them to sound characterful unplugged, I think its a psychological thing.

And that’s fine because music is art, not engineering. 

HAL9000

thegummy said:

Can't help wondering why people are playing their electric guitars unplugged anyway... 

First impressions when buying?

TrentGuitars

I play unplugged a lot, always have done, bad habit but I'm sure im not the only one.

thegummy

TrentGuitars said:

I play unplugged a lot, always have done, bad habit but I'm sure im not the only one.

Seeing as you appear to run a guitar company I'm guessing you've been playing for years but for new learners I'd definitely advise against it cause I think it encourages them to always hit the strings quite hard in order to hear it.

Lewy

I play unplugged a lot because I enjoy challenging myself to get different sounds out of the guitar just with my hands. It helps remind me that a lot of what we think of as tone is really attack, vibrato, dynamics, articulation etc

terada

"imagine it was just a different guitar from the same model line of Les Pauls (so any differences in resonances weren't due to the design of the body but only to the differences in the actual guitars) and think how much difference in sound there would be"

Wasn't sure whether to post anything as things appear to have gone a bit weird in the thread, but the above speculates over a test I did in 2019. I did it for fun at the time as an excuse to play with a new interface I had.

Originally posted here

3 Gibson reissues, same mic/amp/cable etc etc

Each in the same ballpark, all quite different at least to my ears.



Clean



Lead



Overdrive

poopot

dindude said:

poopot said:

Said it before will say it again…

none of it matters for shit once the drummer starts hitting his shinny bits… and no one listening cares!!!!

I really hate this lazy statement

Don’t be full of hate… life’s too short!…

I get that folk sometimes don’t like the truth but there it is… it’s not a lazy statement… dumbed down yes… but not lazy…

the fact is that when amplified an electric guitars acoustic tone is irrelevant… even more so once you whack the signal through a few pedals and turn the amps volume up…

In a live/band situation the acoustic tone is further negated once the drummer starts hitting his cymbals… the high frequency persuasive crack will instantly start to degrade anyone’s ability to hear certain frequencies… and the cymbals fundamental frequencies will cover a good chunk of the guitars fundamental frequencies… after a few songs in, no one in the band or audience will be able to tell if your guitar is made from wood or papier-mâché… let alone if it is your most resonant instrument…

now, Deirdre and Dave down the front, whether you are in the dog and duck or Wembley stadium have just come out for a bit of a dance and a good time… they care so little about your “tone” they prolly won’t even recognise what shape your guitar is…

Don’t sweat the small stuff… play your guitar as if it was your last moment on earth… harness that and your band mates, audience and everyone else will be stoked!!!!

Hopefully that’s less lazy!…

guitarjack66

TeleMaster said:

I always think of the silly tonewood debate when listening to Prince play that plastic see through symbol guitar of his. He always sounds immense, and it just puts the whole thing into perspective for me. 

If Prince was so good,why did he make such crap songs?