How to square off the end of fretboard on a kit neck that isn't quite right?

Cano

So, it's exactly the same fret distances  as my other completed LP kit so I'm basing my measurements off that guitar. 

Devil#20

If you are confident using one then a paring chisel is the correct tool for the job. It keeps all the edges square and sharp which sanding or sawing will never do. I you're not confident just take it to a luthier and he should be able to sort it in 2 minutes once you've marked out your waste material. Your chisel should be able to shave the ball hairs off a gnat without blood loss. 

Cano

Devil#20 said:

If you are confident using one then a paring chisel is the correct tool for the job. It keeps all the edges square and sharp which sanding or sawing will never do. I you're not confident just take it to a luthier and he should be able to sort it in 2 minutes once you've marked out your waste material. Your chisel should be able to shave the ball hairs off a gnat without blood loss. 

I have actually emailed the luthier I've used before for some advice on this, but may just ask if he can do exactly what you've said. 

Cano

Hmmm, so today I removed the first fret as it wasn't seating no matter what did. What I found is that the tang on the bass side hadn't been trimmed at all for the bound board.

It also has allowed me to measure the distance from the nut shelf to the fret slot and now....... 

It looks straight, same measurement on both sides of the board. I think the 1st fret was the issue all along, not the fretboard. 

Is that even possible??? 

andy_k

Measure to 2nd fret? Measure nut shelf? (this looks parallel on your first pics )
Can't really explain why the fret would create this much variance.

WezV

If it wasn't seated fully, and tilted more on one side it makes sense

ICBM

Cano said:

Hmmm, so today I removed the first fret as it wasn't seating no matter what did. What I found is that the tang on the bass side hadn't been trimmed at all for the bound board.

It also has allowed me to measure the distance from the nut shelf to the fret slot and now....... 

It looks straight, same measurement on both sides of the board. I think the 1st fret was the issue all along, not the fretboard. 

Is that even possible??? 

No, I don't think so. Look at the first pic here again - the nut is clearly not at right angles to the centreline of the fingerboard. If you scroll the pic up and down, you can actually use the top of the window to check the angles of the frets and the nut! The 2nd fret is perfectly square, the 1st is quite a bit off, and the nut is worse... it's not even close to square on the neck.

Devil#20

ICBM said:

Cano said:

Hmmm, so today I removed the first fret as it wasn't seating no matter what did. What I found is that the tang on the bass side hadn't been trimmed at all for the bound board.

It also has allowed me to measure the distance from the nut shelf to the fret slot and now....... 

It looks straight, same measurement on both sides of the board. I think the 1st fret was the issue all along, not the fretboard. 

Is that even possible??? 

No, I don't think so. Look at the first pic here again - the nut is clearly not at right angles to the centreline of the fingerboard. If you scroll the pic up and down, you can actually use the top of the window to check the angles of the frets and the nut! The 2nd fret is perfectly square, the 1st is quite a bit off, and the nut is worse... it's not even close to square on the neck.

In that case, as Elivis would say - Return to Sender. 

Cano

ICBM said:
No, I don't think so. Look at the first pic here again - the nut is clearly not at right angles to the centreline of the fingerboard. If you scroll the pic up and down, you can actually use the top of the window to check the angles of the frets and the nut! The 2nd fret is perfectly square, the 1st is quite a bit off, and the nut is worse... it's not even close to square on the neck.

While that 1st pic does exaggerate the issue as the nut was just loosely placed, I think you're right, but the amount by which it's off is so small that in some lighting it looks fine which is helping me to try and wish the problem away.

This is the amount that needs levelling and I'm sure the short side is the correct length.

Cano

New calipers arrived today. The short side looks to be bang on 35.28mm distance to the 1st fret, the long side is measuring 35.55mm.  It's a tiny difference, but it's visible and it needs straightening. The amount it so small that sanding seems to be the only feasible solution.

I've measured the other fret distances and they match those on the Stewmac calculator for a 628.65mm scale length (24.75")

What do I do to make sure I don't touch the short side, as I cannot risk that getting any shorter than it's current length. I need a guide, something like a 12" sanding block that I can clamp to the board but metal so that it won't get sanded out of shape by an imbecilic like me.

abw1989

Could you try sneaking up on the correct measurement using a old school razor blade as a scraper?

Mark the correct square line with the blade first, it should be plenty sharp and thin enough to score a neat line, then flip it and scrape away back to that line. I think you might have a bit more control than with a sanding block.

Cano

Interesting idea. When you suggest a razor blade, do you mean something like a stanley knife blade or are you thinking of something else?

I lined it all up with my sanding block in position to mark the correct line, the amount than needs taking off is tiny. The other issue is that the current end of the board isn't a straight line, but a slight 'S' curve. It may be that a sanding block is needed just to get a true straight edge.

Roland

I find that a sanding block always puts a slight curve on the surface. I’d mark the line, and then carve away the excess with your Stanley knife. Use a new blade.

Devil#20

As I've said above, a paring chisel is the correct tool for this job. One inch wide would be best to give the visual aid of getting everything square. Shave tiny bits off at a time, just like using a wood plane. 

Cano

Devil#20 said:

As I've said above, a paring chisel is the correct tool for this job. One inch wide would be best to give the visual aid of getting everything square. Shave tiny bits off at a time, just like using a wood plane. 

I'm watching Youtube videos right now on paring chisel to see exactly how I could do this. Never used a chisel before, so it's research, research, research before I commit.

Devil#20

Cano said:

Devil#20 said:

As I've said above, a paring chisel is the correct tool for this job. One inch wide would be best to give the visual aid of getting everything square. Shave tiny bits off at a time, just like using a wood plane. 

I'm watching Youtube videos right now on paring chisel to see exactly how I could do this. Never used a chisel before, so it's research, research, research before I commit.

If you're not confident, just take it to a luthier or even a cabinet maker and they'll sort it in a couple of minutes. You'd pare from the edge to the middle to avoid chipping the corner. Whereabout are you? There might be somebody on here could help you sort it out quickly. 

Cano

Devil#20 said:

There might be somebody on here could help you sort it out quickly. 

I'm in Woking, Surrey. If there is someone local that would be amazing

andy_k

Cano said:

ICBM said:
No, I don't think so. Look at the first pic here again - the nut is clearly not at right angles to the centreline of the fingerboard. If you scroll the pic up and down, you can actually use the top of the window to check the angles of the frets and the nut! The 2nd fret is perfectly square, the 1st is quite a bit off, and the nut is worse... it's not even close to square on the neck.

While that 1st pic does exaggerate the issue as the nut was just loosely placed, I think you're right, but the amount by which it's off is so small that in some lighting it looks fine which is helping me to try and wish the problem away.

This is the amount that needs levelling and I'm sure the short side is the correct length.

I'm looking at this pic, and wondering, is the ruler line the amount that needs removing?
Or, is the fretboard correct at the treble side, in which case, the ruler needs to be moved up very slightly.
It is something that I find frustrating, the closer we get to accuracy, the harder it is to achieve.
As I stated earlier, the biggest problem here is holding the piece securely, which makes the actual work so much easier.
I'd have no hesitation attacking that with a chisel, if the neck was held solid, and also, a good sanding block can be used to keep a sharp line, ie-a hard block with sanding material securely attached, not a bit of paper wrapped around a stick.
In the pic, the amount of difference between T and B sides is tiny, if the ruler is just showing a parallel line, if it is the actual material to be removed, it is somewhat trickier.

Cano

The ruler is basically just showing a parallel line. The amount that needs taking off is tiny, really tiny. The treble side is already the correct length.

I can definitely see that the chisel will work, just don't want to spend £40 on a tool I will only use once

Roland

The advice I was given about tools is don’t buy until you need to. Then when you need buy something which will last a lifetime. If you really, really never will use a chisel again in your life then take it to someone who has one, and knows how to use it.