Dulling down a black poly finish .... Help!

barnsleyboy

Hi All,

I've taken a scotchbrite pad to the top of my Black Harley Benton HB-35 in an attempt to dull down the super glossy poly finish. It's getting to where I want it to be, in terms of the feel, but what I want to do is now blacken it up a bit. Does anyone have any suggestions on what I can rub over it to get the blackness back? The scotchbrite has left it looking a bit milky. When I rub the surface with some naptha/ lighter fuel to clean off the sanding residue it gives me exactly the colour, until it evaporates away then it returns to a paler version. I suppose I'm looking for something like the old car back to black product, but a guitar version! I tried a applying some car wax, but it didn't give me the desired colour. Any help would be much appreciated.

impmann

The milkiness is where you have scuffed the top layer up. If you polish that out with something like T-cut, you may get to where you want to be - but equally you may be back to square one.

barnsleyboy

Good call with the T-Cut. I've just tried a patch, and it might just be what I needed. The original finish is really shiny. So much so that any tiny scratches show up big time. I'm not looking to relic the top, just give it a bit more of a used feel.

WezV

I would add some briwax to the pad. Rub it all down again, then buff with a soft cloth.  Should give a nice semi-sheen

barnsleyboy

Cheers @WezV. I've just gone over it with T-Cut, which has darkened it a bit, but I'll pop out later and get myself a tin of briwax. I've been using the scotchbrite pad with an electric detail sander to try to keep the sanding finish consistent across the surface. For the briwax stage should I rub down by hand? or continue with the electric option?

WezV

I do it by hand, but it may work fine on the sander.   The buffing stage after is where it really starts to look (and feel) good

Andyjr1515

WezV said:

I would add some briwax to the pad. Rub it all down again, then buff with a soft cloth.  Should give a nice semi-sheen

Absolutely this ^

barnsleyboy

I've been digging around in the kitchen cupboard, and found some Stone's Beeswax Furniture Cream (made by Rustins), which according to the product data sheet is:

A blend of finest beeswax, spirits, pure soap and essential oils based closely on an original recipe dating from 1760 with both cleaning and polishing properties. 

Briwax according to the Rustins website is:

A traditional formulation using only refined Natural Beeswax and Carnauba Wax. 

Does the Carnauba wax make that much of a difference?

WezV

dunno, you can try other stuff but i know briwax works reliable for me.   I just avoid anything too paste like, needs to be something that's hard at room temperature really

munckee

I dulled the shine on a Harley Benton with 1200 sandpaper then t cut and then buffed with car polish to give a semi sheen. 

barnsleyboy

I've given it a going over and it's pretty good so far, The Stone's is more of a cream. I've just done a test patch using really fine wire wool to rub it in, it's definitely looking a lot better. I'll keep working on it, but will give the briwax a go just to be on the safe side!! Thanks for your help!

barnsleyboy

munckee said:

I dulled the shine on a Harley Benton with 1200 sandpaper then t cut and then buffed with car polish to give a semi sheen. 

I did the old scotchbrite treatment on my HB TE-52 and it came out great. I didn't need to do anything else to it. I think because the HB-35 is super glossy and an arch top, it's that much harder to get a decent finish.

barnsleyboy

Hi @WezV ;

Am I doing this right? I worked the Briwax into the guitar top using a fine scotchbrite pad, then rubbed off and buffed using a clean microfibre cloth, but it seems to have come up pretty smeary!

https://www.flickr.com/photos/146233690@N07/shares/2o45w7

Did I use too much? Have I not buffed enough? Is it user error? HELP!

WezV

If you have used plenty of wax just keep buffing.

barnsleyboy

so basically keep going with it? I've just tried some fine wire wool, which seems to be smoothing it down a bit. I guess I can always go over it again if it doesn't quite look right.

WezV

I do tend to use wire wool, but thought the pads would get you to the same place.

barnsleyboy

Nice one @wezv I’ll continue with some light burnishing and elbow grease! 

Flip

I agree with the comments recommending handwork, not a machine. I use machines for some jobs of course, but in general, I think they're a quick way to mess things up.

Another thought for your body, I'm currently making an ES335 with a body sprayed with Holts metallic car spray over white primer finished with a matte clear coat. Works for me.

barnsleyboy

Flip said:

I agree with the comments recommending handwork, not a machine. I use machines for some jobs of course, but in general, I think they're a quick way to mess things up.

Another thought for your body, I'm currently making an ES335 with a body sprayed with Holts metallic car spray over white primer finished with a matte clear coat. Works for me.

Totally mate. I did the original scotchbriting with the detail sander so I could get a fairly consistent finish over the whole top (I tried a bit by hand and it was very uneven). I'd looked at the Brad Angove vid on YT where he uses a matte clear coat, but I'd need to practice my spraying technique before I attempted it. @wezv's briwax treatment has come out really nicely. Not quite  the matte finish I was looking for, but it's definitely got more of a vintage feel. I've left the rest of the guitar shiny, and I think it looks great. Applying the wax with wire wool was definitely the key, and buffing in small areas at a time with a microfibre cloth

One thing I have noticed since I put it all back together is that it sounds better. I don't know if it's just my imagination, but it seems to have come alive. Could it be something to do with the removal of the hard poly top coat albeit I don't think a scotchbrite sanding would take much off? Maybe the combination of that and the briwax has something to do with it.

Anyway, many thanks for all the advice.

Flip

barnsleyboy said:

One thing I have noticed since I put it all back together is that it sounds better. I don't know if it's just my imagination, but it seems to have come alive. 

Is that a bit like sensing that the car seems to run more smoothly after you've spent an hour polishing it?

theimageofall

I’m interested in how this one turns out as I have a Harley Benton that I might want to put a satin finish on to as well.