On stage lyrics

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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23966
    edited May 2022
    When I fronted a band I learnt them by heart. Admittedly I’m good at that and I can still remember the 40-odd songs even now.

    Funnily enough I find it much easier to learn lyrics if I’m also playing guitar. I think it sort of doubles the amount of cues in my brain.

    We used to rehearse all the time. Not to the point of getting them right, but to the point where we couldn’t get them wrong. Genuine autopilot was possible.

    As is happens that band got together 18 years after we last played together, did 1 rehearsal to tweak arrangements for older and deeper voices and then did a gig. It went very well.

    That being said, a performance is just that, and what the audience cannot see should never be a problem. Modern systems of a hidden screen are far more elegant than a crappy bit of paper and the audience never needs to know. Just like a magic show!

    But as stated they should be an emergency support thing, not a don’t put the work in thing.

    These days I think the problem would be that my eyesight wouldn’t be good enough to see an iPad hidden in a monitor!
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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26754
    I have no issue at all with someone having some lyrics off to the side or at the feet. That’s no different to having notes of starting my chords or alt tunings on your set list as a guitarist imo

    The problem comes when singers spend the set staring at the words rather than *performing*. This is a big issue with a lot of amateur bands but it’s not because of the music stand, it’s that they hide behind a stand because they’re not very good.
    The Assumptions - UAE party band for all your rock & soul desires
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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23966
    I have no issue at all with someone having some lyrics off to the side or at the feet. That’s no different to having notes of starting my chords or alt tunings on your set list as a guitarist imo

    The problem comes when singers spend the set staring at the words rather than *performing*. This is a big issue with a lot of amateur bands but it’s not because of the music stand, it’s that they hide behind a stand because they’re not very good.
    IMO, visible music stands are for sitting down bands only. Orchestra, big jazz bands, that sort of thing.

    For everything else it must be invisible if it is there at all.

    The ones who stare at the sheets are the ones who rehearse with them and get into the habit. They should learn the lyrics at home and rehearse without, then when they are available at the gig for emergencies they aren’t part of the normal routine for the singer.

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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26754
    I have no issue at all with someone having some lyrics off to the side or at the feet. That’s no different to having notes of starting my chords or alt tunings on your set list as a guitarist imo

    The problem comes when singers spend the set staring at the words rather than *performing*. This is a big issue with a lot of amateur bands but it’s not because of the music stand, it’s that they hide behind a stand because they’re not very good.
    IMO, visible music stands are for sitting down bands only. Orchestra, big jazz bands, that sort of thing.

    For everything else it must be invisible if it is there at all.

    The ones who stare at the sheets are the ones who rehearse with them and get into the habit. They should learn the lyrics at home and rehearse without, then when they are available at the gig for emergencies they aren’t part of the normal routine for the singer.

    Yes, that’s typically been my approach (in my admittedly not-very-extensive experience of singing lead). 

    It can be done - Michael Stipe had a small stand to the side for a large part of REM’s last decade or so of gigs and it didn’t stop him from connecting! But while that would have been a small stand on a large stage and fairly inconspicuous, you so often see a large stand on a small stage, and often plonked as a barrier between singer and audience, which is bloody awful.
    The Assumptions - UAE party band for all your rock & soul desires
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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23966
    Yeah - I've seen some supposedly high energy rock bands at pub shows where they are all jumping about aside from the singer who has a full conductors stand right in the middle of the stage with the mic on a stand.

    It's just awful. I'd take a singer who forgets the odd line over that any day of the week.

    If it's a well known cover it's even easier - get the crowd to join in! 
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  • FezFez Frets: 499
    Old drawing office saying "the only person who never makes a mistake is one who never does anything" so don't worry if you fluff a line our singer usually makes a joke about it if he has a a brain fart. Gigs are like decorating preparation is the key. Personally I don't like visible aid memoirs but it is forgivable for some situations like open mics. 
    Don't touch that dial.
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  • LewyLewy Frets: 4127
    edited May 2022
    Personally I'd never sing without having internalised the lyrics but then I only perform songs I like enough to have probably learned the lyrics through listening anyway. From an audience member perspective, how I feel about seeing prompts being used depends on context. If its a function band being a human jukebox it doesn't bother me at all. If it's a singer songwriter asking me to enter their world of music on the promise it will be worth my time, and they haven't learned their own lyrics...get in the fucking bin. 

    I also remember seeing Tom Jones in some studio somewhere professing that the blues was his first love and the core of his musical self, and then he went on to sing the Fred McDowell song "You've Got To Move" whilst reading the reletaively few words off a piece of paper. Equally bin-worthy in my opinion.
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  • robertyroberty Frets: 10893
    There's no use proffering a one-size-fits-all approach. Some people have better memories for lyrics. Some people have more time. I found it much easier to remember lyrics when I was younger, I do think age comes into it
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  • fretmeisterfretmeister Frets: 23966
    edited May 2022
    Lewy said:
    Personally I'd never sing without having internalised the lyrics but then I only perform songs I like enough to have probably learned the lyrics through listening anyway. From an audience member perspective, how I feel about seeing prompts being used depends on context. If its a function band being a human jukebox it doesn't bother me at all. If it's a singer songwriter asking me to enter their world of music on the promise it will be worth my time, and they haven't learned their own lyrics...get in the fucking bin. 

    I also remember seeing Tom Jones in some studio somewhere professing that the blues was his first love and the core of his musical self, and then he went on to sing the Fred McDowell song "You've Got To Move" whilst reading the reletaively few words off a piece of paper. Equally bin-worthy in my opinion.
    Oh god yeah - if an originals outfit cannot be bothered to learn them, then nah.

    If they haven't got the time to learn their own words then I haven't got the time to listen to them.



    Also - I was trying to be a bit more polite than that, but overall my view is, if you haven't remembered the lyrics then you are not ready to perform the song. 

    Jukeboxes are allowed as you say - a 5 hour set from a Wedding band is a very different kettle of mediocrity. *


    * and before anyone gets offended - I've been there and bought the t-shirt.
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  • shufflebeatshufflebeat Frets: 104
    ...The problem comes when singers spend the set staring at the words rather than *performing*. This is a big issue with a lot of amateur bands but it’s not because of the music stand, it’s that they hide behind a stand because they’re not very good.
    To be fair, there are plenty of folks who, if they weren't staring at a sheet would be staring at their feet or their bandmates.

    A good communicator will find a way, iPad or not. 
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  • dariusdarius Frets: 619
    OP: Help me with this thing I need.
    Forum: nope. You’re wrong. 
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  • JJManJJMan Frets: 35
    I have to learn all the lyrics and chords etc. to "own" the song but also I'm then free to communicate with the audience - eye contact is important!
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  • TheBigDipperTheBigDipper Frets: 4722
    Just posting to say that I did an open mic on Tuesday with my mate next door. This time, I decided to put in a bit more effort than I normally do, and learned the songs so I could perform them without using OnSong on the iPad as a prompt. It went well. I sang better, played better and communicated better with the crowd. But we knew that would be the outcome - it's just we don't always have the time to make it work that way. 

    I already knew that the one person I wanted to read this post would not be here to do so, but I'm posting it anyway. 
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  • NikcNikc Frets: 627
    Played open mic tonight - got up with a magic promoting sheet, couldn't see it, so I played something else. Something that I knew by heart, one of my own as it goes.

    Learn the song, simple. Trying to read and play at the same time really isn't happening. Trying to read, sing, play and perform at the same time - don't be silly ;)
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  • stickyfiddlestickyfiddle Frets: 26754
    ...The problem comes when singers spend the set staring at the words rather than *performing*. This is a big issue with a lot of amateur bands but it’s not because of the music stand, it’s that they hide behind a stand because they’re not very good.
    To be fair, there are plenty of folks who, if they weren't staring at a sheet would be staring at their feet or their bandmates.

    A good communicator will find a way, iPad or not. 
    Yes, exactly. When there is a problem, the iPad is only a symptom, not the problem itself.
    The Assumptions - UAE party band for all your rock & soul desires
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