The F1 thread

Boromedic

Wow, had a brief read of some of RBs social media feeds, lot of negativity towards them and especially Max. Cheating cunts.

Cols

Hulkenberg confirmed at Haas.  

Schumacher’s F1 hopes rest on Logan Sargent failing to do well enough in the F2 championship to secure a superlicence (freeing up the Williams seat), or Ricciardo deciding he doesn’t want the Merc reserve seat.

Elsewhere, rumours have it that Leclerc and Binotto are no longer on speaking terms and haven’t been for some time.

euan

That’ll be why Vasseur is being tipped as a potential relationship. 

I like Binotto, generally Ferrari have improved under him, and I think he has tried to bring back that isolated and protected Ferrari family unit that allowed Todt to keep the team away from the Italian press. 

I think the issue Binotto has had is that he was never an outsider like Todt was. Ferrari is a weird team, that does well despite itself, and Todt was able to cut away the elements that held it back. 

stickyfiddle

Let's also remember that Todt brought in not only Schumacher from Bennetton, but also Brawn and Byrne a year later (probably after discussions with Schu). With that team Ferrari consistently built better and better cars and probably made fewer strategy errors in 10 years than this team has in the last 2. 

If he goes I honestly believe Binotto's biggest mistake is not firing (or reshuffling) the head of strategy. 

"we are checking..." 

Cols

stickyfiddle said:

I'm not sure what it says about Haas' ambitions as Hulk is never going to be a champion either. I guess a couple of development years with solid drivers who will bring the car home so they can maximise spending on new parts and not replacement ones. 

I always felt that Hulkenberg was one of those talented drivers who suffered from never getting himself into a car capable of winning races.  

He was touted many times - apparently Merc's next choice if they couldn't secure Hamilton back in 2013, within an ace of getting a Ferrari drive in 2014, fancied at McLaren a few times - but it never worked out for him.  Being on the wrong side of 6 foot probably doesn't help.

For Haas, a champ-level driver is not really a good way of moving the car up the grid.  Look at poor old Hamilton and Russell at the beginning of this year; despite their massive talents, when the car wasn't working it wouldn't be getting out of Q1.

What they need is a quick, reliable driver who gives accurate feedback and can grind out points race after race.  That's Hulk.

stickyfiddle

Cols said:

stickyfiddle said:

I'm not sure what it says about Haas' ambitions as Hulk is never going to be a champion either. I guess a couple of development years with solid drivers who will bring the car home so they can maximise spending on new parts and not replacement ones. 

I always felt that Hulkenberg was one of those talented drivers who suffered from never getting himself into a car capable of winning races.  

He was touted many times - apparently Merc's next choice if they couldn't secure Hamilton back in 2013, within an ace of getting a Ferrari drive in 2014, fancied at McLaren a few times - but it never worked out for him.  Being on the wrong side of 6 foot probably doesn't help.

For Haas, a champ-level driver is not really a good way of moving the car up the grid.  Look at poor old Hamilton and Russell at the beginning of this year; despite their massive talents, when the car wasn't working it wouldn't be getting out of Q1.

What they need is a quick, reliable driver who gives accurate feedback and can grind out points race after race.  That's Hulk.

Can't argue with any of that. 

The main criticism of Hulk would be that whenever he's run in a podium position he ends up bottling it, but that's not likely to be an issue for Haas in the immediate short term!

Emiel

Cols said:

stickyfiddle said:

I'm not sure what it says about Haas' ambitions as Hulk is never going to be a champion either. I guess a couple of development years with solid drivers who will bring the car home so they can maximise spending on new parts and not replacement ones. 

I always felt that Hulkenberg was one of those talented drivers who suffered from never getting himself into a car capable of winning races.  

He was touted many times - apparently Merc's next choice if they couldn't secure Hamilton back in 2013, within an ace of getting a Ferrari drive in 2014, fancied at McLaren a few times - but it never worked out for him.  Being on the wrong side of 6 foot probably doesn't help.

For Haas, a champ-level driver is not really a good way of moving the car up the grid.  Look at poor old Hamilton and Russell at the beginning of this year; despite their massive talents, when the car wasn't working it wouldn't be getting out of Q1.

What they need is a quick, reliable driver who gives accurate feedback and can grind out points race after race.  That's Hulk.

He was touted many times indeed, but I think only by the fans and press. He is a very likeable guy but never really quite made it. He is fast and in fact did fairly well against teammates such as Perez, Sainz and Ricciardo but never outshone any of them. Unlike the others, he just seemed to lack that little bit extra and never managed to get a podium when there was an opportunity. 

I think Haas is mainly getting him because he is experienced and pretty much the only one at that. He and Magnussen will be close though.

euan

stickyfiddle said:

Let's also remember that Todt brought in not only Schumacher from Bennetton, but also Brawn and Byrne a year later (probably after discussions with Schu). With that team Ferrari consistently built better and better cars and probably made fewer strategy errors in 10 years than this team has in the last 2. 

If he goes I honestly believe Binotto's biggest mistake is not firing (or reshuffling) the head of strategy. 

"we are checking..." 

You also had Luca do Montezemolo backing Todt absolutely. I think t think there is that behind Binotto

skullfunkerry

Emiel said:

Cols said:

stickyfiddle said:

I'm not sure what it says about Haas' ambitions as Hulk is never going to be a champion either. I guess a couple of development years with solid drivers who will bring the car home so they can maximise spending on new parts and not replacement ones. 

I always felt that Hulkenberg was one of those talented drivers who suffered from never getting himself into a car capable of winning races.  

He was touted many times - apparently Merc's next choice if they couldn't secure Hamilton back in 2013, within an ace of getting a Ferrari drive in 2014, fancied at McLaren a few times - but it never worked out for him.  Being on the wrong side of 6 foot probably doesn't help.

For Haas, a champ-level driver is not really a good way of moving the car up the grid.  Look at poor old Hamilton and Russell at the beginning of this year; despite their massive talents, when the car wasn't working it wouldn't be getting out of Q1.

What they need is a quick, reliable driver who gives accurate feedback and can grind out points race after race.  That's Hulk.

He was touted many times indeed, but I think only by the fans and press. He is a very likeable guy but never really quite made it. He is fast and in fact did fairly well against teammates such as Perez, Sainz and Ricciardo but never outshone any of them. Unlike the others, he just seemed to lack that little bit extra and never managed to get a podium when there was an opportunity. 

I think Haas is mainly getting him because he is experienced and pretty much the only one at that. He and Magnussen will be close though.

Wasn’t it Hulkenberg and Magnussen with the “suck my balls” comment in the post-race interviews?

stickyfiddle

@skullfunkerry YEP!  

TimmyO

stickyfiddle said:

If he goes I honestly believe Binotto's biggest mistake is not firing (or reshuffling) the head of strategy. 

"we are checking..." 

I think it's as much the old school/corporate hierarchy of decision making in that business showing up in the racing team. 

Increased trust and psychological safety in any organisation/group/team directly leads to better decision making and accountability taking. The opposite results in slowness and being rewarded for being 'least wrong' on any given occasion. I get huge whiffs of that from how Ferrari behave and talk about themselves. 

stickyfiddle

Yeah, that sounds spot on. Basically the polar opposite of how Merc operates. 

Cols

Red Bull have released a conciliatory statement on their team orders high jinks at Brazil.

“As a team we made some mistakes in Brazil.  We had not envisaged the situation that unfolded on the last lap and we had not agreed a strategy for such a scenario before the race.

“Regretfully, Max was only informed at the final corner of the request to give up position without all the necessary information being relayed.

“This put Max, who has always been an open and fair team player, in a compromising situation with little time to react which was not our intention.”

“Following the race Max spoke openly and honestly, allowing for both drivers to resolve any outstanding issues or concerns.

“The Team accept Max’s reasoning, the conversation was a personal matter which will remain private between the team and no further comment will be made.“

Effectively absolving Max of any blame, and characterising the incident as him being asked at the very last corner to let Perez past.  This is not how I recall things happening…

dazzajl

Kinda smells like Max spitting his dummy and demanding Mummy Horner and Daddy Marko make him look better. 

euan

It’s a complete fabrication and gaslighting behaviour 

sinbaadi

They must have a load of pr tossers from the world of politics.

Cols

I can’t even see what’s accomplished in PR terms for any party by this statement.

I mean, lies are one thing - but these are stupid and obvious lies.

Nitefly

And what did Checo have to say about it?

Cols

Nitefly said:

And what did Checo have to say about it?

Fully on message with the “Max is lovely, it was all of the rest of us who were wrong” RB narrative.  Singing like a bird.

"I obviously regret a lot of things that I said after the race, because I am back with Max [and we are having] the relationship that we used to have, and we, and the team, and everyone [are] ready to move forwards."

"Everyone was put in a very difficult situation there, with Max, with the team [and] myself. I think we could have handled the situation better,"

"We're obviously going to learn from it and do things differently in the future, and that's the way you should [do it]. Every team around the paddock is learning."

There’s a very conspicuous absence of whether there’s any expectation that Verstappen will do anything to help Perez get 2nd in the championship.

stickyfiddle

Cols said:

Nitefly said:

And what did Checo have to say about it?

Fully on message with the “Max is lovely, it was all of the rest of us who were wrong” RB narrative.  Singing like a bird.

"I obviously regret a lot of things that I said after the race, because I am back with Max [and we are having] the relationship that we used to have, and we, and the team, and everyone [are] ready to move forwards."

"Everyone was put in a very difficult situation there, with Max, with the team [and] myself. I think we could have handled the situation better,"

"We're obviously going to learn from it and do things differently in the future, and that's the way you should [do it]. Every team around the paddock is learning."

There’s a very conspicuous absence of whether there’s any expectation that Verstappen will do anything to help Perez get 2nd in the championship.

aka: "I have been informed that I have to do Max wants or I won't get a contract extension because DannyRic is keen to come back"