The F1 thread

fretmeister

RandallFlagg said:

Cols said:

S56035 said:

He's essentially the CEO isn't he? He's supposed to be in control. Any boss that isn't in control isn't likely to be very good.

In this context, “controlling behaviour” means something different than being in control of your team.  For instance:

Using fear and intimidation to get people to do your bidding.

Deliberately withholding information to exert control.

Belittling your staff.

Dominating meetings and talking over people.

Micromanaging.

FWIW: Horner’s been in charge of Red Bull for 19 years, and in that time the team’s won 7 titles.  That’s pretty impressive, and you don’t achieve that by being shit at people management.  Personally I think he’s an arsehole, but something about this doesn’t ring true.

ADMIN EDIT: This video's audio describes stuff you definitely don't want anybody at work (or your kids) hearing.

 

  

ha hahahahaha!

What a pisstake!

Cols

euan said:

It’s not outside the cost cap is what I’m saying. 

Like the Wind Tunnel rules where you can only nominate one tunnel to use for that year, you can only list three cost cap personal exemptions. If CH was to leave they can’t say now he isn’t here we are exempting Jonathan Wheatley’s salary instead. 

In that same case if JW was to become TP someone would need to fill his role and so on. So there are cost cap implications.  

What’s excluded is the cost of the three highest paid employees (after the drivers) in the calendar year.

For example: let’s say the four highest paid RB people are Adrian on £5 million, Christian on £4 million, Helmut on £3 million and Bob the Janitor on £2 million.  RB are allowed to exempt the cost of Adrian, Christian and Helmut - £12 million in all.

Suddenly, Christian gets sacked at the end of March for gross conduct involving a cucumber.  His pay for the calendar year is £1 million for the three months.  

Now the three highest paid are Adrian, Helmut and Bob the Janitor, whose annual salary of £2 million exceeds the £1 million which Christian pocketed before the unfortunate incident with the cucumber came to light.  

RB are allowed to exempt the cost of Adrian, Bob and Helmut - £10 million.  But they’ve also saved 9 months of Christian’s wages (£3 million), so it’s a win all round.  They can go and spend some more money on staff catering.

fretmeister

Blimey - De Telegraaf are upping the game.

They claim that Horner offered the complainant £650,000 to settle.

The page on De Telegraaf is mostly behind a paywall, but others are effectively quoting it:

Christian Horner’s ongoing investigation uncovers shocking revelations regarding sexually inappropriate conduct and an attempted settlement of $800,000. (msn.com)

If this isn't true then De Telegraaf are going to get sued to oblivion.

fretmeister

I realise that De Telegraaf does not have a great rep.

HOWEVER: I have been informed, from a source I trust, that Dutch defamation laws are criminal as well as civil.

fretmeister

Ford are now making comments

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/red-bull-ap-ford-max-verstappen-daytona-beach-b2497639.html

stickyfiddle

fretmeister said:

Ford are now making comments

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/red-bull-ap-ford-max-verstappen-daytona-beach-b2497639.html

Feels like a very firm “sort this out asap and quietly if you want us to stick around…”

fretmeister

My thoughts exactly.

Boromedic

I do find it odd that they stuck him out on the launch when he's in the middle of such a serious investigation, I get that not having him there could be weird and may give the wrong impression. However, I can't think of any company that would throw out a senior management level employee into the limelight like that in the middle of such allegations. 

Generally you'd be put on suspension whilst you're investigated, surely? 

As it's made the public arena, and the big meeting last week couldn't give them closure, I think it's potentially quite serious and he may be found guilty.

boogieman

Boromedic said:

I do find it odd that they stuck him out on the launch when he's in the middle of such a serious investigation, I get that not having him there could be weird and may give the wrong impression. However, I can't think of any company that would throw out a senior management level employee into the limelight like that in the middle of such allegations. 

Generally you'd be put on suspension whilst you're investigated, surely? 

As it's made the public arena, and the big meeting last week couldn't give them closure, I think it's potentially quite serious.

Damned if they did, damned if they didn’t, they were on a loser whatever happened. Horner is the public face of RB to the majority of punters, it’d look like the team thought he was guilty already if he didn’t show up at the launch. 

Boromedic

boogieman said:

Boromedic said:

I do find it odd that they stuck him out on the launch when he's in the middle of such a serious investigation, I get that not having him there could be weird and may give the wrong impression. However, I can't think of any company that would throw out a senior management level employee into the limelight like that in the middle of such allegations. 

Generally you'd be put on suspension whilst you're investigated, surely? 

As it's made the public arena, and the big meeting last week couldn't give them closure, I think it's potentially quite serious.

Damned if they did, damned if they didn’t, they were on a loser whatever happened. Horner is the public face of RB to the majority of punters, it’d look like the team thought he was guilty already if he didn’t show up at the launch. 

Yeah I know, I do get that and it's a real catch 22, however in most arenas I can think of, the accused would be on special leave...

They could've done the launch without him and passed it off, they already put restrictions on questions you could ask as it was if you watch the launch stuff. Some of the F1 YT channels who were there were told not to ask questions about it. 

dazzajl

The rumour mill seems to be suggesting that the leak starting this whole investigation came from the Verstappen camp. Now while I’m as Machiavellian as the next chap and think Jos’ morals seem lower than a snakes belly, I’m not seeing a gain for them. 

Unless Horner was planing to put a more competitive driver in the other car but I’ve never got the sense that was attractive to him. 

fretmeister

dazzajl said:

The rumour mill seems to be suggesting that the leak starting this whole investigation came from the Verstappen camp. Now while I’m as Machiavellian as the next chap and think Jos’ morals seem lower than a snakes belly, I’m not seeing a gain for them. 

Unless Horner was planing to put a more competitive driver in the other car but I’ve never got the sense that was attractive to him. 

Unless they want Horner out and try to get Jos as team boss. 

dazzajl

fretmeister said:

dazzajl said:

The rumour mill seems to be suggesting that the leak starting this whole investigation came from the Verstappen camp. Now while I’m as Machiavellian as the next chap and think Jos’ morals seem lower than a snakes belly, I’m not seeing a gain for them. 

Unless Horner was planing to put a more competitive driver in the other car but I’ve never got the sense that was attractive to him. 

Unless they want Horner out and try to get Jos as team boss. 

Oooooooh. Good shout. I can see them
making that play. 

motorhead

Because he could never be accused of any kind of bad behaviour toward women. Never ever.

Philly_Q

RandallFlagg said:

ADMIN EDIT: This video's audio describes stuff you definitely don't want anybody at work (or your kids) hearing.

 

  

I just randomly clicked on that without having read any of the previous posts, I haven't been paying much attention to the news story and I had no idea who's posted the YouTube video...

I thought "WHAT THE FUCK?????!!!".

Cols

fretmeister said:

dazzajl said:

The rumour mill seems to be suggesting that the leak starting this whole investigation came from the Verstappen camp. Now while I’m as Machiavellian as the next chap and think Jos’ morals seem lower than a snakes belly, I’m not seeing a gain for them. 

Unless Horner was planing to put a more competitive driver in the other car but I’ve never got the sense that was attractive to him. 

Unless they want Horner out and try to get Jos as team boss. 

Unlikely - as far as I’m aware Jos’s only relevant work experience is a mediocre F1 career and a couple of stints in A1 Grand Prix and sports cars.

It’d be hilarious though.  Like the Strolls in reverse.

Boromedic

I started chatting with a friend about the Horner thing and he made a point that hadn't occurred to me, which might explain it. Perhaps RB offered him the chance to step aside the launch, and his arrogance prevented him from taking it. He does have form as has been mentioned.

The fact the thing wasn't settled in the first meeting before the launch must be worrying some folk.

RiftAmps

On a separate note, Lewis is currently 9/1 to win the WDC this year which is a great punt to take before testing starts on Wed and the bookies adjust based on performance.

I'll quite happily put £100 on him and if he loses then I'm ecstatic anyway and if he wins I'm quids in. It's a win-win for Verstappen fans

RandallFlagg

I head that Horner was insistent that the Spice Girls greatest hits was played in the Red Bull team garage on loop really loud and one of the female mechanical took umbrage....zigazig ah

 No sure if it's true or not.

Cols

Boromedic said:

I started chatting with a friend about the Horner thing and he made a point that hadn't occurred to me, which might explain it. Perhaps RB offered him the chance to step aside the launch, and his arrogance prevented him from taking it. He does have form as has been mentioned.

The fact the thing wasn't settled in the first meeting before the launch must be worrying some folk.

The public statement on the purpose of the first meeting was that it was to question Horner and get his side of the story.  I guess after that the investigating team need to go away and analyse everything they’ve gathered before preparing a report.

Liberty have also chimed in to state “We hope that the matter will be clarified at the earliest opportunity after a fair and thorough process", indicating they want it wrapped up quickly.  Wonder if he’ll be at the Bahrain test?