IMGUR now blocked in the UK?

Dave8

BillDL said:

RaymondLin said:
4 - Force everyone to use a VPN.  Not going to happen.

Correct.  I subscribe so I can easily upload images from my own computer, but I'm not going to have to use a VPN here just to see other peoples' photos and anybody that thinks that's a viable proposition can take a hike.

It would be quite the blocker for general use of the forum

WezV

Its not just this forum either, its every forum where you might pop along to find an answer to something without bothering to become a member

As an example, Im not a reporting expert, but still do a lot as part of my job.   If I can't figure out how to do something, I Google it.   Usually this will give me a post where someone has illustrated a solution with pictures.  I now can't access those on my work computer.  I will be less productive as a result.  The actual reporting guys i work with are  often just very good at googling the right answer.

Its not just about looking at pretty guitars pics and silly memes.  It's about having answers to pretty much anything you need at your fingertips.

I was saying to my dad yesterday that 10 years ago I was pretty confident there was not much I couldn't learn from the Internet.  I could find almost all the information i needed, given freely and shared with the world   I'm not sure its true now.  Everything gets paywalled, dumbed down, and now just totally blocked for us in the UK.  It was an amazing resource for me.  It won't be for our kids.

Penn

WezV said:

Its not just this forum either, its every forum where you might pop along to find an answer to something without bothering to become a member

As an example, Im not a reporting expert, but still do a lot as part of my job.   If I can't figure out how to do something, I Google it.   Usually this will give me a post where someone has illustrated a solution with pictures.  I now can't access those on my work computer.  I will be less productive as a result.  The actual reporting guys i work with are  often just very good at googling the right answer.

Its not just about looking at pretty guitars pics and silly memes.  It's about having answers to pretty much anything you need at your fingertips.

I was saying to my dad yesterday that 10 years ago I was pretty confident there was not much I couldn't learn from the Internet.  I could find almost all the information i needed, given freely and shared with the world   I'm not sure it’s true now.  Everything gets paywalled, dumbed down, and now just totally blocked for us in the UK.  It was an amazing resource for me.  It won't be for our kids.

Or it’s an advert/paid for content and it’s not the cheapest/best quality/one nearest etc. 

digitalscream

Dave8 said:

BillDL said:

RaymondLin said:
4 - Force everyone to use a VPN.  Not going to happen.

Correct.  I subscribe so I can easily upload images from my own computer, but I'm not going to have to use a VPN here just to see other peoples' photos and anybody that thinks that's a viable proposition can take a hike.

It would be quite the blocker for general use of the forum

It's not going to happen. I'm working on a solution for all of the historical images...it'll likely take a couple of weeks, but I'll get it sorted. Also need to sort out a list of usable services, although I'm kinda hoping that somebody else might deal with that for the good of the community

drofluf

RaymondLin said:

4 - Force everyone to use a VPN.  Not going to happen 

Doesn’t it also have to be a vpn that uses a server not in the UK?

ICBM

drofluf said:

Doesn’t it also have to be a vpn that uses a server not in the UK?

Proton allows you to choose. I chose ‘fastest’, so the one I’m on is in the Netherlands. None of the available ones are in the UK.

It was incredibly easy to set up on iOS - just go to the app store, search Proton VPN (I’d already read a few reviews and this seemed a good one), download, put the widget where you can easily turn it on or off - done. The free version only allows one device, if I need to use it with more I’ll just get the paid-for version which isn’t expensive.

ElectricXII

BillDL said:

RaymondLin said:
4 - Force everyone to use a VPN.  Not going to happen.

Correct.  I subscribe so I can easily upload images from my own computer, but I'm not going to have to use a VPN here just to see other peoples' photos and anybody that thinks that's a viable proposition can take a hike.

I turned on my VPN to view the Imgur pics in someone's post earlier on. It's literally two clicks.

Aornic

Final straw for me. Just got 24 months of Proton VPN. Ridiculous situation. Last I had to use a VPN was when YouTube was blocked in Pakistan in the very early 2010s!!

RaymondLin

ElectricXII said:

BillDL said:

RaymondLin said:
4 - Force everyone to use a VPN.  Not going to happen.

Correct.  I subscribe so I can easily upload images from my own computer, but I'm not going to have to use a VPN here just to see other peoples' photos and anybody that thinks that's a viable proposition can take a hike.

I turned on my VPN to view the Imgur pics in someone's post earlier on. It's literally two clicks.

The issue is as someone who shares a lot of photo, I want 100% of people to be able to view it.  The people who are IT literate isn't my concern.  There are people out there who can't even work IMGUR before today, I mean have you seen the number of threads on "how do I post images on here" threads?

It's those that who doesn't even know how to use IMGUR, now we have to expet every one to use a VPN.  So that means the "audience" of any images posted will drop substantially if I continue to use IMGUR.

FelineGuitars

I've gone and renewed my account with Photobucket , and opted for the paid version which would allow hosting.

This is not a solution that would suit most people, but "The Fretboard" is so useful to my business and to all the friends and customers that it connects me with, that I don't want to not have pictures available.

Whilst like everyone else I liked and appreciated getting stuff for FREE , I did miss the menu structure and hierarchy of files that I could use in Photobucket, when I made the switch to Imgur, and Imgur did seem to delete some of my files now and then, and I always wished for the organisation that I could have with Photobucket (and it will be a lot more organised for me now that I know what I need from it).

My only concern is that what affected Imgur may get to Photobucket in time a the UK government wants to shut down every avenue of free communication that we have with each other (not convinced that it's all about the children to be honest) - hence I took a monthly subscription rather than paying for a year at a time. 

I'll let you know how I get on .......

Photos of our new "Surf strat" for proof of concept:

WezV

RaymondLin said:

ElectricXII said:

BillDL said:

RaymondLin said:
4 - Force everyone to use a VPN.  Not going to happen.

Correct.  I subscribe so I can easily upload images from my own computer, but I'm not going to have to use a VPN here just to see other peoples' photos and anybody that thinks that's a viable proposition can take a hike.

I turned on my VPN to view the Imgur pics in someone's post earlier on. It's literally two clicks.

The issue is as someone who shares a lot of photo, I want 100% of people to be able to view it.  The people who are IT literate isn't my concern.  There are people out there who can't even work IMGUR before today, I mean have you seen the number of threads on "how do I post images on here" threads?

It's those that who doesn't even know how to use IMGUR, now we have to expet every one to use a VPN.  So that means the "audience" of any images posted will drop substantially if I continue to use IMGUR.

The issue with VPNs and using other hosting services for me is that they are clearly going to be the next target for the government go after.

Sure, every business uses a VPN for valid reasons, but I dont expect that to stop them 

Habanero

WezV said:

RaymondLin said:

ElectricXII said:

BillDL said:

RaymondLin said:
4 - Force everyone to use a VPN.  Not going to happen.

Correct.  I subscribe so I can easily upload images from my own computer, but I'm not going to have to use a VPN here just to see other peoples' photos and anybody that thinks that's a viable proposition can take a hike.

I turned on my VPN to view the Imgur pics in someone's post earlier on. It's literally two clicks.

The issue is as someone who shares a lot of photo, I want 100% of people to be able to view it.  The people who are IT literate isn't my concern.  There are people out there who can't even work IMGUR before today, I mean have you seen the number of threads on "how do I post images on here" threads?

It's those that who doesn't even know how to use IMGUR, now we have to expet every one to use a VPN.  So that means the "audience" of any images posted will drop substantially if I continue to use IMGUR.

The issue with VPNs and using other hosting services for me is that they are clearly going to be the next target for the government go after.

Sure, every business uses a VPN for valid reasons, but I dont expect that to stop them 

One of those businesses would be the civil service.

skullfunkerry

I might be being naive here, but I'm hoping that the sites like Photobucket, Flickr etc. that offer a paid option won't be affected, as by paying you in effect prove your age... maybe they'll do away with the free tiers, and force everyone to pay. That would be in line with the rest of the internet wouldn't it, where everything is better (more ad-free) if you pay.

digitalscream

WezV said:

The issue with VPNs and using other hosting services for me is that they are clearly going to be the next target for the government go after.

Sure, every business uses a VPN for valid reasons, but I dont expect that to stop them 

There are ways to shield VPNs from packet inspection, which would effectively make them undetectable to ISPs (the only way the government could enforce such a ban). There are also alternatives to VPNs which would easily defeat any measures the government tried to bring to bear, short of outlawing all network encryption for private individuals (which would be patently insane and wall us off from the entire rest of the world, thus crippling our economy).

skullfunkerry said:

I might be being naive here, but I'm hoping that the sites like Photobucket, Flickr etc. that offer a paid option won't be affected, as by paying you in effect prove your age... maybe they'll do away with the free tiers, and force everyone to pay. That would be in line with the rest of the internet wouldn't it, where everything is better (more ad-free) if you pay.

Minors can have debit cards, so just paying for something electronically doesn't prove anything...

skullfunkerry

digitalscream said:

WezV said:

The issue with VPNs and using other hosting services for me is that they are clearly going to be the next target for the government go after.

Sure, every business uses a VPN for valid reasons, but I dont expect that to stop them 

There are ways to shield VPNs from packet inspection, which would effectively make them undetectable to ISPs (the only way the government could enforce such a ban). There are also alternatives to VPNs which would easily defeat any measures the government tried to bring to bear, short of outlawing all network encryption for private individuals (which would be patently insane and wall us off from the entire rest of the world, thus crippling our economy).

skullfunkerry said:

I might be being naive here, but I'm hoping that the sites like Photobucket, Flickr etc. that offer a paid option won't be affected, as by paying you in effect prove your age... maybe they'll do away with the free tiers, and force everyone to pay. That would be in line with the rest of the internet wouldn't it, where everything is better (more ad-free) if you pay.

Minors can have debit cards, so just paying for something electronically doesn't prove anything...

Yes, good point. I suppose the only other option would be forcing people to pay with a credit card. That would still exclude some adults though.

WezV

digitalscream said:

WezV said:

The issue with VPNs and using other hosting services for me is that they are clearly going to be the next target for the government go after.

Sure, every business uses a VPN for valid reasons, but I dont expect that to stop them 

There are ways to shield VPNs from packet inspection, which would effectively make them undetectable to ISPs (the only way the government could enforce such a ban). There are also alternatives to VPNs which would easily defeat any measures the government tried to bring to bear, short of outlawing all network encryption for private individuals (which would be patently insane and wall us off from the entire rest of the world, thus crippling our economy).

None of this stops our government agencies from implementing stupid policies that make it all more difficult for no real reason.

I assume they will go down the whack a mole route at company level.  Any one tech savvy will always find another way, but the general population will still be at a disadvantage.

I've just added Proton VPN to my phone.  All I needed was an email address, no age, ID checks or personal details were needed.  What is to stop the ICO trying exactly what they have done with Imgur, and threaten investigations and fines  on these companies one at a time. All done in the name of child safety, until these services just decide the UK isn't a big enough market to bother with.

ecc83

More about this over at www.soundonsound.com

Dave.

TTony

digitalscream said:

 (which would be patently insane and wall us off from the entire rest of the world, thus crippling our economy).

You say that as if patent insanity is a reason government wouldn't do something.

The level of ignorance is frightening.  I think I'd prefer a professional, competent government rather than mass-elected power-hungry idiots.

In the commercial world, businesses are run by professionals; qualified, scrutinised, properly experienced and remunerated appropriately (in the most part) for the jobs that they do, in the interests of their shareholders.  OK, there are exceptions to that approach, but it generally holds true.  

Why do we expect that the whole country can be run by a bunch of amateurs paid less than many corporate middle management?

FX_Munkee

digitalscream said:

There are ways to shield VPNs from packet inspection, which would effectively make them undetectable to ISPs (the only way the government could enforce such a ban). There are also alternatives to VPNs which would easily defeat any measures the government tried to bring to bear, short of outlawing all network encryption for private individuals (which would be patently insane and wall us off from the entire rest of the world, thus crippling our economy).

In other news. They're dumber than you think: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c740r0m4mzjo

boogieman

RaymondLin said:

PhilKing said:

I hadn't realized that you couldn't see any the images from Imgur, as I live in the States, I do have a subscription here, so I can upload pics, which I will do going forwards.  If you need me to fix old pics, just let me know.

The issue isn't people in the UK can't upload or use IMGUR.  We still can, via a VPN.  The issue really lies in the fact the IMGUR, from a forum's perspective, is a image hosting platform (as opposed to looking a memes).  So unless everyone has and uses a VPN (which there are free ones, even as a plugin into a browser), then you can't guarantee people can see your images.

Which is annoying, it is like making a post in written form and not sure who can or cannot see it.  

Not everyone is IT literate, a lot of people still can't link a photo from IMGUR and post here, they paste the link to the page, instead of the image and into the forum's image tag button.  If you paste just the link, the photo only shows up as a link on the phone.

So the solution now are

1 - Use forum's own hosting.

Downside for this is that if I want to share the same photo on a different site, I still need to find a way to host it

2 - Find another hosting service.  I am using s3nd.pic at the moment now.

3 - Self host - which is the most secure way, but also the most expensive and a lot more IT steps involved.

4 - Force everyone to use a VPN.  Not going to happen.

5 - Don't bother with images at all. 

A few points . 

I admit to being a complete IT numpty and have no idea about VPN’s … I know what they are, just not how to install or use one. I’m sure I’m not the only one here. 

Imgur has been buggered for a while now, and way before the govt blocked it. They did something to the code link that stopped you posting a pic directly to the forum without a lot of fiddling around. So it wasn’t just people being stupid in that respect, it just got unworkable. 

I don’t think option 5 in your list is workable. Buyers generally want to see pics of what they’re getting, not only to assess the condition but also as reassurance that the seller actually has the item. (Yeah I know, pics can be poached off eBay etc).