replacement neck on a 335?

John_P · May 2016

Just seen this 335 on eBay with a replacement neck after the original was damaged in a fire.

I'm not knowledge enough about old gibsons to know if the story is true but the body is in very good condition for it's age.

Any thoughts?

matone · May 2016

Surely it would be dated from the label.

Skipped · May 2016

Authenticating a guitar body needs a real expert. Even for someone like Richard Henry it would surely be asking a lot. If that appraisal was inconclusive then the item is an expensive Orange Label.
PAF pickups is pushing the story a step too far IMO. If the pickup maker mentioned has confidently identified them as real PAFs then the grab a bargain comment is er.......nonsense.

ESchap · May 2016

Serial number dates it to late 1961. Horns look about right for that era. However, it appears that everything else is replaced and its a recent refinish to my eyes. I can't work out from his blurb if it it's the original PAF's got working by Shed, or if they are Shed standard pickups. Could be a great guitar, but it really is a parts-a-Gibson.

richardhomer · May 2016

Highly unlikely that the body finish is original - black was never an 'official' option in this period.

The bridge pick-up has a different shaped cover to the neck one (it's too rounded at the corners to be a real one from the period).

Do we know if the serial number on the headstock is the same as the one on the orange label (which is visible through the bass side f hole)?

It most probably is (at least broadly) as described.

The difficulty is knowing what it's worth.

John_P · May 2016

I asked the seller and he doesn't know who did the repair but he bought it from a collector/dealer called Heath - if that means anything to anyone.

and apparently the finish looks much older close up with the finish sinking into the wood, just looks better in the pics.

It will be interesting to see if it sells - If it was local and I could check it out I might have been interested.

ESchap · May 2016

Serial numbers are the same but the picture of the orange label isn't clear enough to see if its a repro.

richardhomer · May 2016

John_P;1057985" said:
apparently the finish looks much older close up with the finish sinking into the wood, just looks better in the pics.

Here are the official shipping totals:

http://www.es-335.net/shipping.html

No black ones are listed - though special order examples are known to exist (there's a picture of a '64 345 in black on the site).

I expect this is a refinish - albeit perhaps an old one.

It may well be a great player's guitar - but unlikely to sell for anything like 'collectors' money.

ICBM · May 2016

I doubt anything on it is original except for the body itself. It's certainly a refinish I think - entirely understandable if it had been in a fire.

At this point originality really doesn't matter at all, it's just a collection of parts which need to be assessed individually. Value is anyone's guess...

WezV · May 2016

The couple of shots inside the f-holes look remarkably clean . need more info/closeups

underdog · May 2016

With all that's been changed on it the value for me would be the same as a player grade 335 from the last decade or so.

Phil_aka_Pip · May 2016

underdog said:

With all that's been changed on it the value for me would be the same as a player grade 335 from the last decade or so.

... so long as the guitar is of player grade. You'd need to play it to find out. If the seller is genuine, you could contact him saying you'd like to bid but you want to come round and play it first.

shugz · May 2016

No affiliation with seller or guitar but I like that. It is what it is and if I'm reading the £1200 start as the lowest the seller would accept, it's not an awful deal is it?

Or am I missing something? Doesn't look a Far Eastern fake albeit certainly not a collector's piece.

Cheers
Hugh

312_JS · May 2016

If it is structurally sound, I'd buy that over any of the recent production.
If I haven't bought my '62 already, I'd be all over it.

DamianP · May 2016

If it had PAFs it would have to be very early '60s in which case the neck has the wrong headstock angle and the binding is far too thick. If it's an accurate replacement neck for the original then it is a late '60s guitar which wouldn't have had PAFs.

ICBM · May 2016

It's quite likely that whoever replaced the neck deliberately reduced the headstock angle - it's actually even flatter than a 70s one - if the cause of needing it was a badly broken headstock, so I don't think you can draw any conclusions from that.

I did when I repaired a '76 Thunderbird that needed a new section grafting in. I saw no point in repeating an original design fault when I had the opportunity to improve it.

It may also have been rebound if it had fire damage - being plastic it's very likely to have melted. But I agree with WezV that what you can apparently see through the f-holes looks suspiciously clean for it to have been in a fire...

DamianP · May 2016

ICBM said:

It's quite likely that whoever replaced the neck deliberately reduced the headstock angle - it's actually even flatter than a 70s one - if the cause of needing it was a badly broken headstock, so I don't think you can draw any conclusions from that.

I did when I repaired a '76 Thunderbird that needed a new section grafting in. I saw no point in repeating an original design fault when I had the opportunity to improve it.

It may also have been rebound if it had fire damage - being plastic it's very likely to have melted. But I agree with WezV that what you can apparently see through the f-holes looks suspiciously clean for it to have been in a fire...

More observations than conclusions. However the structural integrity of the neck might have been improved by changing the headstock angle, by doing so you've just de-valued the guitar significantly. I suppose someone might do that to an early '60s 335. Just not anyone I know who owns one. Whatever the story with the headstock, The the neck binding is inexcusable. I too struggle to imagine a fire so intense and localised that it rendered the neck irrepairable yet left the body undamaged.

ESBlonde · May 2016

If Gibson renecked the guitar back in the day it would have been with a current version of the headstock/angle off the line. Only in recent decades has there been any attention paid by them to historical authenticity.

meltedbuzzbox · May 2016

DamianP;1060228" said:
ICBM said:

It's quite likely that whoever replaced the neck deliberately reduced the headstock angle - it's actually even flatter than a 70s one - if the cause of needing it was a badly broken headstock, so I don't think you can draw any conclusions from that.

I did when I repaired a '76 Thunderbird that needed a new section grafting in. I saw no point in repeating an original design fault when I had the opportunity to improve it.

It may also have been rebound if it had fire damage - being plastic it's very likely to have melted. But I agree with WezV that what you can apparently see through the f-holes looks suspiciously clean for it to have been in a fire...

More observations than conclusions.

However the structural integrity of the neck might have been improved by changing the headstock angle, by doing so you've just de-valued the guitar significantly. I suppose someone might do that to an early '60s 335. Just not anyone I know who owns one.

Whatever the story with the headstock, The the neck binding is inexcusable.

I too struggle to imagine a fire so intense and localised that it rendered the neck irrepairable yet left the body undamaged.

It could have fallen out of a stand placed near an open fire and the neck could have landed in...

Elaborate? Yes. Possible, yes.

There is too much choice at 1200 quid to be nit picking over this possible (although unlikely) 60s body. Save your money and move on

312_JS · May 2016

Unlikely? I don't share your confusion..

John_P · May 2016

312_JS;1062804" said:
Unlikely? I don't share your confusion..

I'm curious what makes you certain about the body?

I'm not knowledgeable enough about them to judge it so genuinely interested. If it was local I'd have been tempted to go and try it and see how it plays and looks close up.

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replacement neck on a 335?

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