I have a 1999 Gibson Historic R4 Black Beauty I'm planning to sell (or possibly keep under the bed to sell at a later date).
A previous owner has changed the capacitors to Hovland Musicaps and done a fairly poor job—the wiring is not tidy, and one of the caps is slightly melted, presumably where they caught it with a hot soldering iron. I also fairly regularly have problems where a pot stops functioning correctly, so I think it's worth redoing everything neatly and making sure there are no dry joints.
I'd like to get the guitar back to original condition to prepare it for sale. What capacitors would the guitar have come with originally?
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Half Speed Solos: classic guitar solos demonstrated at half speed with scrolling tab and no waffle.
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If you're going to redo it with a view to selling the guitar - and even though it pains me to reward them for this nonsense - it might be worth spending the utterly ridiculous, stupid, dishonest ripoff price that Gibson want for their "reissue Bumblebees"... not because it makes the slightest difference to the tone whatever (especially not given that they're actually modern polypropylene caps inside the resin casings!) but because that's what a buyer who cares would want/expect. It could make more difference than the cost of the caps.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
Do you think that holds true even though those reissue Bumblebees weren't (as far as I know) available when this guitar was built? I would have thought 'original' was more important than 'better' here.
EDIT: Also Gibson's hyped-up marketing bollocks says they're late 50s models, and mine's a 1954 reissue.
For what it's worth the same chap who owns the Historic Custom also had a '98 Historic Junior, and that definitely had a ceramic cap, but I don't know if the Junior spec was the same.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
Didn't the originals have Grey Tigers?
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
A quick search reveals various companies making repos between £20 to £60.
It's all really a bit silly when they make no difference whatsoever to the function, but that's guitarists and originality for you…basically I would put in whatever an average buyer would expect to find in a Historic Gibson.
Obviously just my opinion. Actually if it was me, I'd just leave the Hovlands and tidy the wiring up.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
They are cheap crap wrapped in that case
There was a thread on mlp where someone took one apart
Just another gibson rip off and very dishonest imo
If you go down that route get luxe bumblebees at least they're proper pio
(formerly customkits)
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
The Russian pio caps are cheap and as good as the bumblebees
(formerly customkits)
In a guitar it makes no difference, they just look nice.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
Orange drops cheap ones pio etc
I'll have to do it again and record it and see what I think now
(formerly customkits)
its only when i did this that i was finally convinced there was no difference in type.
However, I went through a big bag of .022 ceramic disc caps and didn't find many close to the stated value - most were below at .015 -.018. whereas the orange drops, vintage caps and modern PIO's were much closer to what they should be. I tend to stick with orange drop or better.
I suspect the difference most people do hear when they change caps is down to the different values - although ICBM does say he doesn't even think this makes much difference as long as its within 20% of the stated value
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I'll just put what I want in as I'm building it
Same goes for amps and tonewood
I built 2 amps with all the same components apart from resistors
The one that sounded the best had a few carbon comps put in where they matter, my ears told me that
To some they wouldn't or couldn't care less
Same goes for the tonewood lot, apparantly it doesn't matter, it does to me but I won't change their mind no matter what I do
Just do what you want it's your stuff
(formerly customkits)
but I disagree it's the same as an active component in an amp (easier to test, definitely makes a difference) or anything like the tonewood debate ( very hard to test, but clear differences to anyone who has ears)
the guitar cap one is piss easy to test and makes no difference to sounds available... so I always ask if people have checked the rated value when they swear it does.
FYI, I still feel the sweep is different on some caps. Same sounds full on and full off, but I was less sure the in between settings were in the same place. ICBM will still tell me I am wrong, that's okay.
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I wonder with 50's wiring it seems different because it cleans up better to my ears
I'll only ever do 50's because it sounds better to me and I like the more interactive controls
(formerly customkits)
Cap type doesn't. It's very easy to prove it for yourself with a switch, as Wez said. You can compare two caps of the same value at any settings of the volume and tone controls and you will never hear any difference.
I can't remember if I tested two caps at 20% above *and* below the marked value at the same time - I don't think so, and I would expect that to be audible - but up to 20% between the two didn't seem to be.
I also like to use the 'right' caps by the way! Even expensive ones are a fairly small cost if you're rewiring a single guitar, although it might start to matter if you're building a lot. Nothing to do with tone, just 'mojo' or whatever you call it...
Cap types certainly can make a difference in some positions in amp circuits though - because the conditions are totally different... self-distortion is a factor, which it isn't in a guitar. The same is true for resistor types in some positions, eg plate load resistors.
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein
Tbh though I'm happy with pio caps, I got a bag of 50 Russian ones that work out at something like 75 pence each
(formerly customkits)
"Take these three items, some WD-40, a vise grip, and a roll of duct tape. Any man worth his salt can fix almost any problem with this stuff alone." - Walt Kowalski
"Only two things are infinite - the universe, and human stupidity. And I'm not sure about the universe." - Albert Einstein