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Yep. Agree with all this. I had a straight choice eventually between the Helix and the AX8. I went AX8 because of the larger number of amp models and because I just preferred the sound of the models and FX sufficiently to sacrifice the greater flexibility of the Helix for the sound of the AX8. That said, make no mistake, the Helix sounds fantastic. My quick pros and cons:
AX8
Pros - number of amp models, sound and quality of models and fx, ease of use (primarily with the editor but I also edit on the fly - the amp controls help a lot with this), form factor, reliability (so far!)
Cons - Not as easy to use as the Helix, limited to one amp at a time (although 2 in a patch with X/Y switching), scenes are not as flexible as the Helix (although I've yet to find anything I can't do that I want to), no audio interface, limited i/o compared to the Helix and only one external pedal loop
Of course, a lot of the "cons" of an AX8 go away if you go for full AxeFX rack unit, but I'm inclined to agree with @Roland that the better option might be AX8 (and Helix vs AX8 is certainly the fairer comparison).
Helix
Pros - very easy to use (just the best interface I've ever seen), incredibly flexible, audio interface included, loads of I/O, loops for external pedals that work really well, sounds great, you can cram a lot in a patch (inc 2 amps), snapshots are v flexible, it has an expression pedal on board
Cons - limited number of amp models compared to the Fractal stuff, to me doesn't sound quite as good as the Fractal stuff but plenty will tell you it does
Having owned both I also think that the Ax8 feels like a bit of pro audio gear and the Helix perhaps a bit more top end consumer electronics, if that makes sense? However, this is subjective impression only and I have absolutely no insight into failure rates or anything else substantial to support this.
Short answer is, you can't go wrong.
This link should take you to the start of the 3 part playlist. He compares a lot of different styles of amp, there are always going to be things you could do to make each unit sound better/worse but I think he does a pretty fair overview.
In terms of user interface for the Helix I'd watch some of Drew's videos. I seem to remember @Jonathanthomas83 has commented about Strymon pedals at some point - some really good comparisons in here and you can see the interface being tweaked in real time
I'm not actually sure who has done a good run through of the Fractal interface, a lot of videos tend to show the desktop editor. The AX8 is a bit easier as it has more dedicated controls. However the AX8 doesn't have as much power as the Axe FX 2, which may or may not be an issue depending on how you intend to use it. Comparison here - http://wiki.fractalaudio.com/axefx2/index.php?title=AX8_versus_Axe-Fx_II
There has definitely been a market shift for people wanting versatility. A number of people now using Kemper/Helix/Fractal units were the people buying 3 and 4 channel 100 watt amps 10 years ago.
So right now lots of really capable, very versatile high wattage heads have very poor resale value right now. Unless it is flavour of the month (like when Friedman hit the market).
It seems more portable, basic valve combos do a bit better in resale by comparison, as a broad generalisation
https://www.youtube.com/user/amberience/videos
I'm shying away from the AX8 and floor stuff, I think I'd rather a rack, and would definitely prefer the full functionality of the AxeFX rack. If I'm giving up all my gear, I want the best I can get in whatever product I choose.
@Roland and @kjdowd thank you for the very informative posts. Your experience of the AxeFX stuff is valuable.
I honestly don't think I'm going to get away from the fact that I may need to do the 30 day thing. Shame!
View my feedback at www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/comment/1201922
Mate, if YOU are looking at your pedals going "WTF am I doing?", all bets are off, as I know how carefully you've been assembling your effects.
The amp caused me to think this way. Even though I love that too, when it works.
View my feedback at www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/comment/1201922
View my feedback at www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/comment/1201922
There are new delays on the way that are meant to be a big improvement on the existing ones.
Are there going to be any updates to the Kemper reverbs?
I thought my amp and pedalboard sounded sublime too, and I'm sure it sounded great but since I've got the Helix my guitar sound both at home, rehearsing and at gigs is definitely a LOT better. So much better that the amps and pedals I thought I'd hang on to are all sold or up for sale because owning them is pointless.
that's not quite what I was doing though..
I did a few mods on a MkIIC and a JCM800
what I did to them was to place the master volume 'post phase inverter' [standard they are pre phase inverter]
and I swapped the power valves in the JCM to KT88's to soften the extreme highs a little
those two mid-gain amps then turned into hi-gain monsters..
the hot-rodded MkIIC in particular makes that wonderful early EVH tone
I had lots of valve amps, now I only have a few
I play the Axefx more. I think it excels in cleaner sounds, metal sounds and the FX are stunning
Kemper is stronger for OD and fully saturated amps, still OK for some clean and metal, FX are poor I think
so it depends what your sound is
Axe Fx is good but they all have a sort of signature sound and I find the amps can sound a bit samey. If you like what it does though then it's a great choice.
Helix is amazing to use and the effects are some of the best out the lot but the amp sims are poor relations of the other two, sorry to say. Also had big reliability issues with the Helix.
Easiest to use is Helix and Kemper. If you're just after a good amp tone Kemper is easy, just load a profile and go. Helix interface is fantastic though.
Axe Fx is a nightmare usability wise. It's not even the interface, it's the fact that the levels are a nightmare to set and everything you do changes depending on what new block you add. Sure you can do loads of cool stuff, but when it takes two hours to do the cool stuff you just end up getting pissed off.
Kemper Profiling Amp - is it ethical? Food for Thought !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkf4kXVkZekKemper Profiling Amp - is it ethical? Food for Thought !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rkf4kXVkZek