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Installing drivers and applications is similarly quicker, because of the repository model.
Not arguing, just explaining what I meant
And that was the way it was until all the weirdos died out and CLI land was no more.
Offset "(Emp) - a little heavy on the hyperbole."
Weird that I spent 3 hours fucking about with it and put it in a drawer then.
I'd say Linux without command line is like driving a convertible but never putting the top down. It's not totally insane but you may be missing the point.
Given that Microsoft have just updated Windows 10 to add in the Linux command line your argument is clearly invalid.
But short of every windows program having virtually limitless options and parameters which can be pain-stakingly and slowly copy-pasted from one to another... perhaps with a button to auto-sort the contents of the clipboard
You have no idea of what that means or what it's doing - or why you needed to do this in the first place when you would expect the OS to not need you to type cryptic incantations into the dark command portal in order to get it to just behave properly.
I spent years growing up on DOS. Then Windows came along and I learned that. Now I'm presented with an OS that is trying so hard to be a mainstream GUI OS yet can't / doesn't want to let go of reliance on the CLI - in a language and fornat that is about as unintuitive as you can get. MS may well have added a Linux CLI, but who is going to use it ? People who know how to talk *-ix. - and that's probably 0.0001% of the Win10 userbase.
What it boils down to is I really really want to love Linux. I love it's ideology and ethos (if those are the right words). I love the fact that it can resurrect old hardware that is useless for the bloatware that comes out of Redmond. I really really do want to switch to Linux, but I just don't have the time or the patience to learn, what is to me, the equivalent of Hebrew, in order to use it. I hate the idea of being reliant on Linux gurus to spoon-feed me instructions to get it to work. I need to know what I'm doing.
But I need to learn Hebrew first and I'm not willing to invest that amount of time. It's just an OS at the end of the day. It's a platform that supports the things you are really interested in - the applications on top.
That's why I hate Linux. Because I think it's fantastic, but it's so alien to me and I fucking hate Hebrew.
Offset "(Emp) - a little heavy on the hyperbole."
Except I don't "hate" Linux it's just that I don't have the time to learn to love it.
If you want to get the full Linux experience you have to put the effort in and learn it. There are plenty of good books on the subject, but if you don't it's no crime.
Also it's not really fair to compare a Linux PC cobbled together from bits by an amateur to a Windows PC to a vendor. Buy something from a dedicated Linux PC supplier and you will have a much better experience.
It's done with bcdedit and bcdboot commands. There exists no GUI option in Windows. Even just changing from the blue W8/W10 version of a boot menu (which includes options that you might not want an end user to access) to the old style black-and-white boot menu takes a command line input - "bcdedit /set {ID} bootmenupolicy legacy" incidently)... oh, and to edit the bcd store
You can do pretty much everything Windows does without using CLI at all...
As for the format of CLI - it's very logical... but there are ways to shorten what you type which might then look illogical.
In both Windows and Linux you can get by without CLI, but its pretty much essential for any power-user use-case (for both if that wasn't clear)
The format of *-ix CLI is very logical ?? Maybe to a University undergraduate in Forensic Computing it might be (i.e. you) - but to the rest of humanity without a Borg hive for a brain, it's gibberish ! I can write some rather nice complex batch files in DOS/Windows, but I can barely list the contents of an archive in Linux. Part of the reason *-ix commands are so cryptic is the shortening of everything - instead of "copy", it's "cp", "list" become "ls" and so on. An artifact from the days when people in flares and tie-dies had to type instructions in on a 110 baud mechanical teletype machine.
Finally, I refute your assertion that you can get by in Linux without the CLI. I've not managed more than fifteen minutes with any distro from a fresh install before I need to open the bloody bonnet and get the spanners out.
Offset "(Emp) - a little heavy on the hyperbole."
There is absolutely no need for the CLI in Linux for anything short of power user stuff, but it's a damn sight quicker to use it if you want to. For example...in Windows, you could go clicking around to get the IP address of all the network interfaces on your machine, but it'd be a hell of a lot quicker to just open a terminal and type ipconfig. You probably find yourself doing that a fair bit, right?
Why is it any different in Linux? Answer: it's not, but with Windows you spent years acquiring knowledge about its terminal incidentally. The fact that Linux is different (and you can do everything with the CLI, instead of the limited applications of Windows' terminal) scares you, that's all.
Here's the thing - if you stopped and looked at it rationally, you'd see that all you need to know are a five or six basic commands and a couple of basic principles, and you'd be able to understand pretty much any Linux commands you see (or be able to work them out, and therefore learn more as you go).
Want to do anythibg out if the ordinary (sat prat about with a programming language) and you are immersed in the Cli for ages to get it working.
Now I've used Unix/Linux since the early 90s so it doesn't scare me but it's still a pain in the arse.
The problem is, is that it is an OS written by geeks for geeks.
Apple have gotten it right having created a decent front end to Open-BSD, the Unix shell is there if you need/want it but hidden to the rest if the world.
I never knew you could do so little with a computer until I discovered Microsoft.
@Emp_Fab I suppose you think you should be able to play a guitar without learning such dullities as chord arpeggio and scale shapes ... well, I suppose you can but you'll probably progress no further than playing punk
Seriously: If you value it, take/fetch it yourself
Your argument is flawed though. You are comparing the ability to play guitar well by knowing scales and arpeggios etc to the ability to operate a Linux machine proficiently by learning the Hebrew that is the Linux CLI.
The difference is that I don’t want to be the Django of Linux. I’d be happy with being the Bert Weedon Book 1 of Linux, but, unlike Windows, you get to page three and it’s up with the bonnet time.
What I need is a video explanation of the file system of Linux (tech books render me comatose in minutes), what the basic commands are and who is this bloody Colonel is who keeps needing to be updated ?
As @Axe_meister said, it’s an OS written by geeks for geeks, and if there’s one immutable truth it’s this; Geeks have the communication skills of a 90yr old Glaswegian whose lost his false teeth after 16 pints. Those who know Linux can’t speak “Layperson” and those that can speak Layperson know sod all about Linux.
Offset "(Emp) - a little heavy on the hyperbole."
I'll predict I'll be back shortly with some new swear words.
Offset "(Emp) - a little heavy on the hyperbole."
Stock production guitars are like a GUI - all the same, user friendly and you get what you get.
A custom build can be complicated to spec out and you really need to take the time to work out all your choices. Linux gives you so many options, and lets you get right into it at command line - so very customisable, but more complex.
Horses and courses I think
http://downtoearthlinux.com/posts/the-essential-guide-to-the-linux-filesystem/
...while referring to Windows where necessary.
One one system software is installed to /etc on another to/var on another somewhere completely different.
If you want a user friendly Unix variant then get MacOS, or use PowerShell/bash under windows 10