The humble shielded hook up wire

Seziertisch · December 2020

Interesting article this, never knew about the cloth insulation absorbing moisture and capacitance being increased as a result

https://www.premierguitar.com/articles/29763-How-to-Upgrade-Your-Gibson-with-Vintage-Style-Wire

Funkfingers · December 2020

Soon to be available in NOS, Parts Drawer Dusted and "Relic".

ICBM · December 2020

Bollocks. The whole point of it being wax-impregnated is to prevent that.

It's also easy to work with, not tricky.

Kittyfrisk · December 2020

So, guitar techs need to add a moisture probe to their test kits

SteveRobinson · December 2020

The article actually says that the wire's *resistance* increases with moisture which is surely ridiculous.

ICBM · December 2020

SteveRobinson said:

The article actually says that the wire's *resistance* increases with moisture which is surely ridiculous.

If there was any moisture uptake it would *decrease* the resistance between core and shield.

Seziertisch · December 2020

ICBM said:

Bollocks. The whole point of it being wax-impregnated is to prevent that.

It's also easy to work with, not tricky.

The black cotton layer is wax impregnated but the white celanese layer inside it isn’t, I don’t think.

ICBM · December 2020

Seziertisch said:

The black cotton layer is wax impregnated but the white celanese layer inside it isn’t, I don’t think.

And if it's inside the waxed layer, still can't absorb moisture...

Seziertisch · December 2020

ICBM said:

Seziertisch said:

The black cotton layer is wax impregnated but the white celanese layer inside it isn’t, I don’t think.

And if it's inside the waxed layer, still can't absorb moisture...

I haven’t tested it, but I never had the impression that Gibson-style hook up wire was airtight. The waxed layer is relatively loose.

I’d be very surprised that if it was stored somewhere with highish ambient moisture levels for a long enough period the white celanese would get damp/take in some of that moisture.

What effect that moisture in contact with the core would have on the signal passing through it, I don’t know, but I’m sure it must have some as water is also conductive.

ICBM · December 2020

Seziertisch said:

What effect that moisture in contact with the core would have on the signal passing through it, I don’t know, but I’m sure it must have some as water is also conductive.

Yes, but even if it was possible then the waxed layer would remain insulating. If the celanese layer got very damp it would potentially be conductive enough to reduce the insulation thickness to that of the waxed layer only, which would increase the capacitance slightly, but would have no other effect on the cable properties.

This type of cable was designed and used for voltages up to several hundred volts in equipment, and doesn't degrade significantly over decades - it's a complete non-issue at guitar voltages.

This is an absolute red herring - I would be far more worried about the effect of moisture on the rest of the electrics and even the wood than the cable, and if you're storing it somewhere where any of it is likely, don't!

Also, *pure* water is *not* conductive, which might surprise some people. The only reason water is normally conductive is because of dissolved salts.

Seziertisch · December 2020

ICBM said:

Seziertisch said:

What effect that moisture in contact with the core would have on the signal passing through it, I don’t know, but I’m sure it must have some as water is also conductive.

Yes, but even if it was possible then the waxed layer would remain insulating. If the celanese layer got very damp it would potentially be conductive enough to reduce the insulation thickness to that of the waxed layer only, which would increase the capacitance slightly, but would have no other effect on the cable properties.

I think there’s an error in the article, it says the moisture would increase resistance when he probably meant capacitance, which is what would cause high end roll off.

How slight that would be and whether it would be noticeable i don’t know. I suppose if you look at how many feet of cable are in a wiring loom, it might add up if moisture had seeped into the whole thing.

ICBM · December 2020

Seziertisch said:

How slight that would be and whether it would be noticeable i don’t know. I suppose if you look at how many feet of cable are in a wiring loom, it might add up if moisture had seeped into the whole thing.

We're talking picofarads I would think. A different guitar cable (ie to the amp) will have more effect.

But I still don't think moisture take-up is even an issue, so it's moot - just more vintage guitar nonsense.

Sassafras · December 2020

Now I know not to go swimming with my SG.

ICBM · December 2020

Sassafras said:

Now I know not to go swimming with my SG.

Image: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a1/1d/23/a11d23b8874e5384fe9702ccbab8942c.jpg

Kittyfrisk · December 2020

^ Earlier sponsored prototype version of the modern weight belt.

Funkfingers · December 2020

Seziertisch said:

cloth insulation … capacitance

Spot the deliberate mistake.

Kittyfrisk said:

a moisture probe

Ooh, er, missus!

springhead · December 2020

Funkfingers said:

Seziertisch said:

cloth insulation … capacitance

Spot the deliberate mistake.

There'll be capacitance between the core and the braid that's outside the cloth.

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The humble shielded hook up wire

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