Windows 11 is dog shit

olafgarten · October 2021

PolarityMan said:

I'm in no rush, I'll let everyone else find the bugs

I'm in the same boat, my desktop is too old to be upgraded but I was probably going to replace that in about a year (when GPU prices are hopefully back to normal).

I'm holding off for my laptop though for at least a few months.

axisus · October 2021

I could shorten that to Windows is dog sh*t personally.

I've used macs all my life and the interface has always been a thing of beauty. Microsoft seem to me to be the most underachieving developer ever. Whatever version of Windows the throw out still seems like something from the 80s to me, and the same for their useless software - Word, PPT, Excel. They've moved about 3 years in 3 decades.

Having said that, I don't cover Apple in glory, they make horrible decisions.

Offset · October 2021

I'd never be an early adopter of a new operating system.

olafgarten · October 2021

axisus said:

I could shorten that to Windows is dog sh*t personally.

I've used macs all my life and the interface has always been a thing of beauty. Microsoft seem to me to be the most underachieving developer ever. Whatever version of Windows the throw out still seems like something from the 80s to me, and the same for their useless software - Word, PPT, Excel. They've moved about 3 years in 3 decades.

Having said that, I don't cover Apple in glory, they make horrible decisions.

I think apple and Microsoft have very different priorities when it comes to an OS.

For Windows their main customers are large enterprises who don't want change, they just want things to work the same way they have always done because it's cheaper. With Windows 11 they have actually taken some bold steps and broke stuff more then they have done before, and it also seems that they are improving things in the backend to try and improve performance from what is essentially the same basic kernel that has been around since the 90s.

Apple on the other hand aren't as afraid to break things, and as they control the devices they know exactly what will/won't work on their systems. The users of Apple devices are either general consumers who are less resistant to change, or have some specific need to use MacOS and so will put up with the changes.

PolarityMan · October 2021

Offset said:

I'd never be an early adopter of a new operating system.

I stay on the latest stable on fedora but for windows i prefer everyone else to get their support sorted first.

Lestratcaster · October 2021

Does Windows 11 come as an interval update? I really hate Windows updates cos they mess with drivers and stuff esp with my Focusrite ones.

Bod · October 2021

Lestratcaster said:

Does Windows 11 come as an interval update? I really hate Windows updates cos they mess with drivers and stuff esp with my Focusrite ones.

It will do eventually, but they're offering it in stages. Nobody's going to force you to upgrade though, the upgrade is offered independently of normal security updates.

FWIW, I'm running a 2nd gen Scarlett 18i8 and it's fine following the upgrade.

roberty · October 2021

olafgarten said:

axisus said:

I could shorten that to Windows is dog sh*t personally.

I've used macs all my life and the interface has always been a thing of beauty. Microsoft seem to me to be the most underachieving developer ever. Whatever version of Windows the throw out still seems like something from the 80s to me, and the same for their useless software - Word, PPT, Excel. They've moved about 3 years in 3 decades.

Having said that, I don't cover Apple in glory, they make horrible decisions.

I think apple and Microsoft have very different priorities when it comes to an OS.

For Windows their main customers are large enterprises who don't want change, they just want things to work the same way they have always done because it's cheaper. With Windows 11 they have actually taken some bold steps and broke stuff more then they have done before, and it also seems that they are improving things in the backend to try and improve performance from what is essentially the same basic kernel that has been around since the 90s.

Apple on the other hand aren't as afraid to break things, and as they control the devices they know exactly what will/won't work on their systems. The users of Apple devices are either general consumers who are less resistant to change, or have some specific need to use MacOS and so will put up with the changes.

Windows Enterprise costs more one of the the main differences is you can manage your own updates. Basically you pay a premium to not have the latest updates installed. Hilarious

digitalscream · October 2021

Well, it definitely doesn't affect me, but...the idea of artificially-forced hardware upgrades for Windows seems in total opposition to the idea of PCs in the first place, especially when Win 11 comes with performance downgrades. I'm not convinced that stuff like auto-HDR will be enough to make people upgrade.

It does come at an interesting time, though - with Valve/Steam pushing gaming on Linux hard and others beginning to follow suit, and the silicon shortages making it harder (and more expensive) to make the required upgrades, this could've been quite the misstep from Microsoft.

Axe_meister · October 2021

MS have already released a blog on how to sidestep TPM.
It really is just a new skin on windows 10 with some odd decision regarding interface changes that really did not need to change.
Have not had any issues so far in terms of stability and performance issues. It's rock solid.
Waiting for a performance fix for AMD processors not that I have noticed a difference.
I'm actually swapping my MacBook for a Windows laptop at work. Excel runs like a dog on Mac.
As someone who spends a lot of time in the weeds of an OS I find MacOS rather restricted and Finder is absolute crap compared to Windows Explorer, although I do wish MS would get away from drive letters.
I'm also glad MS released storage spaces on desktop windows and the Linux Subsystem is great.
I also like the fact you can use it in touch screen mode.

guitartango · October 2021

It's nice to see that Micro$haft want you to throw away your old laptop and buy new (unless you do have TPM2). I spend more time using KDE on Linux, then rebooting into Windows.

digitalscream · October 2021

Axe_meister said:

It really is just a new skin on windows 10 with some odd decision regarding interface changes that really did not need to change.

....

Axe_meister said:

MS have already released a blog on how to sidestep TPM.
...
Waiting for a performance fix for AMD processors

You shouldn't have to hack around in the registry to get an upgrade. And, if you can do that at all, then it's not a functional requirement of the software and thus shouldn't be mandated in the first place.

There are multiple problems with the AMD CPU kernel handling, which are utterly ridiculous and simply show a lack of testing - a 5% performance hit under normal circumstances, and up to 15% in games, which can easily take a lot of games from "playable" to "completely unplayable". Maintenance of cache latency and the CPU scheduler are basic functions which have been present for years in all operating systems.

Dropped network packets, memory leaks, inconsistent and buggy user interface, a broken hypervisor...these are all things that simply shouldn't happen in a modern operating system. Hell, they wouldn't even happen in an Apple software update!

It's not just Win10 with a different skin.

thecolourbox · October 2021

Well my laptop has decided to tell me it's not compatible with the minimum requirements for Windows 11, 2 of the reasons sound like they could be fixed (Secure Boot and TPM) but apparently my processor is not good enough. Google suggests it's a 3rd generation i5.

Which is a bit of a relief in some ways, for now at least, because despite the usual "you'll have a choice whether to install it or not" nonsense, they removed that choice very suddenly when forcing me to downgrade from W7 to W10 when they changed the notification layout. And I suspect they will do similar again this time to be honest

crunchman · October 2021

thecolourbox said:

Well my laptop has decided to tell me it's not compatible with the minimum requirements for Windows 11, 2 of the reasons sound like they could be fixed (Secure Boot and TPM) but apparently my processor is not good enough. Google suggests it's a 3rd generation i5.

Which is a bit of a relief in some ways, for now at least, because despite the usual "you'll have a choice whether to install it or not" nonsense, they removed that choice very suddenly when forcing me to downgrade from W7 to W10 when they changed the notification layout. And I suspect they will do similar again this time to be honest

3rd gen i5 will also be on an older motherboard, so it probably won't have later TPM that is required.

3rd gen is getting quite long in the tooth now. Must be about 10 years.

Sleepyscholar · October 2021

I'm surprised no one has yet pointed out the golden Windows rule:

Windows XP -- OK
Windows Vista -- Shit
Windows 7 -- OK
Windows 8 -- Shit
Windows 10 -- OK
Windows 11 -- ?

Wake me up when Windows 12 hoves into view, will you?

Springywheel · October 2021

Why go up to 11, why not just take 10 and make it better?

PetGerbil · October 2021

Springywheel said:

Why go up to 11, why not just take 10 and make it better?

But, this goes to 11.

Philtre · October 2021

Philtre said:

And I woke up too early and there's no coffee.

I had a lie-in and found some coffee.

It's still dog shit.

RaymondLin · October 2021

Sleepyscholar said:

I'm surprised no one has yet pointed out the golden Windows rule:

Windows XP -- OK
Windows Vista -- Shit
Windows 7 -- OK
Windows 8 -- Shit
Windows 10 -- OK
Windows 11 -- ?

Wake me up when Windows 12 hoves into view, will you?

It's almost like 2 steps forward, 1 step back.

They make a good one, then try something new and realise people hates it...so they fix it and combine what was good from the previous 2 to make the 3rd one good.

Rinse and repeat.

Emp_Fab · October 2021

Why this need (other than commercial) to keep releasing new operating systems? It's like the clothes wash situation - whites, whiter than white! Super-duper-ultra-brilliant whites.... Piss off.... Give us an OS that works and invest in keeping it secure and updated. And stop dicking about with the GUI!!

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Windows 11 is dog shit

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