These two amps... what do you think?

Drew_TNBD · September 2014

https://www.dropbox.com/s/azdecwhzkgofgql/D-Moll_A.wav?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/i1i225wq1oiwqey/D-Moll_B.wav?dl=0

One is a valve amp. The Diezel D-Moll. The other is a digital recreation of that valve amp, tweaked to match the real thing. Can you hear a difference?

steamabacus · September 2014

That second link doesn't work.

ROOG · September 2014

Sorry I can't play either, @Drew_fx, have you acquired a Kemper then?

stickyfiddle · September 2014

BIAS Desktop matching beta?

Drew_TNBD · September 2014

2nd one fixed!

steamabacus · September 2014

I prefer B.

It has more 'depth', sounds more '3-dimensional' more 'open' (talking about sound is pretty difficult really). I wouldn't say either of them sounds more or less real or artificial but the second one is definitely more pleasing to my ears. Without knowing that one is real and one modelled, I might easily believe the differences were in the eq'ing or reverb plug-in used.

B wins for me, though.

ICBM · September 2014

I can hear *a* difference, but I'm not sure which is the real amp

.

I prefer the second one - it's more open and resonant and has more 'girth' on the low notes, and seems to be a more 'unified' sound. The first one is tighter and seems to have more of a separation between the picking and the wall of distortion. So I would say the second one is the real amp.

Or it could be that the slightly over-resonant low notes on the second one are the result of the processing struggling to keep up

.

Not sure. I wouldn't have been able to say for sure that I thought either of them was digital, anyway.

Drew_TNBD · September 2014

Interesting that you guys can hear a difference. I'm really struggling. Sometimes I think there is, and then I go over to the other clip and the difference disappears... I do hear a bit of a difference in clip B; the low is a bit more thumpy and the pick attack comes through a bit more. But I'm not convinced that this couldn't be matched closer with some EQ changes and a tad less gain.
Also clip A is about 3dB quieter than clip B. Could also account for it.

Anymore for anymore?

ICBM · September 2014

This is probably over-reading into it what I think I'm hearing, but in B it sounds like there's less speaker damping, hence the resonance on the low notes, the attack and the slightly greater openness - not as controlled a sound, and more characteristic of a valve power amp. (I like that.)

A sounds more 'processed', controlled and there seems to be more of a separation between the picking and the sustained notes which are both more 'linear' and don't seem to interact as much, which is something I hear in solid-state distortion when it's trying to be amp-like. (I don't like that.)

I don't think I'd have any difficulty telling them apart because the resonance on B is quite distinctive, but I will be amused if I'm wrong about which is which

.

ThePrettyDamned · September 2014

Is the valve one a mic'd amp, or are you running it into an IR?

Just wondering. I can't really hear much difference, it's there but super subtle. If you used both in one song, I wouldn't notice the change!

guitarfishbay · September 2014

I level matched them in Logic before listening.

They're not exactly the same - B is more 'relaxed'/open sounding in the mids. I'm putting money on it being the real amp. Usually the Kemper profiles are a bit more defined and upfront. B has more bass too, but I've yet to hear a profile made with the latest firmware (the last one had less upper bass and more sub bass IIRC).

A sounds good, and a bit more in your face and the low end doesn't punch quite as much. Mids are more aggressive though and if anything I sometimes think Kemper profiles sound better for metal because of this.

Very close - if you didn't give an A/B and just presented either or I'd say they were good and definitely useable tones.

Drew_TNBD · September 2014

So how much money are you guys putting on B being the real amp?

guitarfishbay · September 2014

Not much.

guitarfishbay · September 2014

Is B the Axe? Conspiracy theory.

steamabacus · September 2014

Even if B isn't the 'real' amp, it's easy enough to maintain one's predudices by blaming the mic'ing/recording. I mean. real valve amps are always better, aren't they?
:P

monquixote · September 2014

I prefer B as well though no idea which one is the real one.

guitarfishbay · September 2014

Are you guys who prefer B compensating for the level mismatch? It isn't quite fair otherwise and exaggerates the differences. In general with two similar sounds we prefer louder in an A/B conent for some psychological reason I can't remember how to explain.

ICBM · September 2014

guitarfishbay said:

Are you guys who prefer B compensating for the level mismatch? It isn't quite fair otherwise and exaggerates the differences. In general with two similar sounds we prefer louder in an A/B conent for some psychological reason I can't remember how to explain.

I didn't realise there was a level difference… I assumed Drew had normalised them. Oops.

You're quite right that if there is, the slightly louder one will sound 'better' even if they're identical - I think it tends to increase the perception of bottom-end, too. Although I think there really is a difference in this case.

guitarfishbay · September 2014

There is - but it is less pronounced when matched.

Drew_TNBD · September 2014

So people are saying they prefer B, but no-one is going all out and saying which the real amp is and which the digital modeller is.

BTW: Yes, the real amp was mic'd up.

ICBM · September 2014

I do think B is the real amp.

But I will not be surprised to be proved wrong

.

Howdy, Stranger!

Categories

In this Discussion

Become a Subscriber!

These two amps... what do you think?

Comments