Like driving? Like driving fast? I'm going to ruin your evening.

Emp_Fab

Nitefly said:

I suspect a lot of people get caught because they don't clearly know the rules about when/how speed limits change - I know I didn't until I went on a speed awareness course, about 4 years ago.

I did the course a fortnight ago.  I enjoyed it tbh.

I know what you mean and it's really easy once it's explained how you can work out the speed limit anywhere without signs.

Rule 1: Signs override everything

Next, ask yourself three questions; 

• Is it a motorway ?
• Is there a system of streetlights ? (three or more visible) ?
  
• Is it a dual-carriageway ?

So, in the absence of any signs telling you otherwise;

If it's a motorway, it's 70
If there is a system of streetlights, it's 30
If it's a dual-carriageway, it's 70 and on a single-carriageway, it's 60.

That's it.

I was surprised at the number on the course who didn't know how to identify a dual-carriageway; several thought it was down to the number of lanes on either side, but, if you don't know, it's just a road where there is a barrier of some sort between the opposing traffic - be it crash barriers, grass, gravel - anything that stops the road from being an unbroken width of tarmac.

Garthy

guitarfishbay said:

It won't dissuade anyone until they've been caught at least once. I still see as many people on their phones 

It's low hanging fruit. This anti speeding movement has been going on for 20 years yet road standards are getting worse all the time, it's almost as if there are a lot of problems contributing to our road woes but it's too much effort when you can put a copper on overtime in a van to babysit a camera dishing out revenue - sorry fines, and informing these child slaying maniacs 14 days after the event that they covered a bit of land in 8 seconds instead of 9.

I'd rather that same copper put as much effort into nicking cunts on the phone, HGVs who just change lanes regardless of the vehicles beside them, or bus drivers for being cretins. 

I've seen some sights today from a wide range of road users, none of which are solved by a donut wagon and a 14 day NIP so tomorrow I'll see more of the same fuckwittery. 

FreddieVanHalen

Garthy said:

guitarfishbay said:

It won't dissuade anyone until they've been caught at least once. I still see as many people on their phones 

It's low hanging fruit. This anti speeding movement has been going on for 20 years yet road standards are getting worse all the time, it's almost as if there are a lot of problems contributing to our road woes but it's too much effort when you can put a copper on overtime in a van to babysit a camera dishing out revenue - sorry fines, and informing these child slaying maniacs 14 days after the event that they covered a bit of land in 8 seconds instead of 9.

I'd rather that same copper put as much effort into nicking cunts on the phone, HGVs who just change lanes regardless of the vehicles beside them, or bus drivers for being cretins. 

I've seen some sights today from a wide range of road users, none of which are solved by a donut wagon and a 14 day NIP so tomorrow I'll see more of the same fuckwittery. 

^^ This. But I guess it's easier to measure some kind of number (speed) than subjective driving standards.

There are plenty of times and places where it's safe for a skilled driver to go well above the posted limits, but whatever. If there are loads of unskilled drivers and not enough resources for policing how does it all get managed?

Bring on the self driving cars. I stopped enjoying driving about 15 years ago when the sheer volume of traffic and apparent lack of care for driving skill and standards from other road users made driving a chore rather than a pleasure.

Bucket

RiftAmps said:

Bucket said:

I should probably knock that on the head but really, 70 feels fucking slow and I have places to be.

If a member of your family was killed by a driver and they gave this as their reason for speeding, would that be acceptable to you?

No, admittedly. Motorways are the safest roads though, with the fewest serious or fatal accidents.

I wouldn't dream of going significantly over the speed limit in any situation where it was more likely I could injure someone.

mellowsun

The speed limit is a limit, not a target speed. I despise people who speed in residential areas. I'd make the limit 20 in all built up areas.

Motorways though I think 70 is too low.

Garthy

mellowsun said:

The speed limit is a limit, not a target speed. I despise people who speed in residential areas. I'd make the limit 20 in all built up areas.

Motorways though I think 70 is too low.

A broad brush would not always work, 20 in some residential roads is still to quick yet in other built up areas 20 would just be silly. Our road is 30 with a GATSO camera a few doors down, of all the problems we have in the Immediate area, speed just isn't one of them. Impatience and fuckwittery are significant problems though but you can't measure either. 

stimpsonslostson

mellowsun said:

The speed limit is a limit, not a target speed. I despise people who speed in residential areas. I'd make the limit 20 in all built up areas.

Motorways though I think 70 is too low.

Most of Edinburgh city centre has recently become a 20 zone. With NO noticeable effect on the actual speeds being driven. 
I'm expecting a targeted driver awareness campaign sometime soon- they did one for phone use recently & stopped enough folk that word went round & had an impact. 

Sporky

FreddieVanHalen said: 

There are plenty of times and places where it's safe for a skilled driver to go well above the posted limits, but whatever. If there are loads of unskilled drivers and not enough resources for policing how does it all get managed?

Thing is, pretty much everyone thinks they're an above average driver. They can't all be right.

ESchap

stimpsonslostson said:

mellowsun said:

The speed limit is a limit, not a target speed. I despise people who speed in residential areas. I'd make the limit 20 in all built up areas.

Motorways though I think 70 is too low.

Most of Edinburgh city centre has recently become a 20 zone. With NO noticeable effect on the actual speeds being driven. 
I'm expecting a targeted driver awareness campaign sometime soon- they did one for phone use recently & stopped enough folk that word went round & had an impact. 

yeah, you can ignore the speed limit in Edinburgh, just don't put a wheel in a bus lane!

ThePrettyDamned

Bucket said:

I was once a passenger in a car where the driver was doing near enough 70 in a 40 and it was truly terrifying. I would never, ever drive that far above the speed limit.

I've only been done once, I have the course in a couple of weeks. Got caught doing 36 just after the limit changed from 40 down to 30. I'm still annoyed about that one. It was almost midnight and the road was quiet, I was in full control and it was well within my capabilities to stop had there been an emergency. But whatever, they got me and now I have to cough up and shut up.

The only place my speed is ever consistently above the limit is motorways - my average is probably more like 80. I should probably knock that on the head but really, 70 feels fucking slow and I have places to be.

I tend to think, when I hear that, "how long is the journey?". 

Let's say it's 50 miles on a motorway. At 70mph, it'll take you a few seconds under 43 minutes. 

50 miles at 80mph on a motorway will take you 37 minutes 30 seconds. 

So, 6 minutes saved, give or take. 

Or you could leave ten minutes earlier, not speed, not risk getting fined/points AND beat the peens who insist on going 80mph. 

Or you could leave about 5 minutes earlier and roughly time match. 

That's when travelling 50 miles. So on a 100 mile journey on a motorway, consistently being 80mph will save you a whopping 12 minutes. What will you do with all that extra time?  

I'm being a bit facetious, but I used to do the same until I sat down and did the maths - it's really not worth it, the journey times barely change and it just increases the risk of being pulled over, and the rest of the population think you're a twat. 

Most people on the motorway (around here) SEEM to use it for a relatively short commute of 50 miles or less. For me, it was about 15 miles - at which point, going 80mph saves a minute and a bit compared to going 70mph, which of course doesn't really help me get to work on time. 

ICBM

Bucket said:

The only place my speed is ever consistently above the limit is motorways - my average is probably more like 80. I should probably knock that on the head but really, 70 feels fucking slow and I have places to be.

You'll be amazed how little extra time it really takes to get there, and you'll notice a significant drop in your fuel costs. I now drive at around *60*, not even 70, and my 1hr motorway journey takes an extra five minutes... but at more than 10mpg better fuel economy.

You get used to the feeling of slowness quite easily and learn to plan overtaking and lane changing well ahead so you don't have to accelerate hard or brake, and then you can laugh at all the twits trying to do 80 in the outside lane and wasting fuel having to brake when they get too close...

Ravenous

sinbaadi said:

Cue more of everyone driving along looking at the speedo as much as anything on the road itself.

Rubbish. If you can't keep a lookout and control the vehicle at the same time, you shouldn't be driving.

guitarfishbay

The thing is, the timing of traffic lights will mean the time saving is often less than that. 

I often find myself at the same traffic light as someone that overtook me recently.

ThePrettyDamned

ICBM said:

Bucket said:

The only place my speed is ever consistently above the limit is motorways - my average is probably more like 80. I should probably knock that on the head but really, 70 feels fucking slow and I have places to be.

You'll be amazed how little extra time it really takes to get there, and you'll notice a significant drop in your fuel costs. I now drive at around *60*, not even 70, and my 1hr motorway journey takes an extra five minutes... but at more than 10mpg better fuel economy.

You get used to the feeling of slowness quite easily and learn to plan overtaking and lane changing well ahead so you don't have to accelerate hard or brake, and then you can laugh at all the twits trying to do 80 in the outside lane and wasting fuel having to brake when they get too close...

Absolutely. 

I've shown some of the maths above it's a mindset though - I used to feel the same way. 

Now, yes, I'm more likely to leave a bit earlier and stay in behind lorries until I can do a longer overtake without ruining anyone else's day. I drive an aygo, generally average 55mpg with mixed rural, village (lots of that) and motorway driving. I like challenging myself to get more. 

As an aside, challenging myself to be more efficient has made me a better driver than racing everywhere. Racers seem to either gamble on roundabouts/mini roundabouts or stop unnecessarily because they don't allow enough time to make a judgement. I slow down a bit earlier, cruise up and then time my slowing down to match a gap. It actually can save time versus getting there earlier, stopping and waiting for a longer gap to pull into I'm sure. 

Strangefan

Emp_Fab said:

Strangefan said:

You get caught, that is all, I got to do a speed awareness course because I was doing 35 in a 30....insane 

Why is that insane ?

Because on an analogue speedometer on sports bike the difference between 30 and 35 is nothing, if I were to constantly keep to 30 ridgedly the I would shave to be looking at the speedo every other second, and it was at 11am at night, on a dark country road, I have better things to look out for like badgers, potholes sharp corners... 

ThePrettyDamned

Strangefan said:

Emp_Fab said:

Strangefan said:

You get caught, that is all, I got to do a speed awareness course because I was doing 35 in a 30....insane 

Why is that insane ?

Because on an analogue speedometer on sports bike the difference between 30 and 35 is nothing, if I were to constantly keep to 30 ridgedly the I would shave to be looking at the speedo every other second, and it was at 11am at night, on a dark country road, I have better things to look out for like badgers, potholes sharp corners... 

The chances are that if you were clocked at 35, you were closer to 37-40 on the speedo. Most (if not all) speedos read over true speed as it's illegal for them to read under it. 

If that is not the case, maybe get someone to take a look at it. In any case, if 30 and 35mph are so close together on it you can't tell the difference, it's either time for contact lenses or you need a better, more road appropriate speedo that is much clearer. 

Nikko

Ive been caught once, when I was about 23/24. 3 points and a fine. It was my fault. I paid.

If you speed, and you get caught...tough titties. You know the limit.

Gagaryn

ICBM said:

Bucket said:

The only place my speed is ever consistently above the limit is motorways - my average is probably more like 80. I should probably knock that on the head but really, 70 feels fucking slow and I have places to be.

You'll be amazed how little extra time it really takes to get there, and you'll notice a significant drop in your fuel costs. I now drive at around *60*, not even 70, and my 1hr motorway journey takes an extra five minutes... but at more than 10mpg better fuel economy.

You get used to the feeling of slowness quite easily and learn to plan overtaking and lane changing well ahead so you don't have to accelerate hard or brake, and then you can laugh at all the twits trying to do 80 in the outside lane and wasting fuel having to brake when they get too close...

I do this too - started about 10 years ago when I realised that I occasionally drove like a twat. Or rather got a letter telling me - clocked at 95 on a motorway - in a hurry to go to a mates for lunch! Now I drive between 60 or 70 in the inside lane letting everyone whizz by me and I arrive wherever I'm going at pretty much the same time but much more relaxed and with much more petrol in the car!

ThePrettyDamned

guitarfishbay said:

The thing is, the timing of traffic lights will mean the time saving is often less than that. 

I often find myself at the same traffic light as someone that overtook me recently.

Absolutely. Happens all the time.

If it's not traffic lights, it's roadworks. 

Cirrus

marantz1300 said:

the cops are out in force with their radar traps in Essex at the moment.

all over the brow of a hill , hiding in drives.

nicking people for doing 35 in a 30 on roads that have no accidents

It's just another council tax.

If only there was some way, some method drivers could use, to avoid getting a speeding fine. That'd show the greedy money grabbing bastards.