Experience of Hot Cat and / or Black Cat (K Master, 15w models in particular)

Powerslave

I recently had the opportunity to play through Bad Cat "Hot Cat" (15w, with K Master) . . .

The clean channel was outstanding and remarkably flexible - either run as a "true" clean (K high, gain low - giving clean headroom) or as a classic crunch channel (K low, gain high).

The high gain channel was a very good example of type, but probably just too much gain for me such that I found myself limited to working below 9/10pm on the gain sweep. Whilst this is limiting in its own right, the tone seemed somewhat over-compressed and congested (compounded, no doubt, by a relatively low K Master).

This amp with less gain on it's second channel (or more gradual gain sweep) would be ideal.

Alternatively, The Hot Cat's clean channel x2 would probably do the job (perhaps with just a tweak to the gain channel to make it a little more "rock").

So, I wondered if anyone had direct A/B comparison of the Black Cat and the Hot Cat . . .?

For example, is the Black Cat a lower gain Hot Cat, or is it perhaps a different beast altogether? Is the clean channel of the Black Cat seem similar to that of the Hot Cat, and is the gain channel (EF86 channel) of the Black Cat more of a development of it's clean channel - more gain, but not too much more gain?

Experiences and thoughts most welcome . . .

Chester

I've had both, but not the K-Master specs. And had exactly the same experience with the Hot Cat in higher gain mode

The Black Cat is exactly what you need - the EF86 channel is a gorgeous, chewy, gritty clean to overdriven option that provides a different tonal base without getting too gainy or in your face. I loved it. From what you are suggesting above, it may be just the ticket

IvisonGuitars

I've not had firsthand experience of the Hot Cat but have had Black Cats now for almost 10 years. They are my favourite amp of all time.

I've not tried a K Master but I don;t see how it can me much of an improvement on the normal masters they had, they are excellent.

I have heard and read that people find exactly the same as you have, in that the Hot Cat can get far too fizzy.

@Chester has it pretty much spot on. The Black Cat can do sparkling, 3D, Hifi cleans, through to out and out grit but you'll never loose note definition or clarity. 

I would recommend a Black Cat any day on the week.....if only we knew someone who was selling a 15w, 1x12 combo at a bargain price....

ThePrettyDamned

I've got an ef86 vox channel amp and it's really, really lovely. But beware, apparently ef86 valves are a bit fragile and often go microphonic. 

stickyfiddle

I haven't tried a Hot Cat or Black Cat in years but I have the latest Cub 15R with the K-master and EF86 channel. It's a fantastic amp and the EF86 option in particular is one of the best things I've ever had in my ears. Chewy and clean and compressed and slightly dirty all at the same time. 

I'm not sure the technical aspect of the K-master is actually that clever, but it's certainly a very good master volume. 

Powerslave

@stickyfiddle - I wasn't particularly familiar with the Cub. But it reads as though its "kind of" like the Black Cat with access to the EF86 and additional gain, but not quite a full two channel amp. Would you say that's about right?

Interesting!

I do appreciate the comments and PM's - it certainly sounds like the Black Cat would be the way to go . . .

stickyfiddle

@Powerslave Yeah, that's about right. I understand it's a little hotter than the Black Cat (I think roughly along Vox vs Fender lines, but open to correction from black cat owners!)

The Cub is really a proper single channel amp with two "flavours" via the 12AX7/EF86 switch, plus a boost (which I don't use at home, but would be great for gigging)

IvisonGuitars

Just a word of advice, if you decide to look for a Cub, make sure it's the newer model like @stickyfiddle has (which gets rave reviews), the very early Cub and Cub II's were average at best. 

Powerslave

Thanks, Gents . . .

I'm sure it will be the Black Cat for me - the range of music that I play, and the way my brain is wired has always veered me towards two-channel amps!

It's interesting to know about the Cub's capabilities, though, as it seems as there would be some tonal overlap with the Black Cat.

Guess I'll be ringing Doug in the morning, then

ChrisMusic

either that ~ or maybe giving @miserneil a PM  

http://thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/101835/fs-bad-cat-black-cat-15w-1x12-combo-price-drop#latest

stickyfiddle

ChrisMusic said:

either that ~ or maybe giving @miserneil a PM  

http://thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/101835/fs-bad-cat-black-cat-15w-1x12-combo-price-drop#latest

Still the best value amp on the classifieds (though obviously not the cheapest!). No idea why someone lolled me!

IvisonGuitars

stickyfiddle said:

ChrisMusic said:

either that ~ or maybe giving @miserneil a PM  

http://thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/101835/fs-bad-cat-black-cat-15w-1x12-combo-price-drop#latest

Still the best value amp on the classifieds (though obviously not the cheapest!). No idea why someone lolled me!

Thanks Sticky, I of course, wholeheartedly agree....and yet I'm still getting lowballed!

IMO Bad Cats in general are the best value used amp out there. 

Powerslave

@ChrisMusic - All things being equal, I'd have already done a deal with @miserneil (and there would be no lo-balling from me as I fully concur - that's a more than fair price).

However, I'm sat with a Swart combo in the classifieds that needs to move along to make this happen, and so I'm pretty much tied into a possible px deal.

Amp sales seems to be very slow at the moment - great deals to be had, but no one is buying.

Powerslave

Does anyone happen to know if the reverb is foot-switchable (on / off) with the Black Cat "r" models (be that the earlier models and / or with the latest K-Master models)?

IvisonGuitars

@Powerslave Yes, it is on the 2013 model.

Powerslave

In part answer to my own question, apparently the latest K-Master models no longer support reverb on/off via the foot switch (single button only, now - channel selection).

Reverb settings are per-channel, and when set at "0" then it's completely out of the signal path.