This is the Somerset Levels today

Phil_aka_Pip

Some recommend introducing beavers

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-magazine-monitor-26122318

bertie

still, the thames is flooding now so somerset will soon be forgotten

johnnyurq

Fretwired;159296" said:

We need beavers ... the best dam builders ever .. :-)

Hell yeah, oh I see you mean four legged ones.

koneguitarist

The problem that we have down here, due to local experts, such as farmers who have lived and worked the land for generations is down to a few major things, biggest of all is lack of dredging that has been stopped over recent years, and also the amount of building on land which used to allow water to be soaked up. 

Now I am no expert, but if you have large plots of land leading down to a river and you build all around it, where is the rain fall gonna go? Into the river, as now it's no longer able to be soaked up by land and trees. 

So we have larger volumes of water going into rivers, less river space due to lack of dredging, and a large open flat area.  Of course it's gonna flood the area, don't need no uni degree to work that one out, but what the hell do people down here know, they are just angry so not worth listening to. 

For what it's worth, it also flooded last year, without record rainfall, no one listened then either.

Sambostar

The thing I can't stand about the politicians is their "I told you so, it's climate change" attitude, as if it's all our fault.

VimFuego

koneguitarist said:

The problem that we have down here, due to local experts, such as farmers who have lived and worked the land for generations is down to a few major things, biggest of all is lack of dredging that has been stopped over recent years, and also the amount of building on land which used to allow water to be soaked up. 

Now I am no expert, but if you have large plots of land leading down to a river and you build all around it, where is the rain fall gonna go? Into the river, as now it's no longer able to be soaked up by land and trees. 

So we have larger volumes of water going into rivers, less river space due to lack of dredging, and a large open flat area.  Of course it's gonna flood the area, don't need no uni degree to work that one out, but what the hell do people down here know, they are just angry so not worth listening to. 

For what it's worth, it also flooded last year, without record rainfall, no one listened then either.

so, how much would you dredge to make the water flow away? How much bigger do the drains need to be to handle the sort of water we're talking about? You seem very certain that dredging will work, so I'm interested in seeing your calculations.

koneguitarist

VimFuego;159540" said:

  so, how much would you dredge to make the water flow away? How much bigger do the drains need to be to handle the sort of water we're talking about? You seem very certain that dredging will work, so I'm interested in seeing your calculations.

 

 

No Idea !  I said I am not an expert and its part of the problem, not the only problem,  this has been a dreadful month for rain, but as I said this has been happening for a while, so obviously its not just down to a bit of extra rain !

Fretwired

VimFuego said:

koneguitarist said:

The problem that we have down here, due to local experts, such as farmers who have lived and worked the land for generations is down to a few major things, biggest of all is lack of dredging that has been stopped over recent years, and also the amount of building on land which used to allow water to be soaked up. 

Now I am no expert, but if you have large plots of land leading down to a river and you build all around it, where is the rain fall gonna go? Into the river, as now it's no longer able to be soaked up by land and trees. 

So we have larger volumes of water going into rivers, less river space due to lack of dredging, and a large open flat area.  Of course it's gonna flood the area, don't need no uni degree to work that one out, but what the hell do people down here know, they are just angry so not worth listening to. 

For what it's worth, it also flooded last year, without record rainfall, no one listened then either.

so, how much would you dredge to make the water flow away? How much bigger do the drains need to be to handle the sort of water we're talking about? You seem very certain that dredging will work, so I'm interested in seeing your calculations.

I agree Vim. I'm no expert but most I've heard have said dredging would have made little difference. The one thing you'll get from dredging is fast flowing water which will be dangerous. In part of Wales they've cut down trees to partially block rivers and introduced beavers which build dams. This slows the water down and allows it to flow into tributaries. Whatever happens you will need a large area of land into which excess water can flow and drain. And more trees, hedges and natural barriers.

littlegreenman

Wouldn't that part of the country have always flooded periodically anyway, some years more so than others?

Building houses in a known flood area is rather like tornado alley or an earthquake zone. You'll be fine for a long time but when the proverbial hits the fan, as it's bound to every x number of years, it's unlikely to be pretty.

A combination of factors is obvious. Wetlands, no dredging, oodles of rain, the expectation that we can have a wonderful home with no protection from known dangers, surely something should have been done?

But then I live in a hilly coastal area that doesn't flood, so what do I know?

Bellycaster

VimFuego said:

heh, the one I heard was that they were deliberately flooding the levels to depopulate the country, ala agenda 21.

 

Personally I have all my tin foil hats tailor made, I'd never wear an off the peg one.

Don't mention Agenda 21 @VimFuego, GCHQ will be all over you like a rash, they are probably watching us now.

>:)

Fretwired

Agenda 21 - world depopulation .. that seems to be going well ... :-)

IanSavage

Fretwired said:

Insurance firms can bail out if the risks are too high...

maltingsaudio said:

There is also a conspiracy theory going round that the Government want the levels cleared so they can frack it . Don't know if it hold water though

/

Seriously? No-one else noticed those?

maltingsaudio

bertie said:

still, the thames is flooding now so somerset will soon be forgotten

So true

http://eveningharold.com/2014/02/10/eton-college-threatend-by-floods/

koneguitarist

maltingsaudio said:

bertie said:

still, the thames is flooding now so somerset will soon be forgotten

So true

http://eveningharold.com/2014/02/10/eton-college-threatend-by-floods/

Awesome ! )

bertie

littlegreenman said:

Wouldn't that part of the country have always flooded periodically anyway, some years more so than others?

yes, thats what the network of  drains were put in for 100's of years ago -  I believe its only in very recent years that its worsened again.

Its these as well as the main ateries (parrett and kings sedgemoor ) that have been neglected over recent years..........again like the others Im no expert, and no-one knows for sure.......but who's to say for 100% fact that lack of dredging hasnt been a major contribution to the overall effect ?

The flooding has been caused, has it not, by the combination of the inability of the drains to effectively clear water caused by excessive rain fall,  making the drains and "river"  unusually (and possibly avoidably ?) high........so any tidal back surge causes breaches upstream

no argument that dredging alone isnt the answer, but surely a combination of "making drains more effective" and providing better protection at breaching points

The ones claiming that dredging wouldnt have made any difference,  arent these the ones responsible for it in the first place ? 

Fretwired

bertie said:

littlegreenman said:

Wouldn't that part of the country have always flooded periodically anyway, some years more so than others?

The ones claiming that dredging wouldnt have made any difference,  arent these the ones responsible for it in the first place ? 

No they're not - Cameron and co have jumped on the dredging bandwagon. You need somewhere for the water to drain to and you actually need to manage the flow. Less houses and concrete, more trees and hedges and areas the water can be diverted to if the rivers can't cope. Dredging is primarily a tool for improving navigation and, in some places, land drainage.

In fairness to Owen Patterson he's done a U-turn and listened to some experts but he's been slapped back down by Smith, Cameron and Pickles who are just incompetent fuckwits. The quicker the Tory Party is consigned to history the better. I think Cameron is the worst PM in living memory which must please John Major no end.

Interesting piece in the Guardian:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/jan/30/dredging-rivers-floods-somerset-levels-david-cameron-farmers

holnrew

I can only hope that it will cost Tory votes. Mind you Ian Liddell-Grainger has responded with passion.

ESBlonde

The idea that another two foot depth in the river would remove or have prevented the current build up of flood water stretches my imagination somewhat. Yes it would help, but we hear that (and I'm going on third hand information like most others here) the water is actually seeping back out of the waterlogged ground. This is a clue here, the amount of rain this autumn and winter in a concentrated period is more than any existing facilities were built to withstand. One report last week said it's the wettest January for 300 years (I thought official records only went back about 100 years). So given that there is no precedent for the current rainfall concentration and the fact that previous governments have effectively ignored all warnings of 'global weather changes',  whilst increasing our welfare and social costs, it is no wonder we are where we are today. I feel sorry for all those caught up in this terrible situation, the worry alone must be agonising. We could spend billions and by the time we have completed the works the weather pattern might well have advanced to something else like drought. I have heard some good suggestions put forward but as of yet I haven't seen a single conclusive answer or plan to prevent all future flooding.

VimFuego

ES, that's a good point about previous governments. Whilst it is a lot of fun to blame the present incumbents, we had 13 years of spend happy labour before them, there was a huge amount they should've done and now we're playing catch up.

Phil_aka_Pip

@Fretwired No disrespect but I don't think John Major gives a shit what you think of David Cameron. I don't think DC himself gives a shit either.