Digital amps which DON’T model cabinets

jellybelly

Hi all

so I’m looking into this as I’m reaching a point with ‘traditional’ gear where I’m getting sick of having so much time/ money invested in pedals and, in particular, amps - valve amps are wonderful things IF they have exactly the right power for the room, but once I got thinking about things like the Fryette Powerstation etc to make an amp sound good whatever the room and even at home, it’s just adding more stuff to buy, to go wrong and to lug around. Modelling looks like it’s where I’m going to be heading.

However, there is a big caveat - I don’t want to do the whole FRFR thing. Line outs with IRs is great instead of micing to front of house and I’m wholly up for that, but I want a cabinet with a guitar speaker behind me in the back line. I just can’t bring myself to fake THAT part of the link!

With all that in mind I’ve started looking at options - my THR10 impressed me so much that the THR100HD is certainly a contender and is top of the list given the used prices they’re coming up for.

A Helix LT with some sort of power amp (are there good/bad ones?) seems like a good idea, or even a powered guitar cab (is there anything commercially available that is essentially a powered guitar cab with no Pre-amp?). Have L6 got any amps with the HX tech out or on the way??

From what I know about the Katana, it seems like a good shout although a little more limited in what it can do amp-wise, but I’m willing to try. Am I right in thinking these don’t do the cab modelling part, and are modelled pre and power into a ‘normal’ speaker and cab?

Any other options out there? Of course NAMM is coming up so I’d be interested to see what comes of that too...

darthed1981

jellybelly said:

From what I know about the Katana, it seems like a good shout although a little more limited in what it can do amp-wise, but I’m willing to try. Am I right in thinking these don’t do the cab modelling part, and are modelled pre and power into a ‘normal’ speaker and cab?

Katana head just plugs into a normal cab.  Also has a little speaker of its own for quiet practise when you dont want to use the cab

earwighoney

jellybelly said:

Hi all

so I’m looking into this as I’m reaching a point with ‘traditional’ gear where I’m getting sick of having so much time/ money invested in pedals and, in particular, amps - valve amps are wonderful things IF they have exactly the right power for the room, but once I got thinking about things like the Fryette Powerstation etc to make an amp sound good whatever the room and even at home, it’s just adding more stuff to buy, to go wrong and to lug around. Modelling looks like it’s where I’m going to be heading.

However, there is a big caveat - I don’t want to do the whole FRFR thing. Line outs with IRs is great instead of micing to front of house and I’m wholly up for that, but I want a cabinet with a guitar speaker behind me in the back line. I just can’t bring myself to fake THAT part of the link!

With all that in mind I’ve started looking at options - my THR10 impressed me so much that the THR100HD is certainly a contender and is top of the list given the used prices they’re coming up for.

A Helix LT with some sort of power amp (are there good/bad ones?) seems like a good idea, or even a powered guitar cab (is there anything commercially available that is essentially a powered guitar cab with no Pre-amp?). Have L6 got any amps with the HX tech out or on the way??

From what I know about the Katana, it seems like a good shout although a little more limited in what it can do amp-wise, but I’m willing to try. Am I right in thinking these don’t do the cab modelling part, and are modelled pre and power into a ‘normal’ speaker and cab?

Any other options out there? Of course NAMM is coming up so I’d be interested to see what comes of that too...

Maybe it's time to sell it all and get a Martin D28.....

drwiddly

Most of the higher end modelling gear allows you to use a power amp and guitar cab on stage with a cabinet emulated feed to the P.A. So Kemper, Axe FX (all models), Helix, Amplifire (all models), Digitech gsp1101 and AFAIK, the Rocktron Prophesy.

If you're using a front of house feed then you're better off being able to load 3rd party impulse responses. Most of the above allow the use of these but the Axe FX and the Kemper need them to be converted to their proprietary format using free software from their websites. Some 3rd party IR suppliers do provide their IR's in Axe FX format as well as the standard .wav.

prlgmnr

Sorry to be a pillock, but once you need to lug about a power amp and cabinet as well as your modeller, you might as well just lug about an amp and a Fryette ps or whatever?

jellybelly

prlgmnr said:

Sorry to be a pillock, but once you need to lug about a power amp and cabinet as well as your modeller, you might as well just lug about an amp and a Fryette ps or whatever?

This is true to a point, although a solid state power amp will be small, cheap and light I’d assume. Buying a £700 Fryette to make my £700 valve amp sound good seems like overkill when a digital solution would be more reliable, neater and cheaper. 

chrishill901

jellybelly said:

prlgmnr said:

Sorry to be a pillock, but once you need to lug about a power amp and cabinet as well as your modeller, you might as well just lug about an amp and a Fryette ps or whatever?

This is true to a point, although a solid state power amp will be small, cheap and light I’d assume. Buying a £700 Fryette to make my £700 valve amp sound good seems like overkill when a digital solution would be more reliable, neater and cheaper. 

True but if you want it to sound good then you’ll be buying a £750 helix lt, £300 cab and potentially £500 on a good power amp.

ive just gone through the exact same process, hence my helix LT for sale in the classifieds. I have no doubt that the helix produces amazing tones but to get the best out of it you’re looking at spending £1.5k in total. I’ve ditched it for a katana for now which I’m enjoying playing more, and when the right valve amp comes along I’ll get that.

I suppose that’s technically a vote for the Katana.

whats the valve amp in question? Maybe a different valve amp is the solution?

jellybelly

Well, the LT could easily replace my pedalboard and be cheaper, so it’s in the running!! I’ve got an MJW 1x12 15 watt JTM-thing which I’d likely keep (perhaps converted to a head). It’s often really great but way too loud even with a Dr Z Brakelite for my band, though I’m starting up with a heavier group soon so it might get to breath more.

It’s a great sounding amp and a decent pedal platform but I’ve struggled with the big flabby bass and the treble coming on too strong when it’s set too clean- I’ve had it sound glorious at a couple of outdoor gigs and in the studio when it was isolated in another room but that’s at very specific volume settings - it’s just not practical if I want it to sound it’s best.

That’s when I started looking at reamping solutions and also different amps to see if a new flavour might work but when you’re talking £500+ for either option it just made sense to see what tech was out there that could do all of the effects and provide a lot of good amp options that could be tweaked to any room or volume. As I thought about the frfr thing it seemed to me that I wanted something that sounded like and amp, not an amp mic’d up as when I’ve tried that sort of thing it felt a little disconnected. 

prlgmnr

You're probably going to want a tube power amp to give you the feel/sound you're after.

ennspek

I can wholeheartedly recommend the THR100HD.

jellybelly

ennspek said:

I can wholeheartedly recommend the THR100HD.

It does seem like a credible contender, I read a few reviews that said it wasn’t all that loud but so long as it’s on a par wth a 30w valve amp that’s plenty to gig the places I do, and I like the idea of using it in the ‘traditional’ way. How do you use yours??

im kinda hopeful Yamaha will drop a combo with some effects (like the thr10) which could well do me. 

ennspek

I use it with the 2x12 cab that was designed for it. 
I have used it with other cabs though and really like it.
Welcome to borrow if you're anywhere near Leicester.

mbe

The Yamaha THR100HD needs two cabs or two speakers to get sufficient volume out of it. Lovely tones but into one 1x12" cab it wouldn't keep up with an AC30.

We had a B stock from Thomann, and I don't know if there was something wrong with it, but we sent it back as we were pretty underwhelmed with it.