Roland Blues Cube Artist: kaput and irreparable

fields5069

I think, on balance after reading this thread, I would be tempted in future to go for something like an Orange Crush Pro, for solid state. I'm assuming that amp would be more maintainable, with only the reverb being DSP. I'd be interested if anyone has opened one of those up....

cbilly22

fields5069 said: no

I think, on balance after reading this thread, I would be tempted in future to go for something like an Orange Crush Pro, for solid state. I'm assuming that amp would be more maintainable, with only the reverb being DSP. I'd be interested if anyone has opened one of those up....

@fields5069  I had one, which I still kinda miss but it didn't really match my main gig.
Sent @ICBM some pics of the wiring as he was interested in them. He seemed positive regarding the quality of build and components.

fields5069

cbilly22 said:

fields5069 said: no

I think, on balance after reading this thread, I would be tempted in future to go for something like an Orange Crush Pro, for solid state. I'm assuming that amp would be more maintainable, with only the reverb being DSP. I'd be interested if anyone has opened one of those up....

@fields5069  I had one, which I still kinda miss but it didn't really match my main gig.
Sent @ICBM some pics of the wiring as he was interested in them. He seemed positive regarding the quality of build and components.

I had one as well, I should have kept it. The Blues Cube is a better-sounding amp IMO, but that is mainly down to the DSP in the power section as I understand it.

ICBM

cbilly22 said:

fields5069 said: no

I think, on balance after reading this thread, I would be tempted in future to go for something like an Orange Crush Pro, for solid state. I'm assuming that amp would be more maintainable, with only the reverb being DSP. I'd be interested if anyone has opened one of those up....

@fields5069  I had one, which I still kinda miss but it didn't really match my main gig.
Sent @ICBM some pics of the wiring as he was interested in them. He seemed positive regarding the quality of build and components.

Yes - it's not only discrete components, it's all through-hole apart from on the DSP board. The PCBs are high-quality through-plated ones, it has a conventional transformer power supply, and the only remotely questionable design/construction point is the use of integrated circuit power modules instead of discrete transistors - but they're very well heatsinked, and I haven't seen or even heard of a dead one of these amps yet.

The real puzzle is why, given there's really no new technology involved, almost no-one has managed to make such a good-sounding solid-state amp in the last twenty or thirty years.

HAL9000

fields5069 said:

I think, on balance after reading this thread, I would be tempted in future to go for something like an Orange Crush Pro, for solid state. I'm assuming that amp would be more maintainable, with only the reverb being DSP. I'd be interested if anyone has opened one of those up....

I've got one. Seems very well built. Does that typical 'breathy' Orange sound. But put the gain to around ten o'clock and it does a great blues/rock tone. Has been mistaken for a valve amp more than once. Plus it's substantially cheaper than the equivalent Blues Cube.

@ICBM What's your take on the Crush 35RT? Thinking of getting one as a smaller lighter alternative to the Crush Pro for when I don't need so much power. I know it's still analogue but assume it's not manufactured to the same standards as the Pro?

cbilly22

HAL9000 said:

fields5069 said:

I think, on balance after reading this thread, I would be tempted in future to go for something like an Orange Crush Pro, for solid state. I'm assuming that amp would be more maintainable, with only the reverb being DSP. I'd be interested if anyone has opened one of those up....

I've got one. Seems very well built. Does that typical 'breathy' Orange sound. But put the gain to around ten o'clock and it does a great blues/rock tone. Has been mistaken for a valve amp more than once. Plus it's substantially cheaper than the equivalent Blues Cube.

@ICBM What's your take on the Crush 35RT? Thinking of getting one as a smaller lighter alternative to the Crush Pro for when I don't need so much power. I know it's still analogue but assume it's not manufactured to the same standards as the Pro?

Giving serious thought to going back to one to be honest.

bluechargeboy

I was looking at an expensive Boss AD-10 acoustic preamp the other day. So if it breaks out of warranty it will be a £300 doorstop? Well that helps to kill the GAS anyway, thanks Roland!

menamestom

ICBM said:

cbilly22 said:

 

The real puzzle is why, given there's really no new technology involved, almost no-one has managed to make such a good-sounding solid-state amp in the last twenty or thirty years.

Have you ever come across Mambo amps @ICBM ?

They seem to be under the radar a bit, but higher end of SS amps.

As a side note, the DV Mark little Jazz is a very nice sounding solid state amp.

jpfamps

impmann said:

jpfamps said:

impmann said:

jpfamps said:

Three-ColourSunburst said:

p90fool said:

impmann said:

I'd also get independant repair techs who would get incredibly stroppy about the company's postion of not releasing schematics to third parties - I can see both sides of this argument but ultimately, its a business decision. You are welcome to your own opinions on that, but as you didn't create the IP, its protection isn't really anything to do with anyone else. 

This is cynical and should be illegal IMO, they're using copyright laws designed to protect authors and photographers to starve everyone of service information and to force customers to pay them inflated prices for repairs.

On the other hand, if you spend a lot of money developing a product, releasing schematics to third parties opens the door to others copying your designs. Restricting schematics to a few approved repair centres does reduce the likelihood of this happening. It a simple case of protecting intellectual property rights.

 
I doubt very much whether this is the case to be honest, especially for digital gear.

It's actually easier to reverse engineer something from the product than the schematic.

Most of the ip in digital gear will will be in the digital domain, and thus unobtainable from the schematic.

Ummm... not quite so easy on a multi-layer board as often layouts are very compact, plus a lot of SMDs are hard to identify without the use of a schematic.

But you are right about the code used to run the boards.

There are plenty of companies (mainly in China and India) who specialize in reverse engineering electronic products.

MI gear is very simple compared with most modern electronics (and actually not were the money is).

There are. But you don’t have to make it easy for them! 

Anyway, like I say it’s a business decision - you’re welcome to your own opinion but it won’t change a thing!

If companies don't want to help people like me repair their products, that's entirely a matter for them.

However, they can't complain when I explain to customers why I can fix said products..........

Incidentally BOSS are one company that I would say generally very helpful with both technical support and parts.

jpfamps

ICBM said:

cbilly22 said:

fields5069 said: no

I think, on balance after reading this thread, I would be tempted in future to go for something like an Orange Crush Pro, for solid state. I'm assuming that amp would be more maintainable, with only the reverb being DSP. I'd be interested if anyone has opened one of those up....

@fields5069  I had one, which I still kinda miss but it didn't really match my main gig.
Sent @ICBM some pics of the wiring as he was interested in them. He seemed positive regarding the quality of build and components.

Yes - it's not only discrete components, it's all through-hole apart from on the DSP board. The PCBs are high-quality through-plated ones, it has a conventional transformer power supply, and the only remotely questionable design/construction point is the use of integrated circuit power modules instead of discrete transistors - but they're very well heatsinked, and I haven't seen or even heard of a dead one of these amps yet.

The real puzzle is why, given there's really no new technology involved, almost no-one has managed to make such a good-sounding solid-state amp in the last twenty or thirty years.

Mind you using an integrated power module often makes repairs easier (assuming you can get the module).

I can confirm that they are a very reliable amp.

bluechargeboy

@jpfamps so do Boss and Roland products get handled differently? I thought it was all Roland anyway?

ICBM

HAL9000 said:

@ICBM What's your take on the Crush 35RT? Thinking of getting one as a smaller lighter alternative to the Crush Pro for when I don't need so much power. I know it's still analogue but assume it's not manufactured to the same standards as the Pro?

Don't know, I've never seen one. To be honest, lower-powered amps can usually get away with being less well-made with no impact on their reliability - as long as the power IC is adequately heatsinked (often by simply being bolted to the chassis, at under about 30W) then they will usually be fine indefinitely.

jpfamps

bluechargeboy said:

@jpfamps so do Boss and Roland products get handled differently? I thought it was all Roland anyway?

They are the same.

I mainly deal with BOSS products, ie pedals

impmann

jpfamps said:

If companies don't want to help people like me repair their products, that's entirely a matter for them.

However, they can't complain when I explain to customers why I can fix said products..........

Incidentally BOSS are one company that I would say generally very helpful with both technical support and parts.

I get the feeling you have a bee in your bonnet about this!

As I said above, its not about "companies don't want to help people like me" and whilst I can't speak for the company now, when I was running the service department I would always try to help as far as we could. The company can complain if the tech shall we say 'embellishes' the story to make a point and then the customer phoned me to complain... its happened, and its awkward because you don't want to accuse the tech of being a dick about it (when they have), especially when this reflects badly on my team who were actually doing all they could to help.

But hey - perhaps we'll agree to differ. Different viewpoints of the same argument - often with the customer stuck in the middle.

And that's why I always suggest the customer talking to the manufacturer where possible, especially on high-tech gear where bespoke parts are likely to have been used.

BluesyDave

mbe said:

TimmyO said:

Eee it were better back then, when it were all fields and rickets and dysentery  

Back then we used to dream about amplifiers and had to make do with Marshall stacks painted ont' cellar wall

You had a CELLAR!!!??

rlw

BluesyDave said:

mbe said:

TimmyO said:

Eee it were better back then, when it were all fields and rickets and dysentery  

Back then we used to dream about amplifiers and had to make do with Marshall stacks painted ont' cellar wall

You had a CELLAR!!!??

Cupboard under the stairs more like :-(

Marshall

The real puzzle is why, given there's really no new technology involved, almost no-one has managed to make such a good-sounding solid-state amp in the last twenty or thirty years.

Was lucky enough to catch some great acts @ the Tenby blues festival over the weekend, among which was a small 3 piece with frontman singer doing a very tasteful set of older school blues/blues-rock based stuff, canned heat and the like - the guitarist was mostly on a standard Lester through this tiny looking tweed covered amp with SESSION written on the front. Never seen one so asked him about it during the break and was surprised to hear him tell me it’s SS. The tone and amazingly big sound he was getting from it I would have sworn was valve along the lines of a LJ20 or such...Impressive!

Anyone know anything more or have experience with these?

menamestom

Marshall said:

The real puzzle is why, given there's really no new technology involved, almost no-one has managed to make such a good-sounding solid-state amp in the last twenty or thirty years.

Was lucky enough to catch some great acts @ the Tenby blues festival over the weekend, among which was a small 3 piece with frontman singer doing a very tasteful set of older school blues/blues-rock based stuff, canned heat and the like - the guitarist was mostly on a standard Lester through this tiny looking tweed covered amp with SESSION written on the front. Never seen one so asked him about it during the break and was surprised to hear him tell me it’s SS. The tone and amazingly big sound he was getting from it I would have sworn was valve along the lines of a LJ20 or such...Impressive!

Anyone know anything more or have experience with these?

Like this?

https://www.award-session.com/bluesbaby-complete.html

Marshall

menamestom said:

Marshall said:

The real puzzle is why, given there's really no new technology involved, almost no-one has managed to make such a good-sounding solid-state amp in the last twenty or thirty years.

Was lucky enough to catch some great acts @ the Tenby blues festival over the weekend, among which was a small 3 piece with frontman singer doing a very tasteful set of older school blues/blues-rock based stuff, canned heat and the like - the guitarist was mostly on a standard Lester through this tiny looking tweed covered amp with SESSION written on the front. Never seen one so asked him about it during the break and was surprised to hear him tell me it’s SS. The tone and amazingly big sound he was getting from it I would have sworn was valve along the lines of a LJ20 or such...Impressive!

Anyone know anything more or have experience with these?

Like this?

https://www.award-session.com/bluesbaby-complete.html

Yes! Except with a tweed finish...very impressed have to say..hmm, do I need another amp? Bollocks, not again!

Beexter

 Marshall said:

The real puzzle is why, given there's really no new technology involved, almost no-one has managed to make such a good-sounding solid-state amp in the last twenty or thirty years.

Was lucky enough to catch some great acts @ the Tenby blues festival over the weekend, among which was a small 3 piece with frontman singer doing a very tasteful set of older school blues/blues-rock based stuff, canned heat and the like - the guitarist was mostly on a standard Lester through this tiny looking tweed covered amp with SESSION written on the front. Never seen one so asked him about it during the break and was surprised to hear him tell me it’s SS. The tone and amazingly big sound he was getting from it I would have sworn was valve along the lines of a LJ20 or such...Impressive!

Anyone know anything more or have experience with these?

Might have been a Sessionette 75. They were available in a grey tweed finish.  I used to have one and they belt out some volume for their size. I think SS amps have moved on a bit since then though..