Anyone got any suggestions on ways of becoming a better singer?

Drew_TNBD

LastMantra;210485" said:

The evidence would suggest otherwise. Plenty of good vocalists that have never had lessons. 

8-X

I'm not sure how you can know this really. There are lots of vocalists who will say they've never had lessons, but actually they have them every week, or at least a few before they go on tour, just to kick themselves up the arse.

Hell, even Stevie Wonder still sees a vocal coach!!

LastMantra

Yup you're right, every singer must have lessons full stop no exceptions ever anywhere.

*sigh*

Drew_TNBD

LastMantra said:

Yup you're right, every singer must have lessons full stop no exceptions ever anywhere.

*sigh*

 I didn't say that you daft bugger. But if you can't even cite the ones you know, then you're argument is a stillbirth.

randomhandclaps

 

LastMantra said:

The evidence would suggest otherwise. Plenty of good vocalists that have never had lessons. 

So which professional singers have never had a lesson?  That's just a silly assumption people make.  My wife is a vocal coach and knows a fair few others and you'd find it very hard to find a professional singer who has never had a vocal coach, exactly like you wouldn't find a top athlete who did have a fitness coach.  A good vocal coach isn't about telling you how to sing, it about supporting, extending and most of all protecting your voice.

It would be interesting to know what singers you know of though which provide the evidence against vocal coaching.  The only one I have ever come across is Kelly Jones who finally sort out a coach after his voice started collapsing.

Drew_TNBD

He's gonna cite someone like Bob Dylan or Tom Waits.

Sure... they make *noise* with their mouth, but they're not utilizing the full resonant system. So they are not using their singing voice, technically speaking. It's like the difference between some crappy garage punk music and your bog standard stadium rock band. Sure... the garage band is technically playing music, even though the mix is completely off, the bassist only has one string, and the drummer hasn't tuned his kit and has a broken ride cymbal.

I'm not one to lightly bow down to teachers. I can play a variety of instruments to a pretty high degree, I can mix and engineer music, and I'm pretty autodidactic in most respects. But singing is the one thing that I knew before I even started would be better taught by a teacher. Otherwise I would've been flailing around in the dark looking for the light switch.

Going through the process now of tearing down all my old preconceptions about the voice, and getting to a fundamental core that is workable. This involves being able to bridge, and I struggle a lot with it right now because I'm utterly shit. But it is a fun process of discovery

Kebabkid

octatonic said:

Go and study with a singing teacher.

It is much harder to try to do it yourself because you will reinforce bad habits.

Once you learn to breathe properly and pitch correctly you can go do your own thing.

Look to get a year of weekly lessons.

^ this plus learning how to support your voice so you don't damage it and when and how to use the different voices you can produce i.e. head, chest etc and what shape your mouth should be making for certain vowel sounds, the dropping of your jaw, the placement of your head. It all helps.
A good teacher will assess your range too and this, with help, can possibly improve upon it or at least determine where your limit is. This will be important for song keys or even transposing them if not quite the right key for your voice.

LastMantra

Drew_fx said:

He's gonna cite someone like Bob Dylan or Tom Waits.

Sure... they make *noise* with their mouth, but they're not utilizing the full resonant system. So they are not using their singing voice, technically speaking. It's like the difference between some crappy garage punk music and your bog standard stadium rock band. Sure... the garage band is technically playing music, even though the mix is completely off, the bassist only has one string, and the drummer hasn't tuned his kit and has a broken ride cymbal.

I'm not one to lightly bow down to teachers. I can play a variety of instruments to a pretty high degree, I can mix and engineer music, and I'm pretty autodidactic in most respects. But singing is the one thing that I knew before I even started would be better taught by a teacher. Otherwise I would've been flailing around in the dark looking for the light switch.

Going through the process now of tearing down all my old preconceptions about the voice, and getting to a fundamental core that is workable. This involves being able to bridge, and I struggle a lot with it right now because I'm utterly shit. But it is a fun process of discovery

I agree with what you and the clap are saying, most singers that are doing big tours and gigging every night will be getting "coaching" for stamina, at least. What I mean is that you don't NEED lessons to "find your voice".

Bob Dylan made a noise with his mouth? Think about it.

AFAIK the Beatles didn't take lessons. Axle Rose wasn't taught to sing like that by a teacher and didn't get coaching until he started touring (From what I have read it wasn't till the "illusions" tour, which was crap compared to AFD anyway.

Even Ian Brown has started getting coached!  

You might not like Ian Brown's (Stone Roses) singing style, might not be "utilising the full resonant system", but the music is loved by many. 

Drew_TNBD

I do like Ian Browns singing style. He uses his head and mixed voice predominantly, which is how he gets that airy almost pseudo-falsetto sound. He's a lot more breathy and "wussy" sounding than you'd think. But it works with the Stone Roses stuff.

ElectroDan

This is something, I've been thinking about for some time. Our band is female fronted and I have the job of hitting all the upper harmonies. I'm very conscious that I'm not singing technically correctly, but have learned little ways around doing what I need to do.

I posted a similar comment on here I think, some time ago. But I've been considering the Ken Tamplin course. He does seem to be the only singing coach who can sing that Bluesy/Hard Rock thing.

http://youtu.be/Rahxj-gfqsI

Pop to about 6.40 if your impatient.

thomasross20

LastMantra said:

IMO the best way to be a better singer is to sing. 

Record it, listen back and see what you like/don't like.

+10000.
I got singing lessons. They were ok but I felt I was doing too many "exercises" as opposed to singing. I know you're meant to do some, but I felt it was a bit much.
I actually got the Ken Tamplin course - it's pricey and a bit repetitive but better than many others (where the teacher doesn't even sing!).

Fusionista

Drew_fx said:

Lessons.
../...
And I find it fun as well. It's kinda fun being utterly shit at something and have to learn things that I had no idea about!

Using the diaphragm is a bit of a misnomer. You want to focus on resonance; chest resonance, through to mixed voice, through to head resonance. 

../...

Warm up exercises are not that useful, because your voice changes from day to day, even hour to hour. Focus on breathing and bridge techniques first, keep your throat open (I know you can do that one Sheldon!!) and work on your front vowel sounds.

Wisdom for that @Drew_fx.  What's the name of your band and where were you playing in Colchester ?

Drew_TNBD

See sig. Little pub called Hole In The Wall. Nice place!

randomhandclaps

 

Drew_fx said:

I do like Ian Browns singing style. He uses his head and mixed voice predominantly, which is how he gets that airy almost pseudo-falsetto sound. He's a lot more breathy and "wussy" sounding than you'd think. But it works with the Stone Roses stuff.

I think an advantage Ian Brown (who I like) has in the way he sings is that he has let's the mic add the volume and has never really pushed his voice with extreme dynamic changes.  The breathy and wussy sounding bit is spot on as it's like he's whispering something to you in a crowded pub.

Antique_Guitars

Here are some very short examples of my singing.

I was playing guitar and singing at the same time and I just recorded it on my phone.