Pedalboard Hum Woes

Dave_Vader

Is it possible to knacker an isolated power supply so it starts humming?
I've been running my board from a Donner DP-3 since March with no worries, including 3 pedals daisy-chained from one of the outputs with almost no noise.

I bought a bigger board (Harley Benton Spaceship 80) and decided to run a whole load more off it, but got a good deal more hum. Figured I was just running too much off it and took some things back off.
I've spent the last week or so pulling things out and in but to no avail, it's still pretty loud (only when the drives are on, but they weren't as hummy before, I'm sure). I set it up the same as before, took out the bypass loop, changed everything about, still humming. 

I'm questioning whether it was doing it all along now - along with my sanity. Is it possible that in all my overexcited yanking of cables and turning it off and on (and sometimes not) I might have fucked it?

Is it worth chucking money at a CIOKS or a VoodooLabs to quiet the beast down, or would it be just as bad? I like the look of the gigrig stuff but don't think I can afford the 4 isolator units it would almost certainly need.

Here's a pic of the board
Any suggestions happily received.

skunkwerx

I have heard that analogue and digital pedals dont always play well when daisy chained, and that they require their own isolated channel from the supply, or atleast all analogues on the same daisy chain and all digital on another. 

Dont know if you’ve tried that yet. 

Also have you tried just using one pedal per output and no daisy chains? 

My final thought is to try moving the power supply away from the board if you can, see if anything changes. 

I’m sure someone more knowledgeable will come along soon though. 

skunkwerx

I’d also like to know if damage can be done if you’ve pulled out or plugged in patch cables or power cables ‘hot’, ie with amp/power supply/guitar also on and plugged in.. 

I’m guilty of doing it too.. 

Now I turn everything off, unplug the extension from the wall which has my power supply plug and amp plug in, so its certainly off.. but I dont know if this is paranoia or if there is actually a risk in not doing it!

Winny_Pooh

Your DP-3 might not be as isolated as you think. I'd upgrade the power supply, something like a decibel 11 will power all of that at a reasonable cost. Hot plugging won't damage anything.

sweepy

Have you tried using separate power supplies for certain pedals to isolate the cause. From a cursory glance I’d certainly try using a separate PSU for the Whammy as a first experiment

Gagaryn

You need to adopt a methodical approach or you will never solve the problem. Try guitar > amp, then add pedals one at a time and monitor for hum. You'll then know what the cause or causes of the problem are, and be better placed to find a solution.

You are unlikely to have knackered your PSU but they are made to a budget so may have failed. You could also have issues with dodgy patch leads. Test and listen...

Dave_Vader

I think it might be patch leads.

Have just upgraded the power to all isolated GigRig, at that price I'm pretty sure it's not the power that's humming now.

But it is humming.

meltedbuzzbox

Dave_Vader said:

I think it might be patch leads.

Have just upgraded the power to all isolated GigRig, at that price I'm pretty sure it's not the power that's humming now.

But it is humming.

time to work your way backwards through the chain to eliminate the culprit(s) :-(

hours of fun

Dave_Vader

Going to start with the home made loop/kill switch box tonight.

Hopefully just my crappy soldering.

Gagaryn

Dave_Vader said:

I think it might be patch leads.

Have just upgraded the power to all isolated GigRig, at that price I'm pretty sure it's not the power that's humming now.

But it is humming.

Like I said - you need to break the problem down, very simple to find the culprit by adding one pedal at a time.

Dave_Vader

I didn't get very far. I went through the MSR distortion/boost and all was fine. Added the Boss DD7 - on the gigrig isolator so should be fine - and with three different patch cables it hummed every time I added a little bit of gain. Whether it was on or not.
I'm starting to think that if I want to have Boss pedals, and overdrives it's going to hum unless everything is off.
It is fine when everything is off. 

MattBanshee

The DP3 seems to have fairly low current ratings on most of its outputs (100ma) which aren't enough for most digital based pedals. 

Dave_Vader

I'm stumped now. I've tried just the MXR and the DD7 with every combination of power and lead I can (did the same with the MXR and the Biyang Reverb and perfectly silent) including two wall warts.
Am just giving in to the fact that Boss pedals are noisy.

markr76

I have a voodoo lab pedal power 2 and get no hum. I managed to get hum if I shared outlets. But I found out which pedals didn't like to share and gave them their own outlet. I'm running at my limit now. But I'm looking at getting the voodoo labs mondo. Or a second pedal power 2 plus and powering the second from the outlet on the main one if that makes sense. 
My rig is as quiet as can be!
I use evidence audio sis cable too which I can't recommend enough. It's expensive but worth it.

markr76

Also I rate the voodoo labs stuff more highly than the cioks stuff. A friend had cioks power and he had a lot of trouble with it. Everyone else I know uses voodoo labs and have had no trouble.
I know it's only 1 person. But it still sticks in the head when splashing out money on stuff!!

Wazmeister

ALWAYS buy quality power supply... and I speak from many many trials and mistakes !

Best of the bunch will ensure aa good low noise basis to develop;

- Strymon stuff - the no.1 for me
- Gigrh distributor

TheBigDipper

@Dave_Vader ;;

Doing this from memory, because I'm just about to run out of the house and get on a train to go see Froomie and G cruise around Central London, but...

• +1 for Waz. Expensive high quality power supplies just work and repay the expense in the end. Are you using one to power your Isolator? I'm not clear on that.
• Boss analogue pedals are not particularly noisier than anything else. Never knowingly used a digital one apart from my GT-100 MFX. 
• Daisy chaining (or a Distributor) works fine for low demand analogue pedals.
• If you want to be anal, try running DC power cables away from signal cables and crossing them at 90 degree angles. Some say that works. I've never needed to try. 
• Digital pedals don't play nicely with analogue pedals and introduce noise to systems unless isolated.
• The GigRig Isolator has poorly documented limits to the amount of power it will supply per isolated line (150mA from memory) which isn't usually enough for a high demand digital pedal. I had a very noisy Line6 M5 that an Isolator couldn't power or isolate properly. The solution GigRig peeps suggested was a dedicated Time Machine (I didn't bother, just powered it off the Line 6 wall wart and all went quiet). 
• If you get a noisy pedal, just use a dedicated power supply and see if it goes quiet. If so, it's not the pedal that's the problem, it's something on your board. 

Good luck! Hoping to come home tonight and read you've fixed it. 

meltedbuzzbox

markr76 said:

Also I rate the voodoo labs stuff more highly than the cioks stuff. A friend had cioks power and he had a lot of trouble with it. Everyone else I know uses voodoo labs and have had no trouble.
I know it's only 1 person. But it still sticks in the head when splashing out money on stuff!!

Never had a single issue with 2 cioks power supplies.
@gavrichlist ran a huge board with two cioks power supplies and I am pretty sure he didn't have an issue either 

GavRichList

^ yep, that 

Gagaryn

Plus one on getting a decent power supply. It is not a sexy purchase and in most applications you never even see it again after you have bought it but getting the right power supply saves frustration.

I had to buy one recently to power a modestly sized board with a mix of analogue and high draw digital pedals.  My best option was the Strymon Zuma and if I ever decide to go larger I can add Oija expansion - could potentially then run the Broadcast at 24v by using two 12v outputs and a voltage doubler cable rather than the single 18v output currently powering it. My board = zero hum.

Plenty people successfully powering much more impressive boards than mine but this gives an idea of what can be powered with a single supply.

Slimbert

Buy a really good quality power supply once and you'll almost certainly never regret it.

They aren't sexy but it'll be worth the money for the peace of mind alone. They fix most hum problems and you won't have to worry about what pedals you use or what can sit next to what etc etc.

I've got three fully isolated supplies under my board and I've never once regretted it. They're worth every penny!