Is it possible to get GIbson's Min-Etune system to be accurate when tuning

Fortheloveofguitar

My father in law has one and has already had 3 tuners fail with a short time and nothing but trouble with it. Now on his 4th warranty claim 

Told him to throw it in the landfill and put some proper tuners on and go old school. 

Legionreturns

FatBastard said:

Sure, I understand your point guys. But I believe it is fairly easy to remove the autotuners if required, and if the Special HP is a better guitar overall, it might be worth purchasing - bearing the future removal in mind all the while. I did not know Gibson had a poor reputation for build quality. My Standard Les Paul is a very solidly put together. I have not read the Special HPs have frequent lapses in quality like the Nakeds though. Just a thought.

I actually really rated my Special HP, especially the titanium zero fret nut. That said, you can definitely find them for less than £500. 

FatBastard

Legionreturns said:

FatBastard said:

Sure, I understand your point guys. But I believe it is fairly easy to remove the autotuners if required, and if the Special HP is a better guitar overall, it might be worth purchasing - bearing the future removal in mind all the while. I did not know Gibson had a poor reputation for build quality. My Standard Les Paul is a very solidly put together. I have not read the Special HPs have frequent lapses in quality like the Nakeds though. Just a thought.

I actually really rated my Special HP, especially the titanium zero fret nut. That said, you can definitely find them for less than £500. 

I doubt for less than £500 NEW.

noisepolluter

Unless you use multiple tunings in the same song, and need to do so live, then automated tuners are a solution looking for a problem.

NelsonP

FatBastard said:

The thing is I have wayyyy more guitars than is actually legitimate for my level of ability, and the only justification I had was the min-Etune

I think this is the key sentence. You bought the guitar for this and its rubbish. Send it back.

Wazmeister

Ill strike a different pose here...

I briefly owned several different incarnations of the 2015 G Force models. Every single one worked well PROVIDING you followed Gibsons instructions, and especially kept the battery charged.

It proved to be a great system for me, and worked well at tunings experiments.

mort

Wazmeister said:

Ill strike a different pose here...

I briefly owned several different incarnations of the 2015 G Force models. Every single one worked well PROVIDING you followed Gibsons instructions, and especially kept the battery charged.

It proved to be a great system for me, and worked well at tunings experiments.

This. I still have two G force equipped Gibsons and they’re still working fine, had no problems at all.

FatBastard

Bigsby said:

If you REALLY want to mess around with it - you can adjust the Min-Etune to tune more slowly and more accurately. I did this with one and it worked fine. But you do have to read the manual, (and I know a lot of people hate to do that!). I ended up replacing mine with a G-Force, just because it was cheap to do, worked more quickly, and it meant I didn't have to remember different systems of button pushes for different guitars.

The G-Force is MUCH better than the Min-Etune on it's default settings, and still gives you the option to adjust for a balance of speed/accuracy. Of course, I've heard plenty of horror stories in places like this, but I've had three G-Force tuners, and no issues with any of them so far (I still have two - I sold a guitar with one of them).

The G-Force is the same as the Tronical Plus - it was just Gibson's name for the new model. 

I would recommend you avoid buying ANYTHING from Tronical directly - I had a dreadful experience with them. Shame, as a Strat with a Tronical Plus would be fantastic - I loathe retuning a guitar with a floating trem.

The HP SG models were quite a significant step up in terms of specifications, even on the lower budget models. I have a 2016 SG Standard HP, and it's the only Gibson I've ever bought new that was apparently free of ANY flaws*. It's a fantastic SG.  But they're Gibsons, so YMMV  

*Incidentally, I tried it back to back with another Standard HP, and I couldn't find a single issue with either of them. For me, that was a first when buying a Gibson.

Thank-you for the very helpful post. I am glad SOMEONE likes the G-Force, although I need to be careful and check my confirmation bias :-) and will try it in the shop. I am most likely leaning towards returning it and picking up the 2016 Special HP. If the G-Force on that is more accurate (and I realise that the setup of the guitar can also contribute to how well it works), then great, but if it does not it is not that difficult to replace and I believe that the nut on this one is safer than the one on the 2013, although as I say I think tonally the 2013 is more my bag. I know the G-Force is faster and gives more options than the Min-Etune, but do you think it really has much of an improvement in terms of accuracy which is the key point? I noticed that Thoman are selling the Tronical Plus update hardware for just £60 so one option I considered was buying that (actually was hoping that GAK might get me this for nothing as there is product sold to me is not working in this regard). Reading the other posts on this thread, I doubt that will make be the magic bullet to get the min-Etune work on the 2013 and it will probably be just good money after bad - actually that is overly harsh, as I do like the guitar.

It is good that you found the two 2016 Special HPs to be good quality. I also have the option of the Naked 2016 for the same price and the p90s are more my sort of thing than high output mini humbuckers, but I keep reading reviews complaining about lack of quality control. I think both the 2016 HP and Naked 2016 have quite distinctive necks too (not the same one though as the HP has 24 frets like the Future Tribute).

Incidentally, how do you find the 2016 tonally? Im concerned about the high output. Even when I dial a rock-ish tone, I try and go for the surgical, smooth clean, pencil thin raunch of say Rory Gallagher of Brian May, rather than the bland fat Les Paul / Marshall stack powerchording of 80s stadium rockers (yes fanboys I know you can get different sounds with LP/Marshall combinations, I am making generalisations about a common sound as if I wrote a caveat for every preference this post would never end). Shame they are not the Firebird minis as I could certainly live with them, but you can't expect too much for less than £500.

fandango

ICBM said:

FatBastard said:

I have seen quite a few reviews complaining about the build quality and finishing of the Naked Special though

Don't worry, exactly the same is true of all Gibsons .

Not so. Mine's fine.

Legionreturns

I was quite prepared to like it, that's why I bought one. I just had too many faults to trust it again.  

FatBastard

Legionreturns said:

I was quite prepared to like it, that's why I bought one. I just had too many faults to trust it again.  

Sure, I entirely understand that. You liked the guitar overall though you said. Would you not say that £500 new for the HP is a good deal, providing you go in with your eyes open and be prepared that the G-Force could well be replaced at some point, or would you be more inclined towards the Naked with none?

sunshinewelly

I must be in the minority as my Gibson signature T from 2013 works perfectly. I have used a bit of nut sauce on the nut 

FatBastard

sunshinewelly said:

I must be in the minority as my Gibson signature T from 2013 works perfectly. I have used a bit of nut sauce on the nut 

I think most of the negative comments were about the robot tuners specifically, not about the entire guitar from this era. What is 'nut sauce'?

FatBastard

noisepolluter said:

Unless you use multiple tunings in the same song, and need to do so live, then automated tuners are a solution looking for a problem.

NelsonP said:

FatBastard said:

The thing is I have wayyyy more guitars than is actually legitimate for my level of ability, and the only justification I had was the min-Etune

I think this is the key sentence. You bought the guitar for this and its rubbish. Send it back.

Thanks for your input guys, but we have actually moved on a bit now. Since the consensus is to return it, that is what I'm likely to do. The thing is to me it is not a 'rubbish' guitar. I like it very much. The tone is much nicer than my Gibson Les Paul Standard (a far pricier guitar), and although not quite as good as my Strat or my Jazzmaster copy with P90s, I would give it a good 8 out of 10. I also find it easier to play than my other guitars which is a plus as I struggle with a few stretches and full chords since breaking my wrist in 3 places some years ago.  The thing is the autotuners are not useable so that justification is out of the window, and on this model I have read that as well as ripping out of the tuners, sometimes the nut needs replacing too.

I will most likely return it, after trying the other two available to me. The HP Special has the later robotuners and a better zero fret nut. I was leaning towards that, although lets see what happens when I try it this week. I figure if the later G-Force works then great, but if all I need to do later is to put conventional tuners in, then that is not a disaster. I am wary of the mini humbuckers though which are not the same as the Firebird ones but overwound and high output. I was never a big fan of my Les Paul because I found it too harsh and chunky although a much less physically beefy guitar like an SG is not likely to be as meaty (Gibson devotees, this is just my subjective opinion so please don't get your knickers in a twist) despite the output of the minis being many times that of the burstbuckers of the LP. I suspect the Naked will have a better tone to my ear as I generally prefer P90s to humbuckers (although the 57 Classics on the 2013 are pretty nice and old school), and it has no robotuners to begin with but the reviews I have seen of it frequently disparage its sloppy build quality. I am not sure why different US Gibson models would have a poorer build average than others - maybe on the cheaper ones they rush them out quickly with less quality checks?

FatBastard

fandango said:

ICBM said:

FatBastard said:

I have seen quite a few reviews complaining about the build quality and finishing of the Naked Special though

Don't worry, exactly the same is true of all Gibsons .

Not so. Mine's fine.

I'm pretty sure what he was saying is that it is common for there to be plenty of complaints about the quality control standards of various different Gibson models, not that all Gibson guitars produced have a shoddy build.

FatBastard

noisepolluter said:

Unless you use multiple tunings in the same song, and need to do so live, then automated tuners are a solution looking for a problem.

NelsonP said:

FatBastard said:

The thing is I have wayyyy more guitars than is actually legitimate for my level of ability, and the only justification I had was the min-Etune

I think this is the key sentence. You bought the guitar for this and its rubbish. Send it back.

Thanks for your input guys, but we have actually moved on a bit now. Since the consensus is to return it, that is what I'm likely to do. The thing is to me it is not a 'rubbish' guitar. I like it very much. The tone is much nicer than my Gibson Les Paul Standard (a far pricier guitar), and although not quite as good as my Strat or my Jazzmaster copy with P90s, I would give it a good 8 out of 10. I also find it easier to play than my other guitars which is a plus as I struggle with a few stretches and full chords since breaking my wrist in 3 places some years ago.  The thing is the autotuners are not useable so that justification is out of the window, and on this model I have read that as well as ripping out of the tuners, sometimes the nut needs replacing too.

I will most likely return it, after trying the other two available to me. The HP Special has the later robotuners and a better zero fret nut. I was leaning towards that, although lets see what happens when I try it this week. I figure if the later G-Force works then great, but if all I need to do later is to put conventional tuners in, then that is not a disaster. I am wary of the mini humbuckers though which are not the same as the Firebird ones but overwound and high output. I was never a big fan of my Les Paul because I found it too harsh and chunky although a much less physically beefy guitar like an SG is not likely to be as meaty (Gibson devotees, this is just my subjective opinion so please don't get your knickers in a twist) despite the output of the minis being many times that of the burstbuckers of the LP. I suspect the Naked will have a better tone to my ear as I generally prefer P90s to humbuckers (although the 57 Classics on the 2013 are pretty nice and old school), and it has no robotuners to begin with but the reviews I have seen of it frequently disparage its sloppy build quality. I am not sure why different US Gibson models would have a poorer build average than others - maybe on the cheaper ones they rush them out quickly with less quality checks?

FatBastard

fandango said:

ICBM said:

FatBastard said:

I have seen quite a few reviews complaining about the build quality and finishing of the Naked Special though

Don't worry, exactly the same is true of all Gibsons .

Not so. Mine's fine.

I'm pretty sure what he was saying is that it is common for there to be plenty of complaints about the quality control standards of various different Gibson models, not that all Gibson guitars produced have a shoddy build.

FatBastard

Sorry guys about the duplicate posts. Don't know why this happened - presumably something to do with the VPN. I have flagged them with the admin to remove as I cant.

sunshinewelly

FatBastard said:

sunshinewelly said:

I must be in the minority as my Gibson signature T from 2013 works perfectly. I have used a bit of nut sauce on the nut 

I think most of the negative comments were about the robot tuners specifically, not about the entire guitar from this era. What is 'nut sauce'?

i was specifically posting about the robot tuners - my signature T has the tropical tuners and they have always worked well. Nut sauce is a substance that you put on the guitar nut and it reduces friction at the nut

Bigsby

FatBastard said:

Bigsby said:

If you REALLY want to mess around with it - you can adjust the Min-Etune to tune more slowly and more accurately. 

Thank-you for the very helpful post. I am glad SOMEONE likes the G-Force, although I need to be careful and check my confirmation bias :-) and will try it in the shop. I am most likely leaning towards returning it and picking up the 2016 Special HP. If the G-Force on that is more accurate (and I realise that the setup of the guitar can also contribute to how well it works), then great, but if it does not it is not that difficult to replace and I believe that the nut on this one is safer than the one on the 2013, although as I say I think tonally the 2013 is more my bag. I know the G-Force is faster and gives more options than the Min-Etune, but do you think it really has much of an improvement in terms of accuracy which is the key point? I noticed that Thoman are selling the Tronical Plus update hardware for just £60 so one option I considered was buying that 

I did get the Min-Etune to work accurately, but it had to be made to operate slower - and that also meant more individual picks when strum tuning. If anything, individual string tuning was quicker - which is not the way it should be! The G-Force is faster on it's default settings, so a lot quicker when compared to a Min-Etune that's been set to operate more slowly. if you compared the two I doubt you'd want the Min-Etune - even if you don't think speed is important. 

To upgrade mine, I just bought a G-Force from Ebay (cheaper than the Tronical upgrade), and that gave me a complete Min-Etune to sell too. IIRC, the upgrade ended up costing me £20. Well worth it - but you do have to make sure you're buying the right model - they don't all fit an SG.