Has anybody used kitbuiltguitars.co.uk?

chrishill901

I am looking at doing a kit as a long term project, but I play Les Pauls and wont settle for a basswood body or a bolt on neck. I have found a kit that is mahogany bodied and set neck for only £120 which to me seems reasonable. Has anyone got experience with this company?

http://www.kitbuiltguitars.co.uk/guitarkits/build-your-own-guitar-flamed-maple-super-lp-style-guitar.html

Is there anything that jumps out at the more experienced builders among you that you think I should avoid? I dont intend to use any of the hardware - if I can get the finish looking good then I aim to pump a little money into it over time - decent pickups, possibly a fishman powerbridge and a duesenberg les trem. Basically I want to make it into the Les Paul I wish my Les Paul was but dared F**k with, and dont want to as I want to keep that particular guitar as is. Are there better kits out there? Is this a wise move or will a kit guitar always be naff?

Any help from you fine fellows is always appreciated

TTony

Check out the "theFB Challenge 2014" - that was all about putting together kit guitars.  

All kits were sourced from the same supplier, but then most kits available will have originated from a very small number of Chinese factories (2-3 last time I looked for potential suppliers), so you may well find that this place get their kits from the same place anyway.

chrishill901

Cheers - I kept an eye on that thread... its what got me on the idea of doing a kit, but the LPs from G4M are bolt on and basswood

TTony

I just looked at the link ... wow, that's some spec (on paper) for £120!!

chrishill901

Thats what I was thinking! There has to be a catch? Awful neck? Obviously the hardware will be naff but I wouldnt use it. Seems superb for the price... If only I could find a kit with a spalted maple top...

mudslide73

The flamey LP looks nice. I've got enough spare bits in my parts drawer to build one too.

TTony

chrishill901 said:

Thats what I was thinking! There has to be a catch? Awful neck? Obviously the hardware will be naff but I wouldnt use it.

The main conclusion from the G4M kits was that they were pretty damn good for the money, and that any faults / poor finishing was reasonably easily sorted.

There's only one way that you're going to find out ...

mudslide73 said:

The flamey LP looks nice. I've got enough spare bits in my parts drawer to build one too.

... wait for @mudslide73 to buy one and post his findings!

mudslide73

Arf. I may well do - I just need somewhere to do it. My one project at a time rule stops me from pulling the trigger atm though. mmmm.

chrishill901

haha i'll certainly keep my eye on @mudslide73 's activity!!

If i do get one itll be after xmas. I suppose I'm wondering what quality to expect from a kit? How did the G4M ones turn out? I do want to build one but not if the end quality is only the same as the mahogany Harley Benton LPs for £115 http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_l450plus_honey_burst.htm

Obviously it'd have the pickups, hardware and finish I want, and have sentimental value, but the price once I have got all of the kit will likely be in excess of £500. Will it play like a £500 shop bought guitar? Or used? there are some serious bargains to be had at the moment - an LP studio can be had for that, probably with enough to fill the car up afterwards. Should I be expecting a decent guitar or will a kit guitar always be a kit guitar and in a sense, 'a bit of fun' - and if thats a case should I just go basswood and use the hardware it comes with?

Andyjr1515

Hi, @chrishill901

If you look at the 'Oh Well Why Not..' thread in the challenge, you'll see the offset I had a go at.  You will also see that I added decent pickups etc, but the body, neck, even the vibrato, are from the kit.  Total cost, including the kit was about £400.

It is ABSOLUTELY now my main gigging guitar, ahead of a very fancy own design in mahogany and yew, ahead of a Gibson Les Paul, ahead of an Ibanez superstrat, ahead of an Indie Les Paul, custom built for a big US show...

For me, it feels just right (I adjusted the neck profile) it sounds brilliant and it looks wonderful and unique.

BUT...resale value probably wouldn't even cover 2/3 of the cost.  

So - if you're intending to play it, do it....if you're trying to make a bob on it, better to put your money on the horses 

Hope this helps (go for it; go for it; go for it; go f....)

Andy 

TTony

chrishill901 said:

I suppose I'm wondering what quality to expect from a kit?

Let's be analytical for a moment.

Cost £120.  VAT £20, so cash to retailer £100.

Retailer profit margin 33%, so cost of kit to retailer £75.

Shipping to retailer, plus import costs lets guess £15/kit, so factory gate price £60.

Allow the mfr a profile margin of 20%, so manufacturing cost £50.

You've got all the hardware, wood, and manufacturing costs in that £50, so the hardware and wood are not going to be high quality!

Hell, you shouldn't be expecting to get a half-decent body OR neck OR set of hardware for £50.

So, that should set your quality expectations!!

chrishill901 said:

Obviously it'd have the pickups, hardware and finish I want, and have sentimental value, but the price once I have got all of the kit will likely be in excess of £500. Will it play like a £500 shop bought guitar? Or used? there are some serious bargains to be had at the moment

The short answer to will it play like a £500 guitar is "that depends -partly- on your skills".  How well can you put it together, resolve any issues/defects that emerge, set it up, and finish it?

As @Andyjr1515 (and WezV to name just two of the kit-completists) demonstrated, you can put together quite a decent guitar based on those kits, if you've got the skills, tools and time to do it.  

Will it be the equal of a £500 guitar?  In pure quality terms, I'd be tempted to say "no" just because the £500 shop bought guitar is likely to be built on better woods than your kit.  But spending £500 in a shop is a completely different experience to playing something that you put together yourself, to your own specs.

If you're looking at ways to spend £500 on a s/h guitar ... well, then the decision is even more loaded towards buy rather than build.  £500 would almost get you a beat-up US PRS which will be streets ahead in terms of quality of materials and workmanship.  It'll get you all sorts of used Gibbos.  

Ah, but as soon as I compare a cheap Chinese kit to proper Gibbos, the quality comparison becomes .... less clearcut.

I'd look at it differently.  

Spend £120 and you can have a huge amount of fun putting together a playable instrument, learning how to make it play right, sound right and feel right, and it'll be something unique to you.  That's a lot of fun and satisfaction for £120.

Andyjr1515 said:

(go for it; go for it; go for it; go f....)

ThePrettyDamned

TTony said:

chrishill901 said:

I suppose I'm wondering what quality to expect from a kit?

Let's be analytical for a moment.

Cost £120.  VAT £20, so cash to retailer £100.

Retailer profit margin 33%, so cost of kit to retailer £75.

Shipping to retailer, plus import costs lets guess £15/kit, so factory gate price £60.

Allow the mfr a profile margin of 20%, so manufacturing cost £50.

You've got all the hardware, wood, and manufacturing costs in that £50, so the hardware and wood are not going to be high quality!

Hell, you shouldn't be expecting to get a half-decent body OR neck OR set of hardware for £50.

So, that should set your quality expectations!!

chrishill901 said:

Obviously it'd have the pickups, hardware and finish I want, and have sentimental value, but the price once I have got all of the kit will likely be in excess of £500. Will it play like a £500 shop bought guitar? Or used? there are some serious bargains to be had at the moment

The short answer to will it play like a £500 guitar is "that depends -partly- on your skills".  How well can you put it together, resolve any issues/defects that emerge, set it up, and finish it?

As @Andyjr1515 (and WezV to name just two of the kit-completists) demonstrated, you can put together quite a decent guitar based on those kits, if you've got the skills, tools and time to do it.  

Will it be the equal of a £500 guitar?  In pure quality terms, I'd be tempted to say "no" just because the £500 shop bought guitar is likely to be built on better woods than your kit.  But spending £500 in a shop is a completely different experience to playing something that you put together yourself, to your own specs.

If you're looking at ways to spend £500 on a s/h guitar ... well, then the decision is even more loaded towards buy rather than build.  £500 would almost get you a beat-up US PRS which will be streets ahead in terms of quality of materials and workmanship.  It'll get you all sorts of used Gibbos.  

Ah, but as soon as I compare a cheap Chinese kit to proper Gibbos, the quality comparison becomes .... less clearcut.

I'd look at it differently.  

Spend £120 and you can have a huge amount of fun putting together a playable instrument, learning how to make it play right, sound right and feel right, and it'll be something unique to you.  That's a lot of fun and satisfaction for £120.

Andyjr1515 said:

(go for it; go for it; go for it; go f....)

Wisdoms!

If you were going to source a seperate body and neck from a proper luthier, then source hardware, then electronics yourself, you'll end up with a *quality* guitar. 

With these kits, I'd think of it as ideal for a first time.  I should have gone for that instead of a Warmoth Jazzmaster - way over my head with that one set up wise, though I learnt a lot.  The finish was meh (not awful, but... Meh), and I've since reduced it to parts. 

Do I regret it? 

NO.  It taught me that I love tinkering with them as much as I love learning to play them.  And I get better each time.  

If you got the kit, expect to have to fettle the neck join to get the correct angle for sure - this is something Gibson don't always get right, mind!

And finish it, put it together and see how it is stock - if it plays okay and has a nice acoustic voice, it might be a nice guitar worthwhile upgrading.  If it's dull unplugged, perhaps not - but the bug might have bitten you. 

I'd not make my mistake - don't spend out too much on your first kit.  See if you enjoy it, and take it from there your future ones will only improve. 

breadfan

^ Great post TTony. You've got me itching to go on a Bailey build course too - it mightn't be a bad idea to dip my feet in the water with something like this.

TTony

breadfan said:

You've got me itching to go on a Bailey build course too 

No-one ever regrets doing a Bailey course.  They are inspirational.  

breakstuff

Would love to do that Bailey course but haven't got the spare funds at the moment.

Just need to get rid of these pesky kids and I'll be sorted

chrishill901

Some superb posts regarding this, thank you everyone. Andy - I read your thread with fascination, what a brilliant job you did and I think you are right, put it together stock and see how it feels acoustically, and then upgrade because Tony you're perfectly right, £120 for the fun and satisfaction is totally worth it regardless of how it turns out.

I *think* or would like to think I have the skills to fix any issues that could come with a kit, and I have access to a good range of tools. I think most importantly I would drag this build out for a very long time and wouldn't rush anything, so hopefully it will come out OK!I'm going to go for it and buy the kit after Xmas!

I'll keep you guys posted! Stay tuned for a variety of threads titled 'how do I...'

Cheers everyone

Andyjr1515

chrishill901 said:

I *think* or would like to think I have the skills to fix any issues that could come with a kit, and I have access to a good range of tools. I think most importantly I would drag this build out for a very long time and wouldn't rush anything, so hopefully it will come out OK!I'm going to go for it and buy the kit after Xmas!

I'll keep you guys posted! Stay tuned for a variety of threads titled 'how do I...'

Cheers everyone

Great - really looking forward to the results