Got a Zoom, but miss easy patch switching?

digitalscream

Spotted this:

http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/usb-host-board-v2

Buy one pre-installed with the MIDI host firmware for £15, solder MIDI and power connectors on the other end, then connect it to the Zoom G3/G5/MS70CDR/etc and a MIDI controller, and job done.

I've just bought one...my new board will be based around this and a Zoom MS70CDR for loop effects.

markslade07

Be interested to see how this works out. I've got the MS70CDR and switching is a pain, and I've not really worked out how I'd easily use it live yet

digitalscream

markslade07 said:

Be interested to see how this works out. I've got the MS70CDR and switching is a pain, and I've not really worked out how I'd easily use it live yet

Yeah, I'm quite interested too. Not least because I'm a complete klutz when it comes to small electronics

DesVegas

I have my Zoom50g in a bypass loop on my board and my a,b,c etc presets in order of usable sounds, that way i can switch it on and off instantly and with ease.

Has this place a settings thread? I think i'd be great to share some sounds

markslade07

digitalscream said:

markslade07 said:

Be interested to see how this works out. I've got the MS70CDR and switching is a pain, and I've not really worked out how I'd easily use it live yet

Yeah, I'm quite interested too. Not least because I'm a complete klutz when it comes to small electronics

Eek! Good luck!

digitalscream

It doesn't look too difficult, to be honest. The new pedalboard will be a wedge-shaped one, with tuner/boost/phaser in front of the amp and the MS70CDR in the loop, controlled by a MIDI footswitch (ART X-11) and that gadget up there ^^, then stereo outputs via an Orchid Audio Isolator.

EDIT: It just arrived. These things are small:

That's the USB board on the right (obviously), some pins for the voltage regulator (steps down to the 5V necessary for USB) and the regulator itself, with a 2p for scale.

I'm now considering building this whole thing straight into my MIDI controller...just a small cutout on the back for the USB port and wire it in parallel to the MIDI Out on the back. Should even be able to power it from the 5V line in the controller, so I wouldn't have to bother with the power supply, enclosure or a DIN socket.

PolarityMan

I may be being dim here but does this just work because the Zoom provides a midi implementation via USB or are you going to have to write a bunch of software for it?

Bidley

This looks like something that needs to be manufactured and sold en-masse.

digitalscream

Hmmm. Got it powered up, but the Zoom won't respond to anything. I've currently got it plugged into my PC, but I'm not having any luck getting it to obey program changes.

I'm now trying to figure out the low-level MIDI commands...

Nomad

What is the Zoom getting its power from? If it's via USB, it could be pulling too much current through the host board for the latter to work.

digitalscream

Nomad said:

What is the Zoom getting its power from? If it's via USB, it could be pulling too much current through the host board for the latter to work.

That's what I thought, but it should be getting it from the main power in. Of course, there's no documentation as to where it gets the power from when it's connected to both the power socket and USB.

However...it does nothing when just connected to the USB board (although it does when connected to a computer). When connected to both, it powers on.

Nomad

Does the Zoom power up from USB if the external power is disconnected?

Rx and Tx connected the right way round? (They can be a tad ambiguous depending on what is seen as the 'source'.)

Nomad

May have misread - by "does nothing", do you mean it doesn't power up when only connected to the USB board?

And...

When connected to both and powered up, what LEDs are lit on the USB board?

digitalscream

Mother of....

IT'S ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Had to use the step-down voltage regulator (also on their site, couple of quid) directly from the power in on the MIDI controller. The only problem I have is that I've connected the MIDI Tx line directly from the MIDI out socket (ground and power from the voltage regulator); when I connect something to the MIDI socket as well, only that device works and the USB out stops working.

Think I might have to break it out into its own device and hang it on the MIDI OUT from the Voodoo Lab Control Switcher.

Still...all things considered, it's a bloody bargain. Works right out of the box if you're not an idiot like me. However...I've had to work it out from zero documentation and essentially trial-and-error. With a picture of what you're supposed to do, it'd probably take no more than 10 or 15 minutes to put together.

And it really is ace.

digitalscream

Nomad said:

May have misread - by "does nothing", do you mean it doesn't power up when only connected to the USB board?

And...

When connected to both and powered up, what LEDs are lit on the USB board?

Oh, and FYI - the amber LED appears to have been telling me there was a problem. When properly fired up and connected at both ends the green one's lit, as is the middle blue one.

Nomad

Ah, good to know that it works. I was beginning to think if was for some USB/MIDI thing that plugs straight into the computer and gets seen as a MIDI device right away.

Green and blue sounds good.

What happens if you also connect the MIDI Rx line to Tx on the USB board? From this...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MIDI_1.0

...it seems that both are needed (pins 4 & 5 form the current loop, I believe).

Might need to plug it into a MIDI Thru or some sort of distribution box/thing if you want to have more than one device connected. MIDI setup is usually done with cables into sockets, so a parallel connection like you have wouldn't normally happen.

Can you link to the regulator that you added? Methinks I'm going to order one of these.

digitalscream

No - Tx is for MIDI Out socket only, Rx is for MIDI In; you use one or the other on a given port, not both.

With that said, the USB Host device does support two-way communication, so as long as the device on the end of it is willing to parrot incoming MIDI messages straight to the MIDI Out, then - in theory - I could connect the Rx line to the MIDI Out of the foot controller and have it work nicely...as long as there's a USB device on there. If not, then the standard MIDI port on the controller won't work. That's absolutely not what I want; I may need the controller for a real MIDI application later, and I can guarantee that the last thing I want to do is get the soldering iron out at that point.

I do have a plan, though. I'm going to butcher the case for an old laptop power supply (I have many of them kicking around). They're plastic so they're easy to work with, there's plenty of space inside for the MIDI device, regulator and power socket, and they're already designed to work as an inline device (because I'd like to get this running ASAP and don't have any DIN sockets handy without hacking up old MIDI gear that I'd rather keep in working order).

I will say this, though - if you need to control a USB MIDI device like a Zoom, then this is the way to go about it.

Side note: did you know that TC Electronic TonePrint pedals also support MIDI-over-USB? That's how alternate TonePrints get loaded. If somebody could reverse-engineer the MIDI table for one of those...

digitalscream

Oh, and FYI - pin 2 is GND, pin 5 is +5V and pin 4 is either Tx or Rx, depending on the direction of the port.

ThePrettyDamned

Can you list all the parts required and step by step instructions? Because if so, I'll almost certainly get an MX70CDR and something to switch things with. 

Nomad

digitalscream said:

I will say this, though - if you need to control a USB MIDI device like a Zoom, then this is the way to go about it.

Indeed. This regulator?

http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/electronic-components/voltage-regulators/s7v7f5-5v-regulator

digitalscream said:

Side note: did you know that TC Electronic TonePrint pedals also support MIDI-over-USB? That's how alternate TonePrints get loaded. If somebody could reverse-engineer the MIDI table for one of those...

Interesting. My phone is too old to do the TonePrint thing, but I have done it over USB - didn't realise the comms is MIDI. I'd take a guess at a sysex message.

digitalscream

ThePrettyDamned said:

Can you list all the parts required and step by step instructions? Because if so, I'll almost certainly get an MX70CDR and something to switch things with. 

Yep, as soon as I've got a working standalone unit

Nomad said:

digitalscream said:

I will say this, though - if you need to control a USB MIDI device like a Zoom, then this is the way to go about it.

Indeed. This regulator?

http://www.hobbytronics.co.uk/electronic-components/voltage-regulators/s7v7f5-5v-regulator

That's the badger.

Nomad said:

digitalscream said:

Side note: did you know that TC Electronic TonePrint pedals also support MIDI-over-USB? That's how alternate TonePrints get loaded. If somebody could reverse-engineer the MIDI table for one of those...

Interesting. My phone is too old to do the TonePrint thing, but I have done it over USB - didn't realise the comms is MIDI. I'd take a guess at a sysex message.

Yep - if you plug it into your computer and take a gander at the device manager, it comes up as a class-compliant MIDI device. It's possible it's a SYSEX dump, but it'd be really bloody nice if it was just done with CCs.