Non-Guitar Centric Music

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  • SnapSnap Frets: 2513

    @clarky - how am I getting on? Hmm, well, err, I've done naff all!

    In my defence, we are in the middle of doing a house up, and selling this one, so its a bit frantic. My spare time is being spent shopping for stuff and co-ordinating builders etc. And crying at the bills!!!

    Once we've moved, I will have a new recording setup - a  better space, more privacy and a new PC with fresh install. I will also have all umpteen of my guitars out of storage and to hand in racks. Hopefully the clean new install and space will inspire me. Its more a question of time, not will.

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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Snap said:

    @clarky - how am I getting on? Hmm, well, err, I've done naff all!

    In my defence, we are in the middle of doing a house up, and selling this one, so its a bit frantic. My spare time is being spent shopping for stuff and co-ordinating builders etc. And crying at the bills!!!

    Once we've moved, I will have a new recording setup - a  better space, more privacy and a new PC with fresh install. I will also have all umpteen of my guitars out of storage and to hand in racks. Hopefully the clean new install and space will inspire me. Its more a question of time, not will.

    and in the mean time I've submitted 2 trailers to da boss man and have a 3rd about 80% done..

    and based on my last chat with him, I have another 5 to deliver in the style of "Fantasy Warfare"
    these should be fun... crashing and banging and shouty
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • My apologies I think I may have posted in the wrong place. I’ll take it down. Thanks
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    My apologies I think I may have posted in the wrong place. I’ll take it down. Thanks
    no need to take it down at all..

    do you have anything you've done without guitars?
    if so it'll be cool to check it out..
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • Clarky said:
    My apologies I think I may have posted in the wrong place. I’ll take it down. Thanks
    no need to take it down at all..

    do you have anything you've done without guitars?
    if so it'll be cool to check it out..
    No just guitar I’m afraid. Cheers
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Clarky said:
    My apologies I think I may have posted in the wrong place. I’ll take it down. Thanks
    no need to take it down at all..

    do you have anything you've done without guitars?
    if so it'll be cool to check it out..
    No just guitar I’m afraid. Cheers
    time to explore the dark side then... lol..
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    time to pop a new one in here...


    play every note as if it were your first
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    here's another epic hybrid orchestral trailer


    play every note as if it were your first
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  • Flink_PoydFlink_Poyd Frets: 2355
    Really interesting thread. I've got back into making electronic music (made a horrible noise years ago) and I find myself drifting more toward it for making music. I find it a lot more straightforward than trying to write a song on guitar but it's by no means easier. 
    Nobody is guaranteed tomorrow.....


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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    here's an existing piece with a re-written mid-section [at the request of the boss - cos he wanted something more rhythmic]

    play every note as if it were your first
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047

    Really interesting thread. I've got back into making electronic music (made a horrible noise years ago) and I find myself drifting more toward it for making music. I find it a lot more straightforward than trying to write a song on guitar but it's by no means easier. 
    I personally find it more difficult [trailers]..
    juggling a full orchestra, choir, synths, loads of massive drums is a production nightmare..
    and also basically writing something that has to have all the contrasts of a symphony but is the length of a single.. lol..
    those little 2:30 to 3:30 pieces take months to nail...
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • Flink_PoydFlink_Poyd Frets: 2355
    Clarky said:

    Really interesting thread. I've got back into making electronic music (made a horrible noise years ago) and I find myself drifting more toward it for making music. I find it a lot more straightforward than trying to write a song on guitar but it's by no means easier. 
    I personally find it more difficult [trailers]..
    juggling a full orchestra, choir, synths, loads of massive drums is a production nightmare..
    and also basically writing something that has to have all the contrasts of a symphony but is the length of a single.. lol..
    those little 2:30 to 3:30 pieces take months to nail...
    I'm just at home with 2 guitars, a midi keyboard and a PC trying stuff out. What you do sounds waaaaaaay more complicated. I'm learning stuff every time I turn the PC on so it's fun for me 
    Nobody is guaranteed tomorrow.....


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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Clarky said:

    Really interesting thread. I've got back into making electronic music (made a horrible noise years ago) and I find myself drifting more toward it for making music. I find it a lot more straightforward than trying to write a song on guitar but it's by no means easier. 
    I personally find it more difficult [trailers]..
    juggling a full orchestra, choir, synths, loads of massive drums is a production nightmare..
    and also basically writing something that has to have all the contrasts of a symphony but is the length of a single.. lol..
    those little 2:30 to 3:30 pieces take months to nail...
    I'm just at home with 2 guitars, a midi keyboard and a PC trying stuff out. What you do sounds waaaaaaay more complicated. I'm learning stuff every time I turn the PC on so it's fun for me 
    no matter what you're doing or how difficult it is... fun is the killer thing.. you have to love doing it
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • BezzerBezzer Frets: 217
    Clarky said:
    no matter what you're doing or how difficult it is... fun is the killer thing.. you have to love doing it
    Top notch wiz (as is expected) from Clarky there.

    Just getting into all this keys malarky myself ... been a long time since I played a piano so it's "interesting".  However, playing with EastWest samples is just filling me with joy so it's driving me to create ... yeah, some of it is utter garbage but I'm learning and having fun.

    Now I just need to learn how all the instruments are SUPPOSED to interact to get a realistic sound.  So, cue lots of listening to Clarky and Daniele Gottardo!
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Bezzer said:
    Clarky said:
    no matter what you're doing or how difficult it is... fun is the killer thing.. you have to love doing it
    Top notch wiz (as is expected) from Clarky there.

    Just getting into all this keys malarky myself ... been a long time since I played a piano so it's "interesting".  However, playing with EastWest samples is just filling me with joy so it's driving me to create ... yeah, some of it is utter garbage but I'm learning and having fun.

    Now I just need to learn how all the instruments are SUPPOSED to interact to get a realistic sound.  So, cue lots of listening to Clarky and Daniele Gottardo!
    if it makes you feel better...
    it took me over a year of failing before I managed to get a trailer accepted
    that piece was ok.. but nothing special [especially production]
    I spent many months [more than 6 in all] studying the work of others [including Zimmer, Shaw, Williams] to try to understand their production methods.. 
    then I had the eureka moment.. everything started to make sense.. and the production took a quantum leap..
    that piece was saved as a template and is now used as a starting point for every new piece..

    if you want help about how to get instruments / instrument sections to interact, just shout
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • SnapSnap Frets: 2513

    Here's another recent one, only a couple of minutes long, but attempting to resurrect this thread!

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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Snap said:

    Here's another recent one, only a couple of minutes long, but attempting to resurrect this thread!

    ooooooo yeah.... that's lovely
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • I'm getting into "non guitar music".  The last year has seem me pick up an rd2000 stagevoiano, fa07 workstation and novation peak synth (which I'm loving).

    Add to that a 14 in 12 out mixer interested and proper software with studio one pro.. ..

    If I could get my head around drum patterns (synth style or more acoustic drums) and had the remotest idea how to write lyrics, I'd had good to go.

    I can however see myself doing some synthy/ambienrstuff minus lyrics.
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  • prowlaprowla Frets: 1222
    I don't understand the question...
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Snap said:

    Here's another recent one, only a couple of minutes long, but attempting to resurrect this thread!

    production thing: compared to the orchestra, the piano sounds quite dry. This makes it sound like it's not in the same 'space' as the orchestra.
    if the orchestra and piano are using different reverbs, I'd suggest using the same one for both and with similar or the same wet / dry settings
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    I'm getting into "non guitar music".  The last year has seem me pick up an rd2000 stagevoiano, fa07 workstation and novation peak synth (which I'm loving).

    Add to that a 14 in 12 out mixer interested and proper software with studio one pro.. ..

    If I could get my head around drum patterns (synth style or more acoustic drums) and had the remotest idea how to write lyrics, I'd had good to go.

    I can however see myself doing some synthy/ambienrstuff minus lyrics.
    a lot of good drum plug-in's these days come with pattern libraries that have been played-in by real drummers.. grooves and fills in a wide range of styles.
    they sound very good too and so are ideal for people that have little experiences with drums

    play every note as if it were your first
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  • SnapSnap Frets: 2513
    Clarky said:
    production thing: compared to the orchestra, the piano sounds quite dry. This makes it sound like it's not in the same 'space' as the orchestra.
    if the orchestra and piano are using different reverbs, I'd suggest using the same one for both and with similar or the same wet / dry settings

    Hi mate, thanks for the feedback. Changed it, and the piano is now going into the same buss as the strings, and it sounds a lot better. I was thinking the piano sounded to wide, so I put it into a different chain, different reverb & EQ, but, putting it back in with the strings and adjusting levels, it sounds a lot better. I agree, it did sound isolated, unnatural before, hopefully better now.


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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Snap said:
    Clarky said:
    production thing: compared to the orchestra, the piano sounds quite dry. This makes it sound like it's not in the same 'space' as the orchestra.
    if the orchestra and piano are using different reverbs, I'd suggest using the same one for both and with similar or the same wet / dry settings

    Hi mate, thanks for the feedback. Changed it, and the piano is now going into the same buss as the strings, and it sounds a lot better. I was thinking the piano sounded to wide, so I put it into a different chain, different reverb & EQ, but, putting it back in with the strings and adjusting levels, it sounds a lot better. I agree, it did sound isolated, unnatural before, hopefully better now.


    awesome.... glad it worked..
    I usually run several reverbs for different reasons..
    one will always be labelled 'ambient' because this will be the space into which I place absolutely everything
    for a band this will typically be a shortish room
    for an orchestra something much bigger like a hall or cathedral type
    for this I tend to use convolution reverbs because I'm trying to emulate a real space

    for a sense of 'depth', instruments closest to you will be driest, and those deeper into the room will be wettest
    so in a band, the guitars, bass and vocals get a small hint of this so they are right up front and the kit will get a lot more
    with an orchestra, the whole thing is deep in the room anyhow so everything is pretty wet..
    the strings get the most, the woodwinds get more, the brass even more, the percussion more again, the choir and organ get the most..

    note that this is simply setting up the 'room'
    on top of this I'll add other reverbs purely for creative reasons.. like a longish digital reverb for a lead guitar of vocal..
    or if I was a really spooky cinematic piano I'll drown it in an arena

    so.. you have two reasons for reverb:
    - a space into which you place everything so it all sounds like it's performing in the same place
    - pure effect.. being creative / artistic

    it's perfectly fine to do both at the same time

    play every note as if it were your first
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  • SnapSnap Frets: 2513

    @Clarky nice stuff on reverb. I love all this. We need more of this thread!!

    PS - hope all is well in Clarksville. All is good in Snapsville.In other news, I have a building gas for two things: a Baja Tele, and an Epi Sheraton Pro II. Lmao....

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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Snap said:

    @Clarky nice stuff on reverb. I love all this. We need more of this thread!!

    PS - hope all is well in Clarksville. All is good in Snapsville.In other news, I have a building gas for two things: a Baja Tele, and an Epi Sheraton Pro II. Lmao....

    all is good thanks.. prepping for a gig in Guildford end of Jan and a short tour early Feb

    no probs with the reverb tips.. they're things I sort of discovered / figured out the hard way..
    by wondering why my mixes weren't working and experimenting / thinking about how sound works

    something I find myself doing when I'm in an interesting sounding place [indoor carpark, stairwell, or out in a valley or surrounded by big buildings etc] is to clap and listen to what happens
    listening for the tone of the reverb and echoes
    firework night was interesting listening to the big booms echo about the buildings..
    the interesting part is that the sound coming back at you can be very different to the original
    digital delays and reverbs tend to throw exactly the same sound back at you.. which is un-natural..
    this begs the question: do I want to be realistic or not?
    the answer is..... both..

    place the band / ensemble / sound source in a realistic space [convolution reverb / delay]
    sweeten and get 'arty' with whatever takes your fancy [convolution, spring/plate, analogue, digital]
    so in a band mix, the lead guitar will be placed in the same 'space' as the rest of the band to glue it into the mix, and the reverb may be a digital one [re-EQ'd so it's not intrusive] with a cool bucket brigade style delay [with the hi's and lows cut and a bit of distortion added]..

    note: if the delay is in parallel [via an aux channel] I'll always feed the delay in to the sweetening reverb so it's tails are not bone dry [to bring them in with the rest of the guitar tone]
    I do this in my live setup to in the Axe-FX
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • SnapSnap Frets: 2513
    Tour - you playing up North? We've been known to come out of our caves now and again....
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Snap said:
    Tour - you playing up North? We've been known to come out of our caves now and again....
    not up north... out west...
    I fly out to Tampa early Feb
    play every note as if it were your first
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  • SnapSnap Frets: 2513
    Clarky said:
    Snap said:
    Tour - you playing up North? We've been known to come out of our caves now and again....
    not up north... out west...
    I fly out to Tampa early Feb

    lmao, Tampa is a bit more exotic than Burnley!!! Have a great one, that's brill mate, hope it goes well. As they say round my parts: rock the chuff on.
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  • ClarkyClarky Frets: 3047
    Snap said:
    Clarky said:
    Snap said:
    Tour - you playing up North? We've been known to come out of our caves now and again....
    not up north... out west...
    I fly out to Tampa early Feb

    lmao, Tampa is a bit more exotic than Burnley!!! Have a great one, that's brill mate, hope it goes well. As they say round my parts: rock the chuff on.
    lol... thanks matey..
    play every note as if it were your first
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