Belated NGD and rebuild thread

Sporky

So... been a while since I did any building. This may take a while. TTony and I did a bit of an NSG swap; my (formerly his) NSG nylon for his NSG26.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-GVRk7PaeyWc/VYZ4i1NkYUI/AAAAAAAAKHw/uzDeVrY6mTo/s800-Ic42/DSC_5577.JPG

Thing is, I like the basic shape and there are some nice timbers in it, but I'm not so keen on the pickups or that it weighs about as much as my car. Also the balance is off - if you try to balance it with a finger under the neck and a finger under the bridge end strap button it spins very quickly to point the pickups straight up. The plan, therefore, is:

1) Convince Mr TT that he'd like to keep the BKP P90s. This turned out not to be very tricky.
2) Convince Mr TT also that he doesn't need the DiMarzio P90 Super Distortion he has in another guitar. Also fairly straightforward.
3) Come up with an alternative pickup and control scheme.
4) Consider a refinish.
5) Consider changing some other hardware.
6) Consider heavily chambering the body.

So 1 and 2 are done. 3 is also done; I've always liked the look of DiMarzio's P90-sized 'buckers, and SP5 has a set so I know they sound decent. But three pickups and a toggle doesn't, to my mind, lend itself to any logical switching system. SP5 has a Freeway switch (looks like a normal toggle, but has 6 positions) but they're incredibly expensive, quite restrictive on sounds and a bit fiddly in use - the middle positions are quite hard to hit reliably.

I considered plugging one of the control holes and recutting for a 5-way, but Mr TT convinced me that this would be quite the faff and to try a PRS-style rotary switch. So that's the control approach sorted. I prefer humbucking sounds - in particular, I'd rather have a parallel pair of coils than split. So the pickup combinations will be:

Neck humbucker
Neck and middle (both split)
Middle humbucker
Neck and bridge (both split)
Bridge humbucker

That looks OK to me; it also becomes quite simple then to have those on a 5-way rotary, then have a push pot that lets me select either series wiring or parallel. This seems to me like a decent balance of flexibility and simplicity. So that's (3) sorted. I've ordered a DLX Plus Neck and a Virtual P90 from Banzai along with a Reynolds-style knob for the switch.

Sporky

4) Refinish. I actually quite like the current finish, but I really, really like mahogany stained black and then with a nice thin finish that lets you feel the grain. I have some suitable stain, so it's a question of how easy it is to strip the current wax/oil finish.

5) I'd thought about going black throughout on the hardware, but on reflection a bit of contrast is fine. However, I may well swap out the tuners for locking ones. I figure the Gotohs that are on at the mo can be sold for enough to fund a set of the Axetec locking tuners which I've used before and like. I had also considered routing for a tremolo but my track record of trying to get tremolos in the right place is appalling, so that's out.

6) Did I mention how heavy it is? I'd guess about 15kg. It wouldn't be that tricky to chamber the body from the back, then recap it with a mahogany plate. I could also make a better-fitting control cavity cover that has a better match with the body wood.

Suggestions on these last three most welcome.

TTony

Butcher.

WezV

What's a butchered NSG worth?

paulnb57

I don't care what you do with the outstanding issues, but hell, I am looking forward to seeing how you do it, keep us updated, please!

Sporky

WezV said:

What's a butchered NSG worth?

More in terms of my wanting to play it.

Probably about the same in terms of resale.

TTony

WezV said:

What's a butchered NSG worth?

To be fair, probably little different to an un-butchered one!

Sporky

In case anyone's interested in the switching, it's actually pretty simple (and can be implemented on a 2-pole 5-way blade switch too).

Each pole of the switch selects one of the two coils that's in use for each position.

Pole 1        Pole 2
neck n        neck s
neck n        mid s
mid n          mid s
neck n        bridge s
bridge n      bridge s

Nicely, this scheme avoids having any coil appear on both poles which should make for neater/easier wiring.

Then the outputs of those two switch poles go to the push/push pot switch section, for which the series/parallel wiring is quite well established - normally used on one 4-conductor humbucker.

TTony

Sporky said:

4) Refinish. I actually quite like the current finish, but I really, really like mahogany stained black and then with a nice thin finish that lets you feel the grain. I have some suitable stain, so it's a question of how easy it is to strip the current wax/oil finish.

5) I'd thought about going black throughout on the hardware, but on reflection a bit of contrast is fine. However, I may well swap out the tuners for locking ones. I figure the Gotohs that are on at the mo can be sold for enough to fund a set of the Axetec locking tuners which I've used before and like. I had also considered routing for a tremolo but my track record of trying to get tremolos in the right place is appalling, so that's out.

6) Did I mention how heavy it is? I'd guess about 15kg. It wouldn't be that tricky to chamber the body from the back, then recap it with a mahogany plate. I could also make a better-fitting control cavity cover that has a better match with the body wood.

Suggestions on these last three most welcome.

4.

That's possibly not a bad idea, and certainly not your worst.  

My experience of staining wood is that the end result is all about the prep effort.  If you leave an uneven residue of the existing finish on - or in - the wood, then the new stain will take unevenly, and will look horrible.  You'd only be able to rectify that by removing all the re-stain, and then having another go at removing the original finish, so you'd really have to get it right first time ...

5.

Not doing a trem is a good idea, and possibly one of your best.

I think I've probably got a set of locking Axetec tuners in my cupboard, but having proved to be a pushover during the pickup negotiations, I'm playing ultra hardball this time.  You're not having them as a swap for the Gotohs.  No way.  Errmmmm ...

6.

You never hear dinosaur PJ wearing superheroes complaining about the weight of things.

It *is* weighty (I don't wear dinosaur PJs and am not a superhero, so can complain about the weight of it), but no more so than a traditional LP type guitar.  OK, your shoulder might start to ache if you had it on a strap whilst bouncing around Wembley for 3hrs, but for the occasional knee-based strum, it shouldn't be too bad.

Chambering = easy.

Fitting the recap = not so easy - you'd need to blend that it with the roundover (is there one - I forget!) on the back of the body.

New cavity cover = good idea - NSG wasn't so hot on those for some strange reason.

There you go.  Suggestions.

Sporky

And, as promised, much appreciated.

Paul_C stripped and stained my Parker Nitefly in exactly the manner I want to do this; the Nitefly, though, was a bolt-on which I suspect makes things less difficult. But I don't mind the finish on the guitar so moving more quickly to a working playable guitar is probably more sensible than having it hang around while I work up the courage.

The trem was a passing idea; I have trem-equipped guitars so this doesn't need to be one.

Similarly the chambering. It'd be quite the undertaking and I have light guitars...

WezV

I don't actually think chambering and a back cap is a bad idea, given he did do some with backcaps like the Nylon one. But it will look odd on this one because its a simpler body construction

Sporky

Progress has been made.

I have placed an order with Banzai Music (Olaf is an old chum from my effect-making days) for:

A DiMarzio DLX Plus Neck (P90-sized 'bucker, hot enough to work in series for grunt or parallel for some jangle)
A DiMarzio Virtual P90 - again, a 'bucker but much lower output  for the middle position
A 500K push/push pot
A 500K tone pot
A 6-way rotary switch
A Reynolds-style aluminium knob for the switch

The 6-way means I can also have middle/bridge as a combination. Also I forgot that I'd bought a PRS 5-way from TTony. Though that appears to have a PCB attached which might rather restrict the wiring options.

Still pondering the chambering. Nathan's output doesn't seem to have significant resale value so no worries on that front, but I'd hate to stuff up what's basically quite a decent bit of outsourced CNC work...

Sporky

...and the pickups still haven't arrived. Gah.

TTony

But what about your butcher's apron - did that arrive yet???

Sporky

I did recently acquire a nice set of Ashley Iles chisels...

https://esecurepayments.co.uk/WebRoot/Daily/Shops/eshop814530/5255/3659/B0C4/D35B/FB19/0A0C/05EA/BC07/27.08.2014_008.JPG

TTony

I bet those solid handles will make them quite heavy.

You could chop at least half of the handle off.

chrispy108

I have little to add other than it'll look awesome black, and probably needs piezos.

Sporky

Now I like piezos, but this is going to have too many controls already.

Sporky

And the other two pickups just turned up. Only missing an Orange Drop now. And gumption.

fretmeister

15kg?

Really?

33 lb? I've had bass cabs lighter than that!

Sporky

I might have exaggerated a bit.

It's probably only 14.5kg.