Acoustic guitar pickup woes and advice ...

Lewy

thomasross20 said:

I've been reading that guitars with X-bracing, like my Larrivee, can potentially have lower output at the high-E side when using K&K pickups, the solution being to place the transducer closer to the treble side as opposed to between the E & B strings. 

I assume nobody has really come across this... 

Nope. I imagine the vast majority of installations are in X-braced guitars.

thomasross20

Yeah... it'll probably be all ok. 

Tempted to move the treble one slightly toward the high E... and the bass one slightly away from the low E (as I've heard it can be a bit bassy)...

Did you fit your own, @Lewy? Mine got delivered yesterday.

Lewy

thomasross20 said:

Yeah... it'll probably be all ok. 

Tempted to move the treble one slightly toward the high E... and the bass one slightly away from the low E (as I've heard it can be a bit bassy)...

Did you fit your own, @Lewy? Mine got delivered yesterday.

I did fit my own yeah. Recalling now, I think the jig that is supplied with the pickup makes you put the bug under the high E as opposed to between B & E anyway....so that's what I would have done because I followed the instructions closely, and they work fine.

Will put one in my recently acquired Collings OM2H too as soon as I can get round to getting a pro to drill the endpin.

thomasross20

Balls of steel. 

I'll have a few practice attempts myself..

ICBM

If you're doing it yourself and fitting the endpin jack, a couple of bits of advice…

*Don't* fit the cover on the inside. It's for shielding, but it makes no difference I can tell, and they have a habit of working loose and rattling. Also don't fit the smooth washer on the inside - just the nut and the serrated washer. That will grip the wood better and stop the nut turning.

It can be a bit of a faff to set the inside nut just right so the outside one tightens fully just as it reaches the end of the thread, but it's worth getting right.

Also, connect the unused ring terminal (or both, depending on the jack - some have a second ring contact) to ground, as well - that doubles up the ground connection and makes certain it's reliable. There's nothing you can do about the tip, that's just one contact, but at least doubling up the ground roughly halves the chance of failure. The tip connection should be the shortest pin.

thomasross20

Hey! Sorry I'm only replying now, was at band practice. 

Hmm... I'll take that advice thanks, and also read the instructions that came with it... if I think it's not something I'll do, I'll get in touch!

thomasross20

Jesus, I'm just waiting 10 mins for the glue to set in on the first one (installing the K&K Pure Mini). I placed it under the high E string as recommended in the latest instructions. Tell you, I had about 3 practice runs.... but nothing prepares you for the moment that glue goes on and starts running everywhere, hoping to high heavens you've put it in the correct spot....

Thumbs up to Larrivee for having a 1/2" end pin socket... no drilling required. However just my luck, I didn't have the correct Allen Key to loosen it up. Quick message to @ICBM and I got it loose with pliers and a cloth. 

Just hope I put "enough" glue on the pickup as they suggest. Two to go.... then the end pin... going to be a long night lol...

thomasross20

Sh!t I think I should have angled it. 

See p13 here... 

http://kksound.com/pdf/puremini.pdf

I never angled it, so it's more likely to hit the X-bracing. Sheeee-ite!! I'll see what it's like when done, might be ok...

EDIT - second one in now... (haha, live action feed!!) - fingers covered in superglue. For a second, thought I'd superglued my hand inside the guitar  

Lewy

thomasross20;1135370" said:

Sh!t I think I should have angled it. See p13 here... http://kksound.com/pdf/puremini.pdf



I never angled it, so it's more likely to hit the X-bracing. Sheeee-ite!! I'll see what it's like when done, might be ok...

EDIT - second one in now... (haha, live action feed!!) - fingers covered in superglue. For a second, thought I'd superglued my hand inside the guitar  

Don't worry about angling it, I'm sure it will be fine. The lead is going to be getting pulled down and back away from the brace.

thomasross20

All done now apart from the jack. 

TOP TIP: Use the two-sided tape to hold the jig to the sensor, not the putty. I can't get all the putty off. I'm sure it's not a big deal (it's probably inhibiting vibrations a very little amount). 

I'll post a pic soon..

thomasross20

2am and I'm done!! 

Took FOREVER to get the jack end pin fitted... Three attempts, each longer than the last. 

ALso had a long faff trying to "loop" the cable so it doesn't hit the top or bottom as per the instructions. 

In the end, I basically made a knot in the cable! 

It's all snug now. Just re-stringing, but haven't even done that for a while - bloomin' bridge pins popping out all over the place. I think I need to tug at the strings so the ball end catches on the plate rather than being held down by the pin itself.

Next time I'm just paying somebody!

Will get pics tomorrow. Wont be able to test it until Wednesday. 

Such faff - so glad I never went with integrated electronics, having to change batteries etc!

thomasross20

There is only one thing I'm concerned with now.. the treble transducer is closer to the bridge pins than the others. Hard to tell on my photo but if that ball end ever touched it, I think it'd be disaster.

thomasross20

There's some clearance between the treble contact and the ball-end. It is closer than the others, but I think it'll be ok (!)

You can see the bracing here and how close it is to the bridge, especially on the treble side:

ICBM

If it's not actually touching it's fine, even the slightest gap is enough.

The ball ends should be exactly like they are now - *not* on the end of the pins.

A tip for stopping the pins popping out when restringing - bend the ball end of the string over before you put it in, and make sure it's pointing towards the neck. That way the pin will slide smoothly past it. You can also file a 45º angle onto the end of the pin if you want to make it really easy, some pins come like that from new although most don't.

thomasross20

Phew!

And good tip that, thanks!
I'm going to see how these elixir nanowebs fare..

I might plug it into the blackstar even to just check it works in general.

Anything like that in future I'll just take to a tech - to you maybe ! I was in your store a few weeks ago, there is some devil strat that looked cool. Let me know if you ever get uncovered 57/08s in the shop, though I think that'd be pretty rare.

ICBM

thomasross20 said:

I might plug it into the blackstar even to just check it works in general.

That should work OK if you use the cleanest possible sound - start with the treble right up, mid right down, bass probably somewhere below halfway, ISF… wherever it sounds best. Keep the volume low and it won't feed back too much.

thomasross20 said:

Let me know if you ever get uncovered 57/08s in the shop, though I think that'd be pretty rare.

Very unlikely. I forgot to reply to your PM, sorry .

thomasross20

Woooooah!! 

Tried it through the Blackstar and it sounds AWESOME - really natural, pretty much like it does unplugged!!

I then tried the amp crunch setting and I've never heard so much howling feedback in my life lol!!!

Also, the Elixir Nanowebs sound FANTASTIC. They do feel a bit slidey. I don't know if it's because of the brand or just that they're new but what a lease of life.... sounds fantastic!

Only thing I want to check now.... is the recommended height from 12th fret to the string as I do think it's a tad high, but only a tad... 

Couldn't be happier with how it's turned out...

ICBM

thomasross20 said:

Only thing I want to check now.... is the recommended height from 12th fret to the string as I do think it's a tad high, but only a tad...

On an acoustic, probably about 2mm on the top E/2.5mm on the bottom E. Maybe a little less, but not much. 1.5mm/2mm would be a fairly normal electric guitar action.

How much relief is there? Hold the guitar in the playing position, fret the G string at the first and fifteenth frets, and have a look at the gap between the string and the 7th-8th frets. If it's more than about half the string diameter you can probably reduce the relief a bit.

thomasross20

I'll be checking this tonight!!

If anything though (and I may be wrong) I think it'd be more to do with the saddle needing shaved than the truss rod adjusted as I'm sure I set it up when I got it for correct relief and still found it a tad high up at the upper frets. 

Evilmags

Acoustic guitars have a much higher dynamic range than electrics so need a different approach to amplification than electrics. Basically look at the following. 

1) Headroom. You need a LOT more of it than for an electric.

2) Feedback is always an issue. Notch filtering with a digital EQ is very helpful. 

3) Use some compression. (3:1-4:1 ratio, threshold set to taste) It will avoid hitting the distorted areas.