help needed on walling hanging guitars.

musicman100

I'm not really into all this displaying guitars n stuff. I've bought single wall hangers and never used them. But now I realise that i have a few guitars that need to be kept out of thier cases to prevent/slowdown binding rot. I'm thinking about mounting about half a dozen angled hangers on a length of wood then just mounting that to the wall. Any ideas guys?

octatonic

Why do you need the wood?

Just mount them individually into the wall.

Use a long spirit level and a ruler to make sure they are level and equally spaced.

Are you mounting into plasterboard or into a solid wall?

ICBM

octatonic said:

Why do you need the wood?

Just mount them individually into the wall.

Use a long spirit level and a ruler to make sure they are level and equally spaced.

Are you mounting into plasterboard or into a solid wall?

Answers own question .

I would always use a nice piece of wood even on a solid wall though - it lets you get much more control of the accuracy as well as avoiding a problem if you happen to hit a bit of soft brickwork or something. You can also use *much* larger screws to hold the wood to the wall than will usually fit through a guitar hanger, which might be necessary if the plaster is thick.

I know I'm being paranoid, but I tend to not trust any guitar hanger to hold an expensive guitar that I wouldn't trust to hold my own weight. (I know I'm not a big chap.)

musicman100

Solid wall but I've tried single mounts before I they were a pain in the bum. Just thought it would be better to mount them on the wood then just rawl bolt the length of wood the the wall then I haven't got loads of shifty holed in the wall.

octatonic

Provided you use a mortice bit you won't have any problems.

I'd argue that hanging them individually is safer because each hanger is designed to hold one instrument.

A piece of wood with (how many) instruments on it and then screwed into the wall will have the entire weight of all the instruments hanging off it.

I'm not saying the wood won't work- but it seems like an unnecessary step to take.

If you can line up a piece of wood straight then you can certainly line up a bunch of individual hangers.

Every time I've been able to reuse the original screws- which are usually 5 or 6mm.

They hold fine- I've done this many times before.

As far as holding- the risk is them being knocked off, rather than the screw suddenly failing- I just put them in places where this won't happen.

I'm currently using 12 String Swing's in my studio.

These are the original screws and they have been used in 3 previous locations.

musicman100

ICBM said:

octatonic said:

Why do you need the wood?

Just mount them individually into the wall.

Use a long spirit level and a ruler to make sure they are level and equally spaced.

Are you mounting into plasterboard or into a solid wall?

Answers own question .

I would always use a nice piece of wood even on a solid wall though - it lets you get much more control of the accuracy as well as avoiding a problem if you happen to hit a bit of soft brickwork or something. You can also use *much* larger screws to hold the wood to the wall than will usually fit through a guitar hanger, which might be necessary if the plaster is thick.

I know I'm being paranoid, but I tend to not trust any guitar hanger to hold an expensive guitar that I wouldn't trust to hold my own weight. (I know I'm not a big chap.)

Thanks mate, that's just my thinking. What make of hanger do you use? It will be for expensive guitars so I want it to be doing right.

guitars4you

Hercules hangers for me - all my nice guitars in store are on such hangers - they don't mark the guitar

ICBM

musicman100 said:

What make of hanger do you use? It will be for expensive guitars so I want it to be doing right.

I've actually got 'cheap' ones - because they're made from steel, no plastic apart from the protective sleeving. I can't seem to find a pic of the same type but they've very simple - two metal rods mounted on a swivel bar which is on a shield-shaped plate.

And yes I can actually hang my own weight from them . (Although I am only 9 and a half stone)

octatonic said:

I'd argue that hanging them individually is safer because each hanger is designed to hold one instrument.

I don't agree at all - if you use really big screws holding the wood to the wall. Mine are attached with 3" No. 12 woodscrews (1/4" diameter) - one of which alone will easily hold my weight. They're far stronger than any screw you can easily fit through a typical hanger, and if you spread the load with several - one per hanger is ideal, you can hide the heads with the hangers themselves so it looks neat - then it's going to be massively strong.

That's also how I fitted my kitchen cabinets rather than screwing the brackets individually like you're normally expected to, and I'm absolutely certain that it's stronger.

musicman100

guitars4you said:

Hercules hangers for me - all my nice guitars in store are on such hangers - they don't mark the guitar

I've got four hercule ones that i never really like.

octatonic

ICBM said:

octatonic said:

I'd argue that hanging them individually is safer because each hanger is designed to hold one instrument.

I don't agree at all - if you use really big screws holding the wood to the wall. Mine are attached with 3" No. 12 woodscrews (1/4" diameter) - one of which alone will easily hold my weight. They're far stronger than any screw you can easily fit through a typical hanger, and if you spread the load with several - one per hanger is ideal, you can hide the heads with the hangers themselves so it looks neat - then it's going to be massively strong.

That's also how I fitted my kitchen cabinets rather than screwing the brackets individually like you're normally expected to, and I'm absolutely certain that it's stronger.

1/4" is the same diameter as the screws I use with the String Swing hangers.

Well 6mm- close enough that it doesn't matter.

If you are particularly paranoid then you can get a 100mm long screw- I've used them in the past when I ran out of 40mm screws.

All of them were up for years with no problems at all.

Again, the risk isn't the hanger or screw breaking, it is the guitar being clumsily being knocked off the hanger.

No screw depth or diameter will stop that from happening.

guitars4you

In the shop my Hercules guitar brackets are mounted on a long row of thick wood that was professionally installed - The joiner actually did chin ups/pull ups for me to show how strong it would be - Not always neccessary for 2/3/4 guitars at home but it can look nice as required

musicman100

Thanks for your help guys. I will be doing something this week as I really need to get these guitars out of thier cases asap as the are bloody rotting away.

TTony

ICBM said:

if you use really big screws holding the wood to the wall. Mine are attached with 3" No. 12 woodscrews (1/4" diameter) - one of which alone will easily hold my weight. They're far stronger than any screw you can easily fit through a typical hanger, and if you spread the load with several - one per hanger is ideal, you can hide the heads with the hangers themselves so it looks neat - then it's going to be massively strong.

Bear in mind that the force on the screw is almost entirely vertical - ie it's the weight of the guitar pulling the hanger and thus the screw towards the floor.

But to pull a screw out of a wall, you really need horizontal force - and as long as you've used properly sized plugs for the size of hole & screw, you'll not manage to do that easily.  Risk of pull *out* is low.

The risk when using screws to hang guitars up is the shear force - ie will the weight *snap* the screw rather than pull it *out* of the wall.  Although the risk of this happening will decrease as the screws get thicker, not all screws are made equal.  

A cheap no12 might actually be easier to break than an expensive no6.

You should see the amount of stuff (weight) in our kitchen cupboards, and they're held on the walls with a couple of screws.

breakstuff

I've had mine hung on cheapo eBay specials for the last two years with no problems so far.Each held on with three screws each into a solid brick wall,though they are placed above a sofa just in case the worst was to happen.See no need to upgrade to more expensive ones yet (touches wood).

octatonic

TTony said:

ICBM said:

if you use really big screws holding the wood to the wall. Mine are attached with 3" No. 12 woodscrews (1/4" diameter) - one of which alone will easily hold my weight. They're far stronger than any screw you can easily fit through a typical hanger, and if you spread the load with several - one per hanger is ideal, you can hide the heads with the hangers themselves so it looks neat - then it's going to be massively strong.

Bear in mind that the force on the screw is almost entirely vertical - ie it's the weight of the guitar pulling the hanger and thus the screw towards the floor.

But to pull a screw out of a wall, you really need horizontal force - and as long as you've used properly sized plugs for the size of hole & screw, you'll not manage to do that easily.  Risk of pull *out* is low.

The risk when using screws to hang guitars up is the shear force - ie will the weight *snap* the screw rather than pull it *out* of the wall.  Although the risk of this happening will decrease as the screws get thicker, not all screws are made equal.  

A cheap no12 might actually be easier to break than an expensive no6.

You should see the amount of stuff (weight) in our kitchen cupboards, and they're held on the walls with a couple of screws.

Yes, this was what I was unsuccessfully trying to say.

Provided it is installed properly you won't have any problems.

I'm not saying being a bit cautious is a bad thing.

I'd put that in the direction of guitars that are prone to breaking- I never put Gibson's on wall hangers, for instance- but that is because they won't survive being knocked off the hanger, rather than a hanger or wall attachment failure.

Requiring the hanger to hold your body weight is a bit of overkill though.

Even the heaviest of Les Pauls is only going to be 10% of the weight of the lightest of humans.

That means you want a wall hanger that is capable of holding at least 10 times the required weight before you'll use it?

musicman100

I'm not generally a fan of displaying expensive guitars but needs must. Lol

ICBM

octatonic said:

Requiring the hanger to hold your body weight is a bit of overkill though.

Even the heaviest of Les Pauls is only going to be 10% of the weight of the lightest of humans.

That means you want a wall hanger that is capable of holding at least 10 times the required weight before you'll use it?

I completely agree that it's overkill, and not strictly necessary. But it does no harm, and it's absolutely better to be safe than sorry, so it's a simple and useful test. After that you no longer even have to think about it being a possibility.

I agree that the guitar falling off the hanger is a greater risk, too. That doesn't mean that it isn't worth totally eliminating the other one.

musicman100

ICBM said:

octatonic said:

Requiring the hanger to hold your body weight is a bit of overkill though.

Even the heaviest of Les Pauls is only going to be 10% of the weight of the lightest of humans.

That means you want a wall hanger that is capable of holding at least 10 times the required weight before you'll use it?

I completely agree that it's overkill, and not strictly necessary. But it does no harm, and it's absolutely better to be safe than sorry, so it's a simple and useful test. After that you no longer even have to think about it being a possibility.

I agree that the guitar falling off the hanger is a greater risk, too. That doesn't mean that it isn't worth totally eliminating the other one.

I'd rather be safe than sorry. Let's be honest if your hanger thousands of ponds of guitars it wants to be over the top in my opinion.

WezV

I have 5 individual ones in a solid brick wall. 1 is working loose.  These 5 hangers were all used at my old house too.   So out of 10 hangers I have drilled into solid brick, 1 has not worked great.  

It had a particularly heavy guitar on it for a while, but I can't see any other reason for it to fail. I have started putting a lighter guitar on it, and its not got any worse. I will change the screws for the next size up and am sure I will never have a problem with it again.   Even though its gradually going, it won't just suddenly go.

I guess I am happy to keep them individually mounted, because if the worst happens its just one guitar affected.   But the worst won't happen - you would spot the hanger is loose long before it actually gives way

RandallFlagg

I use String Swing hangars in platerboard walls and have my heaviest guitar, my Gibson R8 hanging on one no problem. I use those metal screw in plasterboard plugs and the screws that come with the hangar. Solid as a rock

Sassafras