Vibrato/Whammy troubles...

AlanP

On my strat-parts-caster, I have a Gotoh 6-point vibrato/whammy/trem/whatever...

I've got the unit fully floating, but up until recently I've not been fitting the arm, and only used the trem unit to get nice little 'shimmies' using the heel of my palm on the bridge.

Having listened to Guthrie (and being more than a bit hopeful ;^), I've started fitting the arm and doing a few dives (lovely...)

But all the time, I've had another problem that I've been struggling with.  I'm a bit of a string bender and if I play double-stops, for example playing the E on the 5th fret of the 2nd string, and bending the 3rd string 7th fret up a tone also up to E - as I do it the E on the 2nd string goes flat...

It is obvious what is happening here, but trying to keep the 2nd string in tune with a micro-bend, whilst doing a tone bend on the third is hard work...

I did try blocking the trem at the bridge side and loosening the springs, and of course that worked (and improved the tone too!), but of course the trem itself is now inop for dives (although I can still manage the shimmies) ...

I got myself a Hipshot Tremsetter, which works... *almost*, but not perfectly (and is a bear to set up...)

My next step is to try blocking the trem on the neck side and tightening the springs - that will at least leave me with my dives... (but probably no heel-of-the-hand shimmies).

... but how do others deal with this - or isn't it a problem??? (A Strat-shaped-object without a reasonably functioning whammy doesn't seem right somehow...)

Thanks

Alan

stickyfiddle

The classic trem problem. You can minimise it by fitting all 5 springs, but that obviously changes the feel of the trem quite a lot.  There are various products meant to help (tremolno, tremsetter, supervee mag-lok etc) but nothing definitive that I'm aware of- all of those have some disadvantage, otherwise we'd all be using them!

ICBM

The Trem-Setter can be made to work, but you're right that it's a complete bear to make it so. I got there on my PRS and haven't had to re-adjust it in years, but it's not very obvious how - especially if you follow their instructions! I have it set up for maximum resistance, but only in the upward direction so it holds tune after a string break, although it won't fix your issue with double-stop bends so it may not be quite the right thing for you.

A Tremol-No would give you all the options you want, but not at the same time so you would need to manually set it differently depending on what you're playing at any given time.

A Levinson bridge would probably work too... that's a dual-action bridge which lets you to adjust the force holding it back for down-bends, while still allowing you to pull up, but it also produces a stiff 'step' in the middle so shimmers are out. Getting one without buying the guitar may not be easy either.

But as stickyfiddle says there is no solution which makes everything work perfectly at the same time - it's simply not possible. Either the bridge floats and moves freely, or it doesn't in some way!

ThePrettyDamned

I'd suggest more springs - if you've got 3, try 4, if you've got 4, try 5.  It'll help, but not solve the problem. 

I've looked into the tremsetter/mag lock/ other things (axesrus sell one) but I've yet to hear brilliant reviews that suggest they're as easy to work as the videos suggest...

SimonC

Interesting this.

I'm having a similar quandary with my PRS at the moment and wondering which way to go.

Some good info here and reveiws of the various devices available:

http://joe.emenaker.com/TremStabilizers/

Hello all, by the way - new poster.

stonevibe

With double stops, also bend the unbent string a little. Yes at first is it is a bit of work, but after a while it becomes easy.

All these gadgets are just a compromise.

ThePrettyDamned

Anyone have experience of a tremol-no?  I've just seen a video of it in action, and it does look pretty awesome...

It won't help with floatin doublestops, but for drop tunings or broken strings?

mike_l

@AlanP

Have you tried a bit of "Nutsauce" on the nut (Obviously) and anywhere else the string is in contact (Bridge/stringtrees etc)

As I have my Strat bridge set up to float and even with some quite large (Think David Gilmour-esque) bends and don't lose any tuning stability.

AlanP

The problem is *not* related to returning to tune after use. It is that when you bend a string, you increase the pull on the trem on just that string, and all the others go slacker, and thus flat...

I do attempt to give a little bend to the remaining strings, as per Stonevibe, but it is a bit hit/miss.

I Think I'll try blocking the trem at the back on the bridge side, and tightening the springs. I won't be able to pull up, but it should dive OK, will probably wobble a bit, and might even survive a string break...

Thanks for the views chaps...

mike_l

Ah, I see. I seem to have developed a little technique (All my bridges float) whereby I put a little pressure on the bridge when I'm bending so the bridge pulls the rest slightly sharp. It is only fractional though, and just enough to stop others going flat.

Easier to do than describe.

AlanP

Ah yes. That'll be worth trying.... Thanks.

mike_l

If it helps, my picking hand basically rests on the bridge, and it's a minute twist of the wrist to push the bridge sharp.

I'll see If I can do some photo's this afternoon.