Epiphone Sheraton owners. Now New guitar day.

markj

Quite a few on ebay and quite tempted. Any comments from owners very welcome. I am looking at the moment at a 2006 Korean made Sheraton, these I believe are superior to the later Chinese made Sheratons ?

GuitarZero

I've had both, Korean and Chinese, there are great and poor examples of both though I have found the later Chinese models were more consistent than the earlier ones.

Voxman

• Korean has a 5-piece laminated (length wise) neck, which are a little more 'beefy' than the original Chinese necks, which adopt a solid neck build, with scarf joints for the headstock, and heal. 
• The body shapes are slightly different and the head-stocks on the Chinese versions, are slightly (circa 1/4"-1/2") smaller . 
• Very early Chinese versions were not as nicely made as the Korean versions but the more recent Chinese versions have noticeably improved in quality.  
• The Epiphone Sheraton II Pro (Chinese) has pro-bucker /ups, Graphtech® NuBone XL™ nut, and coil-splitting activated by volume push-pull pots
• I think that the latest Chinese Sheratons may have gone back to the 5 piece laminated neck
• All new Epiphone's are backed by a lifetime limited warranty against defective materials/workmanship
• A slightly annoying feature of all Sheraton II's is that the abalone pearl marker inlays stop at the 15th fret. 

Ultimately, there are good & not so good examples of both Korean & Chinese Epi Sheratons, so I recommend you try both before buying to determine if you have a preference.  

Generally speaking, the more desirable Sheratons are the Korean versions eg made in the famous Samick factory (but there were other respected factories too).  At the moment this probably doesn't equate to any significant used price differentials even for older Sheraton II's (eg 1986-89), but some of these older Korean Epi's are beginning to creep up and command a bit more.   

An interesting variation to look out for is the headstock wording.  At one time, Epiphone wanted to capitalise on the Gibson brand name and the headstocks say "Epiphone by Gibson" with an Epiphone 'E' on the truss-rod cover.

But they then changed it (either late 1988 or early 1989) to just Epiphone, and showed the Gibson name on the truss rod cover (although I think the newer Chinese versions just show the Epiphone 'E'):

 

Some folk are prepared to pay a bit more for the first version, as these are rarer, but it doesn't mean the overall quality of the guitar is any different.

My own Sheraton in natural finish is 1989.  It was made in the Samick factory and has the 5-piece laminated neck, with the 'Epiphone' (2nd one above) headstock and Gibson on the truss rod cover.  I replaced the stock p/ups with Seymour Duncan SH1 '59'er pick-ups. 

If I was buying a Sheraton II today, I think I'd be tempted by the new 'Pro' version - it has a better nut, the pro-bucker p/ups are pretty decent sounding & the coil tapping gives extra tonal versatility.  £59 new but here's a pre-owned one on EBay starting at £399:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2015-Epiphone-Sheraton-II-Pro-VS-Electric-Guitar-/152427712262?hash=item237d664f06:g:aGIAAOSwA3dYmayt

And here's a brand new Ebony one from Richtone Music for £499:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Epiphone-Sheraton-II-Pro-Ebony-/272460143817?hash=item3f6fe3dcc9:g:04oAAOSwxcRW9BMg

If you're looking for an earlier Korean made Sherton with the 'Epiphone by Gibson' headstock, here's a 1987 Korean one going buy it now for £495 (but I'm sure it could be got a bit cheaper):
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RARE-EPIPHONE-BY-GIBSON-SHERATON-II-NATURAL-1987-MADE-IN-KOREA-/222399174902?hash=item33c80618f6:g:53sAAOSwSHZWgA8Z

shaunm

Advice - go buy one, upgrade the pickups and electrics then smile because you now have a brilliant guitar for well under £500. 

markj

Voxman said:

• Korean has a 5-piece laminated (length wise) neck, which are a little more 'beefy' than the original Chinese necks, which adopt a solid neck build, with scarf joints for the headstock, and heal. 
• The body shapes are slightly different and the head-stocks on the Chinese versions, are slightly (circa 1/4"-1/2") smaller . 
• Very early Chinese versions were not as nicely made as the Korean versions but the more recent Chinese versions have noticeably improved in quality.  
• The Epiphone Sheraton II Pro (Chinese) has pro-bucker /ups, Graphtech® NuBone XL™ nut, and coil-splitting activated by volume push-pull pots
• I think that the latest Chinese Sheratons may have gone back to the 5 piece laminated neck
• All new Epiphone's are backed by a lifetime limited warranty against defective materials/workmanship
• A slightly annoying feature of all Sheraton II's is that the abalone pearl marker inlays stop at the 15th fret. 

Ultimately, there are good & not so good examples of both Korean & Chinese Epi Sheratons, so I recommend you try both before buying to determine if you have a preference.  

Generally speaking, the more desirable Sheratons are the Korean versions eg made in the famous Samick factory (but there were other respected factories too).  At the moment this probably doesn't equate to any significant used price differentials even for older Sheraton II's (eg 1986-89), but some of these older Korean Epi's are beginning to creep up and command a bit more.   

An interesting variation to look out for is the headstock wording.  At one time, Epiphone wanted to capitalise on the Gibson brand name and the headstocks say "Epiphone by Gibson" with an Epiphone 'E' on the truss-rod cover.

But they then changed it (either late 1988 or early 1989) to just Epiphone, and showed the Gibson name on the truss rod cover (although I think the newer Chinese versions just show the Epiphone 'E'):

 

Some folk are prepared to pay a bit more for the first version, as these are rarer, but it doesn't mean the overall quality of the guitar is any different.

My own Sheraton in natural finish is 1989.  It was made in the Samick factory and has the 5-piece laminated neck, with the 'Epiphone' (2nd one above) headstock and Gibson on the truss rod cover.  I replaced the stock p/ups with Seymour Duncan SH1 '59'er pick-ups. 

If I was buying a Sheraton II today, I think I'd be tempted by the new 'Pro' version - it has a better nut, the pro-bucker p/ups are pretty decent sounding & the coil tapping gives extra tonal versatility.  £59 new but here's a pre-owned one on EBay starting at £399:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2015-Epiphone-Sheraton-II-Pro-VS-Electric-Guitar-/152427712262?hash=item237d664f06:g:aGIAAOSwA3dYmayt

And here's a brand new Ebony one from Richtone Music for £499:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Epiphone-Sheraton-II-Pro-Ebony-/272460143817?hash=item3f6fe3dcc9:g:04oAAOSwxcRW9BMg

If you're looking for an earlier Korean made Sherton with the 'Epiphone by Gibson' headstock, here's a 1987 Korean one going buy it now for £495 (but I'm sure it could be got a bit cheaper):
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RARE-EPIPHONE-BY-GIBSON-SHERATON-II-NATURAL-1987-MADE-IN-KOREA-/222399174902?hash=item33c80618f6:g:53sAAOSwSHZWgA8Z

Firstly many thanks for all your knowledge on the Sheraton. The one I'm looking at is made in the Saien factory. It's  been sat in its case unplayed for ten years. It is £ 399 or open to offers. What is the going rate for one of these ?

streethawk

Also the older epi by gibson ones tend to have fret nibs, which I think is pretty cool.

Regarding upgraded electrics: you can't fit full size CTS pots through a Sheraton's F holes, but that's not the end of the world.

I think they're great value, snazzy even.

jonnyburgo

Ive had a few, all Korean iirc, all been lovely to play. Feel much better than the Dot.

Voxman

markj said:

Firstly many thanks for all your knowledge on the Sheraton. The one I'm looking at is made in the Saien factory. It's  been sat in its case unplayed for ten years. It is £ 399 or open to offers. What is the going rate for one of these ?

 
No problem @markj .  I think I may have found the Sheraton you're looking at (from diesel guitars in Bath serial number: I 06020114  - £399 or best offer?). Around August 2010 I paid £300 for my immaculate 1989 Samick Sheraton II, natural finish, with case.  Assuming its in good condition I think £399 for a Korean made Sheraton with a case is not a bad price, especially from a guitar shop, but perhaps a little at the top end considering it is a very late Korean made Sheraton II - in fact 2006 was the last year these were made in Korea (Chinese production started in 2008 I believe). I'd suggest perhaps offering anything between £325-£350 to start and going from there.  

streethawk said:

Also the older epi by gibson ones tend to have fret nibs, which I think is pretty cool.

interesting observation - yes, just  like certain Gibsons (eg Les Paul Custom, SG Standard etc) the Korean Sheratons have nibs - I hadn't realised that the Chinese Sheratons don't have these, but this makes perfect sense as it would help to save on manufacturing costs.  

markj

Voxman said:

markj said:

Firstly many thanks for all your knowledge on the Sheraton. The one I'm looking at is made in the Saien factory. It's  been sat in its case unplayed for ten years. It is £ 399 or open to offers. What is the going rate for one of these ?

 
No problem @markj .  I think I may have found the Sheraton you're looking at (from diesel guitars in Bath serial number: I 06020114  - £399 or best offer?). Around August 2010 I paid £300 for my immaculate 1989 Samick Sheraton II, natural finish, with case.  Assuming its in good condition I think £399 for a Korean made Sheraton with a case is not a bad price, especially from a guitar shop, but perhaps a little at the top end considering it is a very late Korean made Sheraton II - in fact 2006 was the last year these were made in Korea (Chinese production started in 2008 I believe). I'd suggest perhaps offering anything between £325-£350 to start and going from there.  

streethawk said:

Also the older epi by gibson ones tend to have fret nibs, which I think is pretty cool.

interesting observation - yes, just  like certain Gibsons (eg Les Paul Custom, SG Standard etc) the Korean Sheratons have nibs - I hadn't realised that the Chinese Sheratons don't have these, but this makes perfect sense as it would help to save on manufacturing costs.  

Yes that's the one. According to the description its in fine condition.

andy1839

I got my Sheraton II Pro in natural last year from Gear4Music, paid £360 brand new and it came with a gig bag and stand. 
Its a great guitar, it's well made, finished well and really solid.  
The new humbuckers it comes with are quite good and the coil split sounds are very nice. 

Quite a chunky neck on it though.  

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g55/andy1839/IMG_3556_zpslbjtox5f.jpg

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g55/andy1839/IMG_3557_zpswqxzysph.jpg

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g55/andy1839/IMG_3558_zpsweqoqzox.jpg

streethawk

I mean, look at that pickguard ^

Great value.

Voxman

@andy1839 yes, as I mentioned earlier I'd sorely be tempted by a Sheraton II Pro - the nut, p/ups and coil tapping are all great features.  Here's my '89 Korean 'Samick' Sherry (p/ups are SD SH1 '59's) which is in immaculate condition and still has all its gold plating:

stickyfiddle

Don't sweat tje MIK/MIC thing - I remain utterly convinced it was put about by butt-hurt MIK owners trying to increase the value of their blessed possessions. All the MIC Casinos and Sheratons I've played have been good guitars.

andy1839

Voxman said:

@andy1839 yes, as I mentioned earlier I'd sorely be tempted by a Sheraton II Pro - the nut, p/ups and coil tapping are all great features.  Here's my '89 Korean 'Samick' Sherry (p/ups are SD SH1 '59's) which is in immaculate condition and still has all its gold plating:

That looks in amazing condition mate.  I did think about trying different pickups and electrics but horror stories about how difficult it is puts me off!

I think they're great guitars. 

Voxman

stickyfiddle said:

Don't sweat tje MIK/MIC thing - I remain utterly convinced it was put about by butt-hurt MIK owners trying to increase the value of their blessed possessions. All the MIC Casinos and Sheratons I've played have been good guitars.

Current production MIC's are very good, & I do like the Pro features -  it's only the earlier MIC that as I mentioned, had some quality issues.  But there are some build differences - the 'nibs' and slightly smaller headstocks has already been mentioned, and I don't think early Chinese versions had the 5-piece laminated neck.  

Purely from a 'collector' perspective the older Korean made Sheratons are likely to be more desirable, and may command a premium and be more saleable in the future.  When CBS took over Fender in '65 I don't think anyone at that time could have predicted just how pre CBS Fender desirability and prices exploded 50 years on!  Not to anything like the same extent of course, but its quite reasonable to see that as time marches on, the Korean/Chinese Sheraton values could differentiate significantly more.  Nothing to do with 'butt-hurt' MIK owners, but just how older instruments tend to be regarded in general. Consider that we're seeing now old and frankly what were regarded as rubbish beginner guitars (eg that used to be sold in Woolworths etc for £20) now being collected and going for £200 or more today!  

Bridgehouse

Voxman said:

 Consider that we're seeing now old and frankly what were regarded as rubbish beginner guitars (eg that used to be sold in Woolworths etc for £20) now being collected and going for £200 or more today!  

Sorry, you can't use that argument, as that market is being falsely propped up by @HarrySeven ;

thermionic

Voxman said:

@andy1839 yes, as I mentioned earlier I'd sorely be tempted by a Sheraton II Pro - the nut, p/ups and coil tapping are all great features.  Here's my '89 Korean 'Samick' Sherry (p/ups are SD SH1 '59's) which is in immaculate condition and still has all its gold plating:

I had a similar one from around that time, bought new in '89 or maybe 1990. It had the same poor photocopy tort pickguard with the stencilled/printed E. Notice how svelte the f-holes are on this one, mine was the same. Later ones are wider/cruder and not nearly so elegant looking in comparison.

I had a Dot apparently from the same Samick factory but 10 years later - a much lighter and livelier guitar but the build quality wasn't up to the earlier Sheraton - mainly the frets.

Voxman

Bridgehouse said:

Voxman said:

 Consider that we're seeing now old and frankly what were regarded as rubbish beginner guitars (eg that used to be sold in Woolworths etc for £20) now being collected and going for £200 or more today!  

Sorry, you can't use that argument, as that market is being falsely propped up by @HarrySeven ;;

Good point - how could I have forgotten that!? 

Voxman

thermionic said:

Voxman said:

@andy1839 yes, as I mentioned earlier I'd sorely be tempted by a Sheraton II Pro - the nut, p/ups and coil tapping are all great features.  Here's my '89 Korean 'Samick' Sherry (p/ups are SD SH1 '59's) which is in immaculate condition and still has all its gold plating:

I had a similar one from around that time, bought new in '89 or maybe 1990. It had the same poor photocopy tort pickguard with the stencilled/printed E. Notice how svelte the f-holes are on this one, mine was the same. Later ones are wider/cruder and not nearly so elegant looking in comparison.

I had a Dot apparently from the same Samick factory but 10 years later - a much lighter and livelier guitar but the build quality wasn't up to the earlier Sheraton - mainly the frets.

You know, until you pointed the 'f' holes out, I simply hadn't noticed that the later ones are wider - which would actually make it easier to access the wiring loom!  

andy1839 said:

That looks in amazing condition mate.  I did think about trying different pickups and electrics but horror stories about how difficult it is puts me off!

I think they're great guitars. 

Thanks Andy - yeah, re the Seymour Duncan SH1 '59 p/ups, Richard from Electrohill (very good guy) did an excellent job of putting these in for me including soldering the replacement p/up covers in place.  

markj

Voxman said:

markj said:

Firstly many thanks for all your knowledge on the Sheraton. The one I'm looking at is made in the Saien factory. It's  been sat in its case unplayed for ten years. It is £ 399 or open to offers. What is the going rate for one of these ?

 
No problem @markj .  I think I may have found the Sheraton you're looking at (from diesel guitars in Bath serial number: I 06020114  - £399 or best offer?). Around August 2010 I paid £300 for my immaculate 1989 Samick Sheraton II, natural finish, with case.  Assuming its in good condition I think £399 for a Korean made Sheraton with a case is not a bad price, especially from a guitar shop, but perhaps a little at the top end considering it is a very late Korean made Sheraton II - in fact 2006 was the last year these were made in Korea (Chinese production started in 2008 I believe). I'd suggest perhaps offering anything between £325-£350 to start and going from there.  

streethawk said:

Also the older epi by gibson ones tend to have fret nibs, which I think is pretty cool.

interesting observation - yes, just  like certain Gibsons (eg Les Paul Custom, SG Standard etc) the Korean Sheratons have nibs - I hadn't realised that the Chinese Sheratons don't have these, but this makes perfect sense as it would help to save on manufacturing costs.  

Yes that's the one. According to the description its in fine condition. offered the seller £340 but he wanted £375.

Voxman

@markj - was £375 more than you were prepared to go?