On the off chance; Does anyone else gas for a Scumback speaker?

Cirrus

I kinda fancy a scumnico 65watt for my ac30, but shipping for a single speaker makes it prohibitively expensive. So I was just curious if anyone else was in a similar boat such that we could join forces and split shipping costs.

i know it's a long shot, and I'm not even 100% on it myself yet! 

breadfan

Jim has a European dealer:

http://www.proguitar.de/ProGuitar.de/S75.html

I've not tried the Scumnico, but I have two M75s & two H75s in a 4x12 & they sound immense.

Cirrus

@breadfan  thanks for that! I've fired them an email.

Bygone_Tones

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Cirrus

@Bygone_Tones  I've tried and failed to derive meaning from your dots. 

Bygone_Tones

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RiftAmps

Bygone_Tones said:

Well, I wrote a big post about my opinion of Jim but decided to delete it. Lets just say I'm not a fan and would not recommend buying his speakers. My opinion.

From a Mnfrs point of view, I've not had the best experience either. I did like the Scumnico though, very impressed.

Cirrus

Well, I am kind of surprised he didn't point me in the direction of the German dealer when we talked about shipping costs... if you've got an opinion, I'm happy to hear it as long as you think it's justified!

breadfan

Cirrus said:

@breadfan  thanks for that! I've fired them an email.

No worries! Let me know how you get on with them! I actually wouldn't mind trying a Scumnico myself at some stage.. 

I've only dealt with Jim as a customer & I couldn't say a bad word. I bought four speakers from him about eight years ago - we spoke on the phone & exchanged a few emails & he was a gent each time.

A couple of years later, I sought his advice on an old Marshall cab I was interested in buying here & he was very accommodating with his time. 

& as I posted earlier, the speakers I bought are excellent & I've compared them to quite a few vintage ones, too.

breadfan

Cirrus said:

Well, I am kind of surprised he didn't point me in the direction of the German dealer when we talked about shipping costs... if you've got an opinion, I'm happy to hear it as long as you think it's justified!

I'm surprised he didn't mention it, too, but I wouldn't hesitate to ask him why.

Bygone_Tones

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Cirrus

Thanks for your thoughts, much appreciated. I mean, for what it's worth he was nice in his emails.

You might appreciate this @Bygone_Tones  - got a T1234 G12H30 75hz from 1976 a couple of weeks ago, enjoying it so far - nice balance of frequencies, some woodiness from cone breakup, somehow clear but not harsh up top.

Looking for a single alnico speaker for an AC30 is a bit of a minefield. Two broken in blues pretty much get you there - glassy, rich cleans and gradually moving through into compressed, fat midrange roar that isn't at all harsh. And because it's not harsh, you can open up the top end on the amp a bit to get clarity.

But, Blues are 15 watts. Golds have bigger low end that in my experience can get mushy if you let it, and, to my ears anyway, totally different mids/ high - they get their chime by being bright around 5K, whereas blues are lower down, like 2.5k, so golds can be fizzy and harsh with gain, unless you roll the tone cut up on the amp and then end up with a more mellow, choked sound.

The 90 watt Cream? I have no idea what it's like, just not enough reviews, but my suspicion is it'd be too stiff in an ac30 alone.

Then the alternatives - Red Fang... had one briefly, thought it was quite a lot flatter sounding than the blue at volume, Weber Blue Dog... much quieter speaker (surprised if the one I had was more than 95dB), much softer, easy to flub out, Fane Alnicos which sound like they'd be too mellow, Tayden, had a couple of Ace25s at one point but they seem to be out of business... then the Scumnico which on paper seems right - 98dB sensitivity, big low mids, based on old Celestion blue/silvers, treble sounds about right, and the clips sound good. But, way more expensive than all the rest in the UK.

breadfan

@Bygone_Tones It's interesting that you mention Weber - when I ordered my speakers, Jim was having a lot of quality control issues with them (they were manufacturing his speakers at the time). He was in the process of bringing manufacturing back in-house, & so delayed my order, so they would be built by his team, as he could no longer stand behind the ones Weber were building. Is it possible both speakers you tried were Weber-built?

I've tried quite a few pre-Rola speakers myself - not as many as you, though, I'm sure  - & I found there were variances in all of them - whether that was down to wear & tear in some of them, I couldn't say. The Scumbacks sounded excellent in comparison - very much from the same family, but without the age-related issues & with the bonus of higher wattage ratings. 

The marketing claims are a bit over the top, but you could say the same for most manufacturers.

Bygone_Tones

breadfan said:

@Bygone_Tones It's interesting that you mention Weber - when I ordered my speakers, Jim was having a lot of quality control issues with them (they were manufacturing his speakers at the time). He was in the process of bringing manufacturing back in-house, & so delayed my order, so they would be built by his team, as he could no longer stand behind the ones Weber were building. Is it possible both speakers you tried were Weber-built?

I've tried quite a few pre-Rola speakers myself - not as many as you, though, I'm sure  - & I found there were variances in all of them - whether that was down to wear & tear in some of them, I couldn't say. The Scumbacks sounded excellent in comparison - very much from the same family, but without the age-related issues & with the bonus of higher wattage ratings. 

The marketing claims are a bit over the top, but you could say the same for most manufacturers.

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Cirrus said:

Thanks for your thoughts, much appreciated. I mean, for what it's worth he was nice in his emails.

You might appreciate this @Bygone_Tones  - got a T1234 G12H30 75hz from 1976 a couple of weeks ago, enjoying it so far - nice balance of frequencies, some woodiness from cone breakup, somehow clear but not harsh up top.

Looking for a single alnico speaker for an AC30 is a bit of a minefield. Two broken in blues pretty much get you there - glassy, rich cleans and gradually moving through into compressed, fat midrange roar that isn't at all harsh. And because it's not harsh, you can open up the top end on the amp a bit to get clarity.

But, Blues are 15 watts. Golds have bigger low end that in my experience can get mushy if you let it, and, to my ears anyway, totally different mids/ high - they get their chime by being bright around 5K, whereas blues are lower down, like 2.5k, so golds can be fizzy and harsh with gain, unless you roll the tone cut up on the amp and then end up with a more mellow, choked sound.

The 90 watt Cream? I have no idea what it's like, just not enough reviews, but my suspicion is it'd be too stiff in an ac30 alone.

Then the alternatives - Red Fang... had one briefly, thought it was quite a lot flatter sounding than the blue at volume, Weber Blue Dog... much quieter speaker (surprised if the one I had was more than 95dB), much softer, easy to flub out, Fane Alnicos which sound like they'd be too mellow, Tayden, had a couple of Ace25s at one point but they seem to be out of business... then the Scumnico which on paper seems right - 98dB sensitivity, big low mids, based on old Celestion blue/silvers, treble sounds about right, and the clips sound good. But, way more expensive than all the rest in the UK.

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Roland

Cirrus said:

Does anyone else gas for a Scumback speaker?

No. I read a review by someone who did, and then found it lacking top end. As my hearing ages I need more top end in my sound.

dcg

I had a Scumnico in my Abbott 5E3 Deluxe clone; absolutely the best speaker I've used (although the Celestion Cream alnico (for different reasons) is also majestic.  The Scumnico (to my ears) covered every base

Cirrus

@dcg  the Cream alnico interests me on paper - if it really does have the Blue's midrange and treble with thicker bass that's more like a Gold, it'd be the best speaker on earth. But it just sounds too good to be true. Does it really give up the goods at low wattage? I'm just suspicious of celestion's market spiel since they claimed the gold was just like a broken in blue out the box when the reality is there's no speaker on earth that is harder to break in or harsher sounding new. 

What's the cream actually like to use?

dcg

To me, this  was a lovely speaker.  I used it in a Zilla Dinky with a Mesa V:25.; loved the cab - the amp presented the usual Mesa issue with sounding great, but being too complex to use live.  The Cream works well at all volumes to my ears, and even with low wattage amps.  My silverface Princeton Reverb sounded great through the Cream - so there's two very different amps both enjoying the Cream.  Appreciating the many degrees of subjectivity with tone there are, I do really rate the Cream - and much prefer it to a Blue.  Unfortunately, I've never had a Gold.

Cirrus

OK, I've gone for a Celestion Cream. Excited to try it out, I've not actually seen anyone talk about using one in an AC30, but enough people have said it sounds great even in lower wattage amps that my main concern seems to have been answered. I guess I'll find out over the weekend...


Plus, frankly, it's £70 cheaper than the scumback would be, even if I ordered from the place in germany. And the broad description of both (like a blue but with a bit more low end, slightly smoother and less speaker breakup/ compression) leads me to believe they're in a similar ballpark.

Cirrus

Proof of the pudding will be hearing it in a drum + bass situation, but I'm pretty impressed with the Cream. Really does have the vibe of the blue with a bit more low end and low mids, which is awesome.

dcg

The issue of cost with the Scumnico can't be ignored.  I tried ordering direct, but was quoted $100 + for shipping; insane, and uncompetitive.  So you totally nailed it with the Cream.  I sourced my Scumnico s/h from Ireland, so didn't face quite the same economic challenges that loom when buying new...