Bent steel Strat saddles are rubbish

richardhomer

I can accept that you’re happy with the set up ‘as is’ - but can’t figure out why you’d use that as a ‘reason’ not to shim the neck.

Replacing the saddles WILL require you to set up the string height and intonation from scratch....

mbe

If I have Strat strings close to the body I get rat-a-tat-tat from the plectrum hitting the scratchplate.

impmann

Adding a small shim will make a big difference at the bridge due to angles involved.
Add the shim, raise the saddles and problem solved.

im not going get drawn on what sounds best - but if you like the graphtec saddles that’s fine, but a well set up Strat bridge with the original bent saddles is fine to play with palm muting.
Anything other than the original saddles feel and look odd to me.

TheBigDipper

In some ways, this is a curious thread....  I'd like to thank the people who have expanded my understanding of the different ways a bolt-on neck with adjustable saddles can be made to work.

thegummy

This thread has made me realise that when I Google for opinions on products before buying them, that some negative comments may be completely unjustified

ICBM

timmysoft said:

Horrific.

Actually I have a slight apology to make - I couldn't get the pic to load earlier for some reason, so I was missing a critical bit of information .

Now I can...

That bridge doesn't have the proper height screws - the ones in the E saddles should be shorter. It also has metric threads and a vertical arm socket, so it's not a USA Strat bridge - what is the guitar? (Other than a Strat of some sort .)

Looking at the heights the saddles are set at, they don't follow the fingerboard radius either, they look like they're all at more or less the same height. The intonation is all over the place too .

timmysoft

ICBM said:

timmysoft said:

Horrific.

Actually I have a slight apology to make - I couldn't get the pic to load earlier for some reason, so I was missing a critical bit of information .

Now I can...

That bridge doesn't have the proper height screws - the ones in the E saddles should be shorter. It also has metric threads and a vertical arm socket, so it's not a USA Strat bridge - what is the guitar? (Other than a Strat of some sort .)

Looking at the heights the saddles are set at, they don't follow the fingerboard radius either, they look like they're all at more or less the same height. The intonation is all over the place too .

It’s a MIM Fender , the saddles do follow the fingerboard radius, the photo does make them look slightly flatter than it actually is though! The picture was taken prior to setting the intonation. It would have to be a shim the size of Hull to get the screws to a comfortable level, then you’d have at least 4 miles between the strings and plate, 

p90fool

timmysoft said:

ICBM said:

timmysoft said:

 It would have to be a shim the size of Hull to get the screws to a comfortable level, then you’d have at least 4 miles between the strings and plate, 

You really wouldn't, it would just be normal Strat height. 

I've never seen a Strat set up so that the saddles actually slope downwards in relation to the bridge plate towards the height screws before, it really is just set up very badly. 

ICBM

timmysoft said:

It’s a MIM Fender , the saddles do follow the fingerboard radius, the photo does make them look slightly flatter than it actually is though! The picture was taken prior to setting the intonation. It would have to be a shim the size of Hull to get the screws to a comfortable level, then you’d have at least 4 miles between the strings and plate, 

Not so much if the E screws were the right length - then you'd only need to raise them about 1-1.5mm, not 2-3. Usually the Es, G and D are set with the screw tops exactly flush with the saddles, and the A and B just slightly sticking up, but not enough to snag your hand - that gives the proper radius.

Really, all Strats are meant to be like that and most of them are, without the strings being miles from the body! They're normally so consistent that I can set them up like that without even putting the strings on and only have to make very minor adjustments or occasionally put a thin shim in - business-card thickness.

timmysoft

ICBM said:

timmysoft said:

It’s a MIM Fender , the saddles do follow the fingerboard radius, the photo does make them look slightly flatter than it actually is though! The picture was taken prior to setting the intonation. It would have to be a shim the size of Hull to get the screws to a comfortable level, then you’d have at least 4 miles between the strings and plate, 

Not so much if the E screws were the right length - then you'd only need to raise them about 1-1.5mm, not 2-3. Usually the Es, G and D are set with the screw tops exactly flush with the saddles, and the A and B just slightly sticking up, but not enough to snag your hand - that gives the proper radius.

Really, all Strats are meant to be like that and most of them are, without the strings being miles from the body! They're normally so consistent that I can set them up like that without even putting the strings on and only have to make very minor adjustments or occasionally put a thin shim in - business-card thickness.

I could probably get away with shorter screws, these are M3x8, 6mm one would leave an easy 1 turn of thread on the centre strings and I could shave off about 1.5m for the outside strings.

regardless of what anyone says, it’s how I want my Strat to be, I don’t like the action high on the body, I find it uncomfortable and even a couple of mm more, I notice! 

thegummy

timmysoft said:

ICBM said:

timmysoft said:

It’s a MIM Fender , the saddles do follow the fingerboard radius, the photo does make them look slightly flatter than it actually is though! The picture was taken prior to setting the intonation. It would have to be a shim the size of Hull to get the screws to a comfortable level, then you’d have at least 4 miles between the strings and plate, 

Not so much if the E screws were the right length - then you'd only need to raise them about 1-1.5mm, not 2-3. Usually the Es, G and D are set with the screw tops exactly flush with the saddles, and the A and B just slightly sticking up, but not enough to snag your hand - that gives the proper radius.

Really, all Strats are meant to be like that and most of them are, without the strings being miles from the body! They're normally so consistent that I can set them up like that without even putting the strings on and only have to make very minor adjustments or occasionally put a thin shim in - business-card thickness.

I could probably get away with shorter screws, these are M3x8, 6mm one would leave an easy 1 turn of thread on the centre strings and I could shave off about 1.5m for the outside strings.

regardless of what anyone says, it’s how I want my Strat to be, I don’t like the action high on the body, I find it uncomfortable and even a couple of mm more, I notice! 

How would the action be any higher if you raised both the neck and the saddles the same amount?

Strangefan

timmysoft said:

Horrific.Yup that paint job is  only joking that's really cool! 

timmysoft

thegummy said:

timmysoft said:

ICBM said:

timmysoft said:

It’s a MIM Fender , the saddles do follow the fingerboard radius, the photo does make them look slightly flatter than it actually is though! The picture was taken prior to setting the intonation. It would have to be a shim the size of Hull to get the screws to a comfortable level, then you’d have at least 4 miles between the strings and plate, 

Not so much if the E screws were the right length - then you'd only need to raise them about 1-1.5mm, not 2-3. Usually the Es, G and D are set with the screw tops exactly flush with the saddles, and the A and B just slightly sticking up, but not enough to snag your hand - that gives the proper radius.

Really, all Strats are meant to be like that and most of them are, without the strings being miles from the body! They're normally so consistent that I can set them up like that without even putting the strings on and only have to make very minor adjustments or occasionally put a thin shim in - business-card thickness.

I could probably get away with shorter screws, these are M3x8, 6mm one would leave an easy 1 turn of thread on the centre strings and I could shave off about 1.5m for the outside strings.

regardless of what anyone says, it’s how I want my Strat to be, I don’t like the action high on the body, I find it uncomfortable and even a couple of mm more, I notice! 

How would the action be any higher if you raised both the neck and the saddles the same amount?

The action off of the body, not the fretboard.  

Strangefan said:

timmysoft said:

Horrific.Yup that paint job is

The reason I bought it! My PRS is also a hideous colour!

dbphoto

I have never once considered the string height from the body on an electric guitar as being relevant or important when everything that matters is adjustable!?

(Less than £6 on eBay for a set of low and medium saddle screws, some card for a shim and no more than a half hour of time would be the only option I would consider to fix that guitar)

Philly_Q

Have a look at Highwood saddles, which came in for a bit of stick last week.

http://www.thefretboard.co.uk/discussion/118256/

thegummy

dbphoto said:

I have never once considered the string height from the body on an electric guitar as being relevant or important when everything that matters is adjustable!?

Exactly - the pickups can be adjusted to be as close to the strings as one likes; I really don't see any reason to desire such a precise distance from body to strings but each to their own I suppose.

IMO it's a bit of a jump to say Strat saddles are rubbish when it's just that they don't facilitate a very peculiar and specific desire on one particular guitar.

timmysoft

thegummy said:

dbphoto said:

I have never once considered the string height from the body on an electric guitar as being relevant or important when everything that matters is adjustable!?

Exactly - the pickups can be adjusted to be as close to the strings as one likes; I really don't see any reason to desire such a precise distance from body to strings but each to their own I suppose.

IMO it's a bit of a jump to say Strat saddles are rubbish when it's just that they don't facilitate a very peculiar and specific desire on one particular guitar.

It’s down to how your hand and wrist lay on the guitar, with fast palm muting and low tunings, for me it’s what works best. I like it so the pickups are only just above the plate.

After a few minutes on my bench grinder, I’ve got the screws to a suitable length and made the guitar much more comfortable. It all intonates and plays as it should with no shim. I still think I’ll go for some Graphtechs because I like the sound, but I’ll continue with the bent ones for a bit. I think they look better on a classic Strat but I do think the design is dated and inferior to modern variants 

Modulus_Amps

I would have left it as is, during a gig your hand will be bleeding all over the place.. nothing more metal than blood going everywhere

dbphoto

timmysoft said:

 It's down to how your hand and wrist lay on the guitar, with fast palm muting and low tunings, for me it’s what works best. 

My hand rests on the bridge, not on the body, and I would imagine it is the same for the majority, but if it works for you then carry on chap.

timmysoft

Modulus_Amps said:

I would have left it as is, during a gig your hand will be bleeding all over the place.. nothing more metal than blood going everywhere

So true!