This thing with Gibson and the guy from Mastodon...

StuartMac290

Just read an article on it, and it all seems a bit silly. This bit in particular stood out:

"“Kids would get my guitar in the mail and ask me how to tune it because it wasn’t tuned and then I would tell them how to tune it and they would say it still doesn’t sound right and it’s because they’re not putting my gauge strings on there.

“They weren’t even tuning the guitars to my settings or specifications – just little things like that. Things that make the guitar a Bill Kelliher model, like put it in my tuning so that when it shows up, it’s different"

Ummmm...whit?!

guitarfishbay

They don’t play in standard tuning IIRC

StuartMac290

No, apparently they play a whole step down. My point was he's seemingly disgruntled that guitars aren't shipped that way by Gibson, who loosen off the strings for shipping anyway. 

The whole thing comes across as really petulant. 

WezV

Interesting point of view.  

Obviously the idea it should arrive in tune is just silly, but if the artist uses an unusual gauge should they at least ship it with some of those strings?  What should they slot the nut for?  How many are buying for the artist connection?

StuartMac290

As soon as the guitar was unboxed in the shop it would have been turned up to standard pitch anyway. 

As far as I remember the first Johnny Marr Jags came with a spare set of roundwound 11s in the case, although I don't think he actually uses them. 

blueskunk

Yep my marr jag had the rounds in the case. 

thermionic

I thought he used Ernie Ball Power Slinkys, i.e. roundwound 11s?

Moltisanti

you have to bear in mind that Mastodon plays in D standard, with a heavy low string to go as low as A. So if you are a kid and it arrives with 9s on it, you aren't going to be playing any Mastodon...
BK always comes across as very genuine, he was stoked to be a Gibson artist and now they have treated both him and bandmate Brent Hinds badly.
It speaks a lot for ESP who always get great feedback from artists for their care and attention to detail

WezV

Moltisanti said:

you have to bear in mind that Mastodon plays in D standard, with a heavy low string to go as low as A. So if you are a kid and it arrives with 9s on it, you aren't going to be playing any Mastodon...
BK always comes across as very genuine, he was stoked to be a Gibson artist and now they have treated both him and bandmate Brent Hinds badly.
It speaks a lot for ESP who always get great feedback from artists for their care and attention to detail

Gibson understand that a large part of the sig market are not buying to just replicate the artist.  They would sell less if they shipped set up for D standard with a drop A.

It’s hard to pin down what they should do for the best here.

lustycourtier

WezV said:

Interesting point of view.  

Obviously the idea it should arrive in tune is just silly, but if the artist uses an unusual gauge should they at least ship it with some of those strings?  What should they slot the nut for?  How many are buying for the artist connection?

The James bay epiphone century ships with 10 when he tunes a step down with a wound g 

Philly_Q

WezV said:

Moltisanti said:

you have to bear in mind that Mastodon plays in D standard, with a heavy low string to go as low as A. So if you are a kid and it arrives with 9s on it, you aren't going to be playing any Mastodon...
BK always comes across as very genuine, he was stoked to be a Gibson artist and now they have treated both him and bandmate Brent Hinds badly.
It speaks a lot for ESP who always get great feedback from artists for their care and attention to detail

Gibson understand that a large part of the sig market are not buying to just replicate the artist.  They would sell less if they shipped set up for D standard with a drop A.

It’s hard to pin down what they should do for the best here.

Agreed.  We're not talking about something that's cheap enough to buy as a novelty just because you're a fan of the band, so most purchasers - even if they are fans - are probably going to set the guitar up to their own preferences.  It's probably best to go with something pretty "standard" as a starting point.

Skipped

I like this idea.
I think every Gibson "Les Paul" model should ship with #040 Flatwounds with black silk wraps on the ball ends.
(.013, .017, .025, .035, .045, .058).

CarpeDiem

My understanding is that that there were other issues, notably; guitar being chambered which Bill Kelliher didn't want, his feeling that he wasn't being listened to, turnover of Gibson staff. I think Brent Hinds, the other guitarist in Mastodon, had communication issues with Gibson Custom Shop. It sounds like a bigger issue in terms of artist relationships that has caused their move to ESP.

Legionreturns

Notably, none of these were issues he raised until after he'd been signed by ESP. I agree with the petulant child assessment

Balrog68

If these kids are such big fans of his and have invested so much cash...why do they need help tuning a guitar..…or am i missing something?

UnclePsychosis

There was far more to it than "they didn't tune it right".

If you actually read what he said - the first complaint is that they made one of his sigs chambered when he didn't want it to be. Which seems like a fairly sensible thing to be annoyed about.

The tuning thing falls out of something else he said, which is that Gibson didn't give a shit about how he tuned his guitar or what strings he put on it. Which again, seems like a sensible complaint - how can you customise a guitar for someone if you don't care how they actually use the damn thing?

timmysoft

ESP just make better guitars than Gibson, that’s how it is now.

I would always go for an ESP if I was spending custom shop money.

olafgarten

timmysoft said:

ESP just make better guitars than Gibson, that’s how it is now.

I would always go for an ESP if I was spending custom shop money.

The USA Esp Eclipses do cost a bit more than a Gibson or a PRS and are difficult to get in the UK. 

Corvus

It'd more whiney if he said all this while still signed to Gibson. Saying it after a move is the better way round. Either way the strings thing is a small bit taken out of the context of the whole interview.

Bucket

Brent Hinds, the other guitarist in Mastodon, also had problems with Gibson IIRC.

stonevibe

It's not exactly the first time Gibson has fucked up, so was no surprise he was pretty vocal about it. Just look at all vast majority of modern rock/metal /progressive players, they aren't playing Gibson as the company isn't up to standard for many of them to rely on.

ESP and LTD are far higher quality and listen to player needs, so it makes sense to leave the tradition of 'Made In USA' BS behind and actually go with a more forward thinking and progressive guitar builder.

The stuff I have heard and been told about Gibson this year has put me off the brand completely, they are clutching at straws and I think 2018 has a few more shocks in store with them.