WTF is going on in India ?

Emp_Fab

Multiple rapes and murder of women....  two have been raped and set alight in the past 48h alone!!

They also practice the idiotic hierarchical apartheid of “castes” and persecute the so-called ‘lowest’ caste with brutal impunity.

I’d always considered India to be an industrious, spiritual and largely peaceful place, not a land of crazed sexual psychopaths.

Fretwired

Go read a history on India - it's been estimated that as many as 100 million were killed over 500 years in massacres.  Over 500,000 Hindus were murdered in a campaign in the 1300s. It has always been a barbaric place.

Phil_aka_Pip

Fretwired said:

It has always been a barbaric place.

Sadly, I think you are right. The practice of suttee was considered by westerners to be offensive, but the leaving of old people on the municipal rubbish tip because the family no longer wants to care for them is IMO equally offensive. I don't think that makes "us" any better than "them" though, there must be things that "we" have done or are doing now that are no better.

stickyfiddle

India is an extremely big place, with a huge amount of variety across its population and geography. Unfortunately, while it can be both extremely beautiful and peaceful, there is huge inequality and a major lack of education among a big proportion of the population, which leads to the violence seen of late.

But the only new thing about it is the fact that it's getting reported by the western media.

Winny_Pooh

Fretwired said:

Go read a history on India - it's been estimated that as many as 100 million were killed over 500 years in massacres.  Over 500,000 Hindus were murdered in a campaign in the 1300s. It has always been a barbaric place.

You are a citizen of the nation that invaded and occupied India by force (amongst other numerous atrocities). To label them as barbaric is extremely hypocritical and you should reflect on your prejudices. 

BigBearKris

It's easy to generalise reading /watching news and it is a massive country... interestingly few friends of mine who backpacked through half of the world and been to India several times report that yes, it has some beautiful and amazing places but it's dirty and it smells all the time. Quite unpopular comment.

MrSwanson

Winny_Pooh said: 

Fretwired said:

Go read a history on India - it's been estimated that as many as 100 million were killed over 500 years in massacres.  Over 500,000 Hindus were murdered in a campaign in the 1300s. It has always been a barbaric place.

You are a citizen of the nation that invaded and occupied India by force (amongst other numerous atrocities). To label them as barbaric is extremely hypocritical and you should reflect on your prejudices. 

Are we not allowed to call Trump an idiot based on the same logic?

richcol

BigBearKris said:

It's easy to generalise reading /watching news and it is a massive country... interestingly few friends of mine who backpacked through half of the world and been to India several times report that yes, it has some beautiful and amazing places but it's dirty and it smells all the time. Quite unpopular comment.

I can see why that's unpopular

cpcompany

My lass is from West Bengal and she has never once taken public transport on her own in India as it’s not safe.  
Safety for women In India is probably way worse then many imagine, myself included. All this peaceful and spirituality image is usually just bollocks that comes from hippy drop out sorts over there. 

Winny_Pooh

MrSwanson said:

Winny_Pooh said: 

Fretwired said:

Go read a history on India - it's been estimated that as many as 100 million were killed over 500 years in massacres.  Over 500,000 Hindus were murdered in a campaign in the 1300s. It has always been a barbaric place.

You are a citizen of the nation that invaded and occupied India by force (amongst other numerous atrocities). To label them as barbaric is extremely hypocritical and you should reflect on your prejudices. 

Are we not allowed to call Trump an idiot based on the same logic?

Strawman. Same logic would be saying "America has always been an idiotic place."

Limehouse_Blues

Winny_Pooh said:

Fretwired said:

Go read a history on India - it's been estimated that as many as 100 million were killed over 500 years in massacres.  Over 500,000 Hindus were murdered in a campaign in the 1300s. It has always been a barbaric place.

You are a citizen of the nation that invaded and occupied India by force (amongst other numerous atrocities). To label them as barbaric is extremely hypocritical and you should reflect on your prejudices. 

Are you suggesting he’s Persian or Afghan? That’s where the Mughal horseman came from in the sixteenth century, beginning hundreds of years of Mughal dominance of the subcontinent and frequent military campaigning.

To imply that Britain ‘invaded’ India is just silly. British power and influence in the subcontinent was no doubt underpinned by its military might (and notwithstanding British military engagements at the fringes - e.g disastrous campaigns on the NW frontier and the fight against Tipu Sultan in the south) but the story of the establishment of British dominion in that part of the world is broadly speaking not one of military conflict or of boots on the ground ‘occupation’. This stands in contrast to the Mughal predecessors of the Brits where invasion and conquest by force of arms was central to their growing power.

Nor did Britain fight to keep India after the war. Partition and the human plight and genocide (hundreds of thousands perished in communal violence) that accompanied it shamed all those involved in partition  (including Britain) but the end of British dominion in India involved much less military effort by the colonial power than say the French in Indochina or Algeria who actively (and unsuccessfully) waged war to keep their colonies.

VimFuego

now now, don't go bringing facts here.

Fretwired

Winny_Pooh said:

Fretwired said:

Go read a history on India - it's been estimated that as many as 100 million were killed over 500 years in massacres.  Over 500,000 Hindus were murdered in a campaign in the 1300s. It has always been a barbaric place.

You are a citizen of the nation that invaded and occupied India by force (amongst other numerous atrocities). To label them as barbaric is extremely hypocritical and you should reflect on your prejudices. 

Bollocks. Go and read the history of India. Ruled by a barbaric group of people. The Muslim rulers in the north would think executing thousands of people on a holy day was a lovely thing to do. Doesn't compare to the British Empire at all. And India was invaded by force either. You can't conqueror a country the size of India by force when the British army was outnumbered by 100,000 to 1. The British backed existing rulers who were left in place to run things. Bar the mutiny it ran pretty well. The peace was kept by an Indian army which fought for Britain in WW1 and WW2.

ICBM

Bear in mind the population of India is well over a billion people - a sixth of the entire world population, and more than the population of all the Western countries put together. So although this sort of thing isn't right or acceptable, the fact that two such cases have happened in India in a short time frame isn't that surprising. There are deviants and psychopaths in the West as well.

Chalky

Fretwired said:

Winny_Pooh said:

Fretwired said:

Go read a history on India - it's been estimated that as many as 100 million were killed over 500 years in massacres.  Over 500,000 Hindus were murdered in a campaign in the 1300s. It has always been a barbaric place.

You are a citizen of the nation that invaded and occupied India by force (amongst other numerous atrocities). To label them as barbaric is extremely hypocritical and you should reflect on your prejudices. 

Bollocks. Go and read the history of India. Ruled by a barbaric group of people. The Muslim rulers in the north would think executing thousands of people on a holy day was a lovely thing to do. Doesn't compare to the British Empire at all. And India was invaded by force either. You can't conqueror a country the size of India by force when the British army was outnumbered by 100,000 to 1. The British backed existing rulers who were left in place to run things. Bar the mutiny it ran pretty well. The peace was kept by an Indian army which fought for Britain in WW1 and WW2.

Now, now @Fretwired, the political correctness of @Winny_Pooh is so sharp you should be careful you don't cut yourself.  He's clearly a chap who doesn't let something as banal as facts detract in the slightest way from his virtue-signalling. In his 'understairs cupboard' of a mind, British=bad, so you might better put your breath to good use elsewhere...

Fretwired

Chalky said:

Fretwired said:

Winny_Pooh said:

Fretwired said:

Go read a history on India - it's been estimated that as many as 100 million were killed over 500 years in massacres.  Over 500,000 Hindus were murdered in a campaign in the 1300s. It has always been a barbaric place.

You are a citizen of the nation that invaded and occupied India by force (amongst other numerous atrocities). To label them as barbaric is extremely hypocritical and you should reflect on your prejudices. 

Bollocks. Go and read the history of India. Ruled by a barbaric group of people. The Muslim rulers in the north would think executing thousands of people on a holy day was a lovely thing to do. Doesn't compare to the British Empire at all. And India was invaded by force either. You can't conqueror a country the size of India by force when the British army was outnumbered by 100,000 to 1. The British backed existing rulers who were left in place to run things. Bar the mutiny it ran pretty well. The peace was kept by an Indian army which fought for Britain in WW1 and WW2.

Now, now @Fretwired, the political correctness of @Winny_Pooh is so sharp you should be careful you don't cut yourself.  He's clearly a chap who doesn't let something as banal as facts detract in the slightest way from his virtue-signalling. In his 'understairs cupboard' of a mind, British=bad, so you might better put your breath to good use elsewhere...

Nah .. I'm a nasty Britisher so I'll tie him to a field gun and blow him to bits. He'll be happy to die in the knowledge I proved him right ...

VimFuego

ICBM said:

Bear in mind the population of India is well over a billion people - a sixth of the entire world population, and more than the population of all the Western countries put together. So although this sort of thing isn't right or acceptable, the fact that two such cases have happened in India in a short time frame isn't that surprising. There are deviants and psychopaths in the West as well.

whilst this is correct, there is an issue with rape culture over there. A year or so ago, a local big wig was arrested and charged with rape (may have been other charges as well, can't recall all the details now) and there were huge, organised and prolonged protests against his arrest. I'm talking 10's of thousands protesting outside the police station. 

Fretwired

VimFuego said:

ICBM said:

Bear in mind the population of India is well over a billion people - a sixth of the entire world population, and more than the population of all the Western countries put together. So although this sort of thing isn't right or acceptable, the fact that two such cases have happened in India in a short time frame isn't that surprising. There are deviants and psychopaths in the West as well.

whilst this is correct, there is an issue with rape culture over there. A year or so ago, a local big wig was arrested and charged with rape (may have been other charges as well, can't recall all the details now) and there were huge, organised and prolonged protests against his arrest. I'm talking 10's of thousands protesting outside the police station. 

Spot on .. apparently there's a rape on average every 20 minutes .. the Indian government banned a film about rape in India which tells you all you need to know ... we're not exactly whiter than white in the UK ..

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/india-is-in-denial-about-its-rape-culture-but-then-so-are-we-10093481.html

Emp_Fab

VimFuego said:

ICBM said:

Bear in mind the population of India is well over a billion people - a sixth of the entire world population, and more than the population of all the Western countries put together. So although this sort of thing isn't right or acceptable, the fact that two such cases have happened in India in a short time frame isn't that surprising. There are deviants and psychopaths in the West as well.

whilst this is correct, there is an issue with rape culture over there. A year or so ago, a local big wig was arrested and charged with rape (may have been other charges as well, can't recall all the details now) and there were huge, organised and prolonged protests against his arrest. I'm talking 10's of thousands protesting outside the police station. 

Tens of thousands of men presumably?

boogieman

stickyfiddle said:

India is an extremely big place, with a huge amount of variety across its population and geography. Unfortunately, while it can be both extremely beautiful and peaceful, there is huge inequality and a major lack of education among a big proportion of the population, which leads to the violence seen of late.

But the only new thing about it is the fact that it's getting reported by the western media.

Yup, it has probably always happened, just that we are hearing more about it with 24/7 global news coverage. 

Bride of Boogie and myself did a short-ish trip there in 2014. Delhi/Jaipur/Agra/Varanasi and up into Nepal. All life is there. Extremes of wealth vs people literally living (and shitting) in the street. Amazing scenery vs disgusting stuff you’d never hope to see again. Friendly people vs nonstop hassle from others. Perfume vs stench. Spiritual peace vs human barbarity. Ultramodern technology vs mediaeval attitudes. It’s a completely schizophrenic country. I’m glad we went but I’m not sure I’d want to go back. 

57Deluxe

...but they are all welcome here as ex British Principality...