Red Dog Music closing their Leeds shop

Whitecat

From an email - Dear friends, It is with regret that today we announce that the Red Dog Music / Production Room store in Leeds will be closing at the end of May. With all the changes in how people like to shop for gear, we’ve decided to move to an online only model in the Leeds area. This has been a heartbreaking decision as we feel the store was one of the best places to get expert advice and try out the latest music production gear. It wasn’t a decision we took lightly.  Our Edinburgh and London stores are going strong and you will still be able to contact and buy from us online or over the phone, and get expert advice from our trained specialists. Note: All customer orders will be fulfilled and deposits honoured.

Between now and the end of May we will be holding a closing down sale, with huge reductions on studio gear, keyboards, PA equipment and more. We’ve got masses of stock to clear, so pop in between now and the end of the month and get yourself a once-in-a-lifetime bargain. — Not sure what the guitar stocking scenario was in Leeds? I know their Edinburgh shop carries a good selection.  Still not great to see anyone shutter/contract...

prlgmnr

They already pretty much did have an "online only model in the Leeds area" as almost without fail any time I saw anything interesting in stock it was in their other stores.

Moe_Zambeek

prlgmnr said:

They already pretty much did have an "online only model in the Leeds area" as almost without fail any time I saw anything interesting in stock it was in their other stores.

I have the same experience with their Edinburgh store; all the good stuff seems to be in London (unsurprisingly).

fandango

Pressed Rat and Warthog closed down their shop, they didn’t want to .....


It’s always sad to hear of another music/guitar shop packing it in. But if the Leeds outlet could somehow keep something personal about their service, even if internet based, there’s no reason why Pressed Rat Red Dog can’t continue to serve us musicians (and wannabees).

Hattigol

Sad but no surprise. I only went in once and like so many guitar shops, it was just full (ish) of the usual predictable stuff at exactly the same prices as all other dealers.

Nobody approached me to see what I was after. And I left. Utterly underwhelmed .

Moominpapa

Not to be a dick but Leeds is a major metropolitan area in Yorkshire, must have one of the highest concentrations of students relative to city size anywhere in England and is home to Leeds College of Music. If you cant  keep a guitar shop going in that market then I'm sorry but you're doing something wrong.

shaunm

Moominpapa said:

Not to be a dick but Leeds is a major metropolitan area in Yorkshire, must have one of the highest concentrations of students relative to city size anywhere in England and is home to Leeds College of Music. If you cant  keep a guitar shop going in that market then I'm sorry but you're doing something wrong.

Other than PMT & Dawsons which music shops have done well in the current climate in Leeds? 

redrighthand

Moominpapa said:

Not to be a dick but Leeds is a major metropolitan area in Yorkshire, must have one of the highest concentrations of students relative to city size anywhere in England and is home to Leeds College of Music. If you cant  keep a guitar shop going in that market then I'm sorry but you're doing something wrong.

Students don’t have much money (in relative terms). The only guitar shops that have survived in Leeds are those with a major internet operation (Dawson’s and PMT, and the latter store has changed hands a few times).  Northern Guitars is now a cafe with a few second hand guitars tucked away upstairs. Location-wise, Dawson’s is at least in the city centre, and PMT is relatively near the student population. Red Dog had neither. I suspect it’s the same story across the country.  You would need to be exceptional to survive in this market.  

It’s a pity - I’ve had good dealings with their Scottish stores and the staff in Leeds were a pleasant lot. But it was a rather dull store in terms of the guitar range as stated above.

I was tempted to pop in yesterday to see the “once-in-a-lifetime bargains” however since they fail to mention guitars in the ad I suspect all their guitar stock is just going to the warehouse / other shops.

mbe

redrighthand said:
Northern Guitars is now a cafe with a few second hand guitars tucked away upstairs. Location-wise, Dawson’s is at least in the city centre, and PMT is relatively near the student population. Red Dog had neither. I suspect it’s the same story across the country.  You would need to be exceptional to survive in this market. 

Northern Guitars opened their ground floor as a bar and live music performance area. The second-hand guitar shop, which has gone from strength to strength since the bar opened, is now relocated upstairs. 

Dave Baguley has not quite made the Yorkshire Rich List this year but his business is now busier and more sustainable than ever.

hassleham

Production room (before it joined forces with red dog) was absolutely outstanding. I bought my band’s PA system from them as well as a synth and some other bits. Richard, the manager, was always really friendly and helpful and the owner seemed like a nice guy when I met him.
I was shocked and disappointed when it turned into red dog, and agree that none of the guitar equipment was particularly interesting. It’s a shame that the merger didn’t work out for them.

Hattigol

My problem is that I went to Chicago Music Exchange last year. It has ruined all other guitar shops for me.
What, a red Gibson 335? Yeah, there are about 30 over there.
Jazzmaster? About 10.
Les Paul? Ooooooh just about 50.

Heaven.

Moominpapa

redrighthand said:

Students don’t have much money (in relative terms). The only guitar shops that have survived in Leeds are those with a major internet operation (Dawson’s and PMT, and the latter store has changed hands a few times).  Northern Guitars is now a cafe with a few second hand guitars tucked away upstairs. Location-wise, Dawson’s is at least in the city centre, and PMT is relatively near the student population. Red Dog had neither. I suspect it’s the same story across the country.  You would need to be exceptional to survive in this market. 

I take your points and agree it is a very tough market generally. However, in Reading - which is smaller than Leeds, and has many fewer students/young people - there is not only Dawsons but also Hickies in the centre of town and Apex Music on the outskirts. Both of those small independent shops seem to be doing OK, and they are relatively close to the major competition of Andertons in Guildford and Guitar Village in Farnham. So I don't think my argument is completely invalid: if Hickies and Apex can make a go of it, the fact that Red Dog couldn't suggests to me that they must have miscalculated on something fundamental.

prowla

Moominpapa said:

redrighthand said:

Students don’t have much money (in relative terms). The only guitar shops that have survived in Leeds are those with a major internet operation (Dawson’s and PMT, and the latter store has changed hands a few times).  Northern Guitars is now a cafe with a few second hand guitars tucked away upstairs. Location-wise, Dawson’s is at least in the city centre, and PMT is relatively near the student population. Red Dog had neither. I suspect it’s the same story across the country.  You would need to be exceptional to survive in this market. 

I take your points and agree it is a very tough market generally. However, in Reading - which is smaller than Leeds, and has many fewer students/young people - there is not only Dawsons but also Hickies in the centre of town and Apex Music on the outskirts. Both of those small independent shops seem to be doing OK, and they are relatively close to the major competition of Andertons in Guildford and Guitar Village in Farnham. So I don't think my argument is completely invalid: if Hickies and Apex can make a go of it, the fact that Red Dog couldn't suggests to me that they must have miscalculated on something fundamental.

Don't forget the Music Man (just past Richer Sounds on the Oxford Road); he's always got things going in and out.

Hickies seems to be down-scaling to me.

Dawsons is a bit sterile for me, but I did have an enjoyable time there when I went in a month or so back (the Gibson '54 Les Paul thread and I bought something too!). The good thing about Dawsons is they've got their own car park, but I clonked the nose of my car as I negotiated the dip between the exit and the road yesterday.

jpfamps

Moominpapa said:

redrighthand said:

Students don’t have much money (in relative terms). The only guitar shops that have survived in Leeds are those with a major internet operation (Dawson’s and PMT, and the latter store has changed hands a few times).  Northern Guitars is now a cafe with a few second hand guitars tucked away upstairs. Location-wise, Dawson’s is at least in the city centre, and PMT is relatively near the student population. Red Dog had neither. I suspect it’s the same story across the country.  You would need to be exceptional to survive in this market. 

I take your points and agree it is a very tough market generally. However, in Reading - which is smaller than Leeds, and has many fewer students/young people - there is not only Dawsons but also Hickies in the centre of town and Apex Music on the outskirts. Both of those small independent shops seem to be doing OK, and they are relatively close to the major competition of Andertons in Guildford and Guitar Village in Farnham. So I don't think my argument is completely invalid: if Hickies and Apex can make a go of it, the fact that Red Dog couldn't suggests to me that they must have miscalculated on something fundamental.

Reading is near enough London for someone to go to find a specific instrument they're looking for.

Looking at their websites, both Apex and Hickies offer other services than just selling instruments.

Overheads are a real problem too; it could be that Red Dog's lease was up for renewal and the landlords wanted a big hike in rent for example.

A lot of the gear Red Dog sell on their website is VERY low margin, eg audio interfaces etc.

DaevidJ

It is a little out of the way compared with the other stores, and if you were in the market for a keyboard etc then Red Dog in Leeds was the place to go (i got my Moog Sub Phatty from there). I saw the guitar part of their business as a sideline sadly when compared with the likes of PMT/ Dawsons... 

Skipped

Hattigol said:

My problem is that I went to Chicago Music Exchange last year. It has ruined all other guitar shops for me.
What, a red Gibson 335? Yeah, there are about 30 over there.
Jazzmaster? About 10.
Les Paul? Ooooooh just about 50.

Heaven.

Does anybody remember the old shop? (Pre 2005)

It was narrow but long.

Looked like nothing on the street......but huge inside.

And also.....has the old shop been boarded up for 13 years? 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/3270+N+Clark+St,+Chicago,+IL+60657,+USA/@41.9416686,-87.6520362,3a,75y,241.62h,88.56t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s7EaDdvXoLcvuvq-vACOwoQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!4m5!3m4!1s0x880fd3aebdbd935d:0x2ba410b5c9a340ec!8m2!3d41.9416461!4d-87.6523245

AlexO

Hattigol said:

My problem is that I went to Chicago Music Exchange last year. It has ruined all other guitar shops for me.
What, a red Gibson 335? Yeah, there are about 30 over there.
Jazzmaster? About 10.
Les Paul? Ooooooh just about 50.

Heaven.

Guitar shops in general in America piss all
over anything we have here.
As someone who owns a retail business it still absolutely blows my mind that guitar stores can't train the staff to even say hello or smile at customers.

Hattigol

AlexO said:

Hattigol said:

My problem is that I went to Chicago Music Exchange last year. It has ruined all other guitar shops for me.
What, a red Gibson 335? Yeah, there are about 30 over there.
Jazzmaster? About 10.
Les Paul? Ooooooh just about 50.

Heaven.

Guitar shops in general in America piss all
over anything we have here.
As someone who owns a retail business it still absolutely blows my mind that guitar stores can't train the staff to even say hello or smile at customers.

I found the following things amazing about CME:

The sheer size of it - I spent two afternoons in there and didn't even make it into the acoustics room;
The BRILLIANCE of the customer service - a guy called Jeff came up to me and started chatting. No pressure whatsoever, just really helpful. He could not have been more happy to help me and spent a huge chunk of time checking I was ok and chatting about whatever I wanted to discuss;
The extent of their stock - I loved the fact that new, used and vintage were all mixed together so it was like dreamland looking through everything as you didn't know what was going to be next. Blew the spots of even big places here like Guitar Guitar where you pretty much know exactly what guitar is going to be next to the one you are looking at;
The little demo rooms in the middle - think there were about 8 of them where you could sit and play to your heart's content through any of the amps and pedals set up in there.

As I said, it has ruined other guitar shops for me. And that's without the general surliness of people who tend to work in these places...

Whitecat

CME is owned by a billionaire... so can do just about anything they like and doesn’t even really need to turn a profit...

Hattigol

Whitecat said:

CME is owned by a billionaire... so can do just about anything they like and doesn’t even really need to turn a profit...

Not sure if it was intentional or not but that came across with just a little bit of resentment?

Whitecat

Hattigol said:

Whitecat said:

CME is owned by a billionaire... so can do just about anything they like and doesn’t even really need to turn a profit...

Not sure if it was intentional or not but that came across with just a little bit of resentment?

None whatsoever.