The Harrisons found guilty of organising the £1 million raid on the Guitar Ranch, Verona in 2006.

Strat54

I bought a very nice Carved Top Custom Shop Strat from them circa 1997, swapped in an '89 PRS. They were good to deal with back then and the shop was an Aladdins Cave. They weren't always rotten but from what I was told they fell into a certain type of lifestyle and habits. Nuff said. 

ICBM

Three-ColourSunburst said:

The other side of the coin is that such people thrive because so many are willing to put their critical faculties on hold because they really want to believe that the particular guitar or amp or whatever in front of them is the real deal. I have certainly seen people rationalising buying from the Harrisons by saying 'Sure, they have offloaded some dodgy stuff in their time,but they are still a great source of authentic vintage gear, and I am sure that the guitar I bought from them is genuine.'

Unfortunately that’s exactly how my friend with the dodgy Strat - and several other guitars he got from them, which I am now going to have to examine in detail - justified it to himself, even after it was well known that they were crooks.

I hope by now that he’s learned never to deal with them again, but he *still* rationalises it to a degree because he thinks the parts value of the lash-up he’s got is enough to cover what it cost him.

I would have to ask where they might have got the parts, too...

heavyrocker said:

Obviously not everything they sold was fake. That’s the crazy thing, they could have had a successful business acting legitimately but they chose to be scumbags instead.

But they’re not normal people - they’re fundamentally dishonest, the type who can’t ever be happy with a straight deal that’s not got some sort of extra angle or pay-off for them.

I just don’t believe they’ve ever sold an old guitar which was not faked, misrepresented or simply overpriced for what it actually was, or a combination of those. Or stolen, as we now know.

grappagreen

I know for a fact that they approached someone I know to to do some 'burst' work.. dodgy as f'ck..

randella

Anyone buying anything with aesthetic appeal is going to be prone to heart-over-head from time to time.  Anyone.

I've probably spent longer in the supermarket choosing a bottle of wine than I spent in my current house looking around.  Thing with houses though is that you decide you like the place then you have lawyers and surveyors and every other gannet around checking the deal for you.

You can do the same with a car - I just did.  My lovely (Candy-apple!) red car stood out on the forecourt because everything else was grey.  A sea of grey.  Again though, I drove the car and it was faultless, and I have over two years of warranty left on it. 

Guitars?  You fall in love with one, play it (not necessarily in that order, although I will admit to having done it both ways round) and then you leave the shop with it.  If it's a reputable dealer and the guitar isn't what it purports to be, then you have no problem.  If the dealer is a crook then you're buggered.

That's how these arseholes survived for as long as they did.  It's easy to sit back behind our keyboards and claim we've never been swayed by the look or provenance of an instrument before even playing it, but I'd like to guess in 99% of cases it's simply not true.

Bygone_Tones

Kitsune said:

musicman100 said:

Kitsune said:

ourmaninthenorth said:

I like to be flea free, ergo I don't lie with dogs.

I've heard much about these acrobatics, but never that they put a gun to ones head to force one to buy their wares. 

This stuff is dead simple lads. 

Totally agree. As much as I want a Hiwatt.

I always thought thought Hiwatt had a great repatriation?

Someone here said a while ago that the Harrisons were still in the background somewhere.

Well, he is defintely hanging around in the background here:

Snags

Modellista said:

normula1 said:

I just thank my lucky stars that I never did have the time / money to visit Music Ground in Leeds back when they regularly advertised in Guitarist.

They seemed like a legit music shop to my innocent eyes, stocking new stuff from the usual brands as well as vintage gear I had no interest in (because money).  I bought a Washburn N2 from the Leeds shop in 1992 - my first proper electric.  That, at least, isn't a fake.  I can remember the sales guy clear as day, proper old rocker with long grey hair and beard.  They had loads of autographs on the walls in chalk pen, one from BB King stands out in the memory.

Or maybe they were fake as well...

Was Music Ground the one on The Headrow?  If so I bought a Laney Linebacker 30R there when I was at the uni, probably 1990.  Carried the bastard thing all the way back to Burley and nearly died.

gubble

Snags said:

Was Music Ground the one on The Headrow?  If so I bought a Laney Linebacker 30R there when I was at the uni, probably 1990.  Carried the bastard thing all the way back to Burley and nearly died.

No that was dawsons i think.....

Msuci Ground used to be on Call Lane - just off from The Corn Exchange

TA22GT

I think the best thing honest folk like us can do is just to keep spreading the word, the threads, and the sightings so that people just become very aware of them. No need to be libellous but just make sure people are very wary of who they are dealing with.  I know a very legitimate amp company that got burned by them but I don't want to drop anyone in to legal proceedings!

I think most ordinary people like myself just thought they had disappeared after that theft fiasco but obviously not. 

They can't stay in business if everyone becomes very wary of buying from them.

ourmaninthenorth

Bygone_Tones said:

Kitsune said:

musicman100 said:

Kitsune said:

ourmaninthenorth said:

I like to be flea free, ergo I don't lie with dogs.

I've heard much about these acrobatics, but never that they put a gun to ones head to force one to buy their wares. 

This stuff is dead simple lads. 

Totally agree. As much as I want a Hiwatt.

I always thought thought Hiwatt had a great repatriation?

Someone here said a while ago that the Harrisons were still in the background somewhere.

Well, he is defintely hanging around in the background here:

A more apposite track, considering the lurker, would be "Walk on By" ....

WezV

NelsonP said:

My uncle is a proefessional cello player. His cello is a 'vintage' instrument - think 1800s rather than 1950s.
These things are like triggers broom - so many bits have been replaced over the years that they have to be re-certified in order to sell them on as a fully 'correct' vintage instrument. This means the quality of the repair, the materials used etc all have to be legit. Without the certification they are only worth a fraction fo the price.

So a possible solution would be to introduce this kind of certification for vintage guitars. It could be overseen by whatever trade association there is for music instrument retailers, with a few of the best respected vintage 'experts' as inspectors. Although I can see how that might also be open to exploitation it would be better than the wild west situation that you have now.

I think its a good shout.   Most vintage guitars are approaching the point where they will need work if they are going to ever be used as players.

I am involved in a few restorations at the moment. The bit I really like  is documenting the history that led the guitar to my door, and all the changes I have made as part of the restoration.   I hope that adds some value to a vintage guitars - there are no surprises left to find!

Kitsune

TA22GT said:

I think the best thing honest folk like us can do is just to keep spreading the word, the threads, and the sightings so that people just become very aware of them. No need to be libellous but just make sure people are very wary of who they are dealing with.  I know a very legitimate amp company that got burned by them but I don't want to drop anyone in to legal proceedings!

I think most ordinary people like myself just thought they had disappeared after that theft fiasco but obviously not. 

They can't stay in business if everyone becomes very wary of buying from them.

At least one other poster and I have had what seems like them bidding on stuff we're selling on ebay - the buggers are everywhere!

Modellista

gubble said:

Snags said:

Was Music Ground the one on The Headrow?  If so I bought a Laney Linebacker 30R there when I was at the uni, probably 1990.  Carried the bastard thing all the way back to Burley and nearly died.

No that was dawsons i think.....

Msuci Ground used to be on Call Lane - just off from The Corn Exchange

That was their later address with a smaller shop, but in my day they had a decently-sized shop a stone's throw from the station.  Looks like it's a Discovery Inn now.  Wonder if they kept the autographs?

Ossyrocks

Eee, I love a good Music Ground thread, there are so many tales.

I heard that Gary Winterflood was owed a not insignificant amount of money in a deal with Justin. After giving him plenty of time and prompts to pay, Gary went up to Doncaster with a London “heavy”. 

Apparently, Justin was still disinclined to pay what he owed, so the heavy picked up the nearest heavy object, a vintage AC30, and launched it directly at Justin’s chest. It hit him square on and pinned him to the ground, at which point the “heavy” took a seat on it. 

I heard Justin had had to write three cheques, as the first two were illegible. 

Twinfan

Wasn't there a issue with Kirk Hammett and Music Ground over a '58 V or Explorer?

Ossyrocks

Twinfan said:

Wasn't there a issue with Kirk Hammett and Music Ground over a '58 V or Explorer?

That’s a very long story........ but yes.

Bygone_Tones

Modellista said:

gubble said:

Snags said:

Was Music Ground the one on The Headrow?  If so I bought a Laney Linebacker 30R there when I was at the uni, probably 1990.  Carried the bastard thing all the way back to Burley and nearly died.

No that was dawsons i think.....

Msuci Ground used to be on Call Lane - just off from The Corn Exchange

That was their later address with a smaller shop, but in my day they had a decently-sized shop a stone's throw from the station.  Looks like it's a Discovery Inn now.  Wonder if they kept the autographs?

This is what their old shop looked like:

Kitsune

I used to go into the one in Denmark Street a lot. Never had any cash so bought sod all.

randella

I went into the Manchester one once.  I was killing time whilst waiting for my wife.  The shop assistant was incredibly pleasant, almost pleading with me to pull whatever I wanted off the wall and play it.  I didn't want to waste his time, so we reached a bit of an impasse.

In the end we spent a very pleasant ten minutes watching the big screen, which was showing the bit in the Band's 'Last Waltz' where Clapton is very obviously shitface-drunk and drops his guitar.

Not sure what this adds to the convo really, but not all their staff were horrible I guess.

heavyrocker

Kitsune said:

I used to go into the one in Denmark Street a lot. Never had any cash so bought sod all.

randella said:

I went into the Manchester one once.  I was killing time whilst waiting for my wife.  The shop assistant was incredibly pleasant, almost pleading with me to pull whatever I wanted off the wall and play it.  I didn't want to waste his time, so we reached a bit of an impasse.

In the end we spent a very pleasant ten minutes watching the big screen, which was showing the bit in the Band's 'Last Waltz' where Clapton is very obviously shitface-drunk and drops his guitar.

Not sure what this adds to the convo really, but not all their staff were horrible I guess.

Wow, some of these tales are outrageous! Keep ‘em coming!

Strat54

The silly thing is despite all this fraudulent behaviour they still ended up owing £1.5M ! A million of that was to the guitar trade.
Wonder if they kept those nice houses. I think Harrison Snr's was for sale here...

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