Cloudy finish on PRS S2

Philly_Q

For some reason I felt inspired this morning to dig out my rarely-dug-out 2013 PRS S2 Mira.

After a couple of minutes thinking gosh, this guitar is rather nicer than I remembered, I noticed what I initially thought was some dust or smeary fingerprints on the back of the neck.  On closer inspection it turned out to be a curved line, a few cm long and a few mm wide, of clouding in the finish. 

It's near the point on the heel of the neck where it's built up with an extra piece of wood (which they do on S2s but not on PRS core models), but not directly over the line of the joint so I don't think that's the cause.  I gave the rest of the guitar a once-over and found two more tiny circular cloudy spots, but they may have always been there without me noticing. 

I'm not particularly bothered about this, it doesn't look or feel like the finish is actually lifting, but I'm curious if anyone else has found the same thing on PRS S2 models?  I think 2013 was the year they introduced them, so perhaps there was an issue with early examples?

(I know I should post a picture, but I'm rubbish with cameras and Imgur etc, and in any case I think it would be hard to capture it well enough.)

Whitecat

Yes. PRS replaced a 2013 S2 Starla under warranty for me because of it - it’s a delamination of the finish that they seemed to have a real problem with at that time on both the Core and S2 lines. It’s quite common. 

Philly_Q

They actually replaced your guitar rather than refinishing it?  But then I suppose that's a lot less hassle for them.

How bad was the clouding/delamination on yours?

Whitecat

Philly_Q said:

They actually replaced your guitar rather than refinishing it?  But then I suppose that's a lot less hassle for them.

How bad was the clouding/delamination on yours?

Yep, outright replacement, via the dealer I bought it from (Guitar Village in Farnham). There were 3 or 4 spots on the body and neck between 2 and 3mm each or so but at least one of them was growing. 

Philly_Q

I don't know how long the warranty lasts, but presumably it's long expired, and in any case they don't make the Mira any more.

Oh well, there goes any thought of ever selling it! 

Whitecat

It’s a lifetime (of original purchaser) warranty and it’s absolutely a “known issue” so I would talk to your dealer and if you get no love from them contact PRS Europe. Because they don’t make it any more you are probably possibly looking at a refin but I’d do it if I were you and I could live without the guitar for a while. 

Philly_Q

Thanks for the help and advice!  I am the original purchaser and I guess therefore it's under warranty (although I didn't send off the card).

I think - I know - I'd feel more than a little awkward raising the issue after seven years, especially as it's "only" an S2.  But I did find this YouTube clip, which is very impressive:

Philly_Q

OK, that's weird - in the post above I posted a YouTube link about a bloke who'd had his Custom 24 refinished by PRS, but now there's a video called "Are PRS Guitars worth it?".

How could that happen?

Whitecat

Lol, I was wondering. That one makes far more sense. Anyway, good luck - hopefully everyone will be cool about it if you do decide to pursue a fix (what's the point of a lifetime warranty if you don't though?) 

Philly_Q

Thread resurrection with another PRS finish issue...

I see now that my S2 Mira Semi-Hollow (2014, this time, so a year newer than the solidbody) has developed a fairly pronounced ridge along the line where the top meets the hollowed-out back.  At least I assume it's that line, as it's a solid colour.

I guess it's wood shrinkage rather than a finish issue really, but still it's odd to find these things on PRS guitars when they're usually so problem-free!

WezV

Things like that will happen in most guitars eventually, whatever the finish

sawyer

Did you look into the lifetime warranty? 

Philly_Q

sawyer said:

Did you look into the lifetime warranty? 

Not in any great detail, I've done a bit of research but I haven't contacted anybody.  I believe it does apply, and if I was in the US I'd almost certainly be able to send it back to PRS for a refinish.  It's not so clear what happens in Europe, I think you have to go via the original dealers - which I'm not keen on doing, it's not their fault!  Then I've read a couple of things about PRS Europe possibly getting it sorted "locally", but I'd be a lot happier with PRS themselves taking care of it.  

At the moment I'm minded to just put up with it, these things are a little unsightly but there's no finish flaking off or anything dramatic.  If I'd been planning to sell the guitars it would be more of an issue.

GoldenEraGuitars

Wood expands and contracts, it’ll take the finish with it unfortunately. No brand, finish or guitar type is immune to it. Still not something you want to see though 

Philly_Q

GoldenEraGuitars said:

Wood expands and contracts, it’ll take the finish with it unfortunately. No brand, finish or guitar type is immune to it. Still not something you want to see though 

Yeah, if it was a Gibson I wouldn't have really given it much thought at all, I'm just surprised (maybe I shouldn't be) to see it on PRS.  The guitars are 6-7 years old so they're not new, but they haven't been played much (like most of my guitars, I'm afraid), so I think of them as new!

GoldenEraGuitars

Philly_Q said:

GoldenEraGuitars said:

Wood expands and contracts, it’ll take the finish with it unfortunately. No brand, finish or guitar type is immune to it. Still not something you want to see though 

Yeah, if it was a Gibson I wouldn't have really given it much thought at all, I'm just surprised (maybe I shouldn't be) to see it on PRS.  The guitars are 6-7 years old so they're not new, but they haven't been played much (like most of my guitars, I'm afraid), so I think of them as new!

That’s it, it’s our perception of branding and we’re all told how good the PRS finishing is that we wouldn’t expect to see or hear about it at all. On a Gibson it’s just par for the course. Although much of the finish “issues” I’ve read about with Gibson’s are buyers not expecting to see checking which are usually called “cracks”

poopot

Can you post a pic of the cloudy bit?

Philly_Q

poopot said:

Can you post a pic of the cloudy bit?

Afraid not, I'm rubbish with phone cameras, I don't have an Imgur account....  I don't think it would show up very well anyway, it would probably look like (or be hidden by) a reflection. 

Here's a picture I found of someone else's (core) PRS.  The cloudy/milky patch on mine isn't anywhere near as big, or as opaque, but it's the same kind of thing going on:

skunkwerx

GoldenEraGuitars said:

Philly_Q said:

GoldenEraGuitars said:

Wood expands and contracts, it’ll take the finish with it unfortunately. No brand, finish or guitar type is immune to it. Still not something you want to see though 

Yeah, if it was a Gibson I wouldn't have really given it much thought at all, I'm just surprised (maybe I shouldn't be) to see it on PRS.  The guitars are 6-7 years old so they're not new, but they haven't been played much (like most of my guitars, I'm afraid), so I think of them as new!

That’s it, it’s our perception of branding and we’re all told how good the PRS finishing is that we wouldn’t expect to see or hear about it at all. On a Gibson it’s just par for the course. Although much of the finish “issues” I’ve read about with Gibson’s are buyers not expecting to see checking which are usually called “cracks”

Opposite in my case! i cant wait til mine develops them haha.. I fear it never will though

poopot

Philly_Q said:

poopot said:

Can you post a pic of the cloudy bit?

Afraid not, I'm rubbish with phone cameras, I don't have an Imgur account....  I don't think it would show up very well anyway, it would probably look like (or be hidden by) a reflection. 

Here's a picture I found of someone else's (core) PRS.  The cloudy/milky patch on mine isn't anywhere near as big, or as opaque, but it's the same kind of thing going on:

That looks like lacquer blushing... moisture in the lacquer basically... the same as when you get a water ring on the kitchen table... the same as below:

You can give this a try if you want?

take one hairdryer... gently heat the effected area... keep it moving and don’t get it too hot at any one time... 

it should start to disappear...

fyi, you can do the same thing on the water rings on the kitchen table...

Philly_Q

@poopot I might give it a go.  As noted by @Whitecat above, it's a known issue with guitars from this period, whether or not it was due to moisture in the lacquer I don't know.  Would it just appear if it hadn't been there originally?