Mixing on headphones

Freebird

Is it possible?

octatonic

Possible, yes but that doesn't mean you should rely on it until you have a couple of dozen commercial releases under your belt or really know what you are doing.

The only people I know who can successfully mix on headphones to a high standard are very, very experienced producers.
Andrew Scheps does it from time to time.

For mere mortals there is no substitute for a good sounding room, good monitors etc- too many things can go wrong.
I can get 80% of the way there, I guess, but that is about it.

Headphones are good for high detail editing tasks though.

Freebird

Thanks for the info @octatonic

There is a Sound On Sound "Mixing On Headphones" special in the July edition of the magazine, which can be accessed through the offer below, so I guess I wilI give it a read then. You probably need to buy some Audeze LCD-X headphones though   

https://discuss.cakewalk.com/index.php?/topic/16228-free-issue-of-sound-on-sound-pdf/

merlin

Mixing needs to be done using several speaker possibilities unless, as @octatonic says, you're a guru/genius/proper pro, and have done it for several lifetimes. 

I have always edited using reference headphones and then mixed using every single type of speaker system I can get hold of. 

smigeon

The OP's question has been buzzing around between my ears also, and I've been wondering if those room-simulation plug-ins were worth a go (e.g. the "Abbey Road" ones from Waves: https://www.waves.com/plugins/abbey-road)?

Some background: I'm a beginner at music production, having taken advantage of Apple's 6 month Logic Pro X free trial over the summer. I've become hooked, and have done a *lot* of work in Logic doing covid era "one at a time" recordings with my band. I've used headphones (Sony MDR-7506's) almost exclusively for mixing and mastering because using monitors drives my wife nuts. So I'm well familiar with that phenomenon of things sounding great through phones and terrible through speakers, or in the car, or even through a different set of headphones. I do think I'm getting better at predicting how my mixes will sound in the wild, but could certainly use all the help I can get.

So, does anyone have experience of the Abbey Road plug-ins or similar products?

octatonic

smigeon said:

The OP's question has been buzzing around between my ears also, and I've been wondering if those room-simulation plug-ins were worth a go (e.g. the "Abbey Road" ones from Waves: https://www.waves.com/plugins/abbey-road)?

So, does anyone have experience of the Abbey Road plug-ins or similar products?

IMHO not really- you just end up spending a load of money on something that, at best, is a gimmick.
I've got all those plugins as part of my Waves bundle but I never use them.

Freebird

smigeon said:

The OP's question has been buzzing around between my ears also, and I've been wondering if those room-simulation plug-ins were worth a go (e.g. the "Abbey Road" ones from Waves: https://www.waves.com/plugins/abbey-road)?

So, does anyone have experience of the Abbey Road plug-ins or similar products?

dSoniq Realphones is the new kid on the block..

https://dt7v1i9vyp3mf.cloudfront.net/styles/header/s3/imagelibrary/d/dsoniq_realphones_01-dOlrumDZOTgzX7oRDyC_zLOUEgEeIyCm.jpg

smigeon

Thanks @Freebird. Looks interesting. Are you experienced?

Freebird

smigeon said:

Thanks @Freebird ;;;. Are you experienced?

I've only just started reading that Sound On Sound article, give it a go.

I think the pros mixing on headphones are using LCD-X cans which cost over £1100!

I just find the topic interesting as I have a background in technology.

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/audeze-lcd-x-el8

smigeon

octatonic said:

smigeon said:

The OP's question has been buzzing around between my ears also, and I've been wondering if those room-simulation plug-ins were worth a go (e.g. the "Abbey Road" ones from Waves: https://www.waves.com/plugins/abbey-road)?

So, does anyone have experience of the Abbey Road plug-ins or similar products?

IMHO not really- you just end up spending a load of money on something that, at best, is a gimmick.
I've got all those plugins as part of my Waves bundle but I never use them.

Yeah - they do seem a bit too good to be true...

Freebird

smigeon said:

octatonic said:

smigeon said:

The OP's question has been buzzing around between my ears also, and I've been wondering if those room-simulation plug-ins were worth a go (e.g. the "Abbey Road" ones from Waves: https://www.waves.com/plugins/abbey-road)?

So, does anyone have experience of the Abbey Road plug-ins or similar products?

IMHO not really- you just end up spending a load of money on something that, at best, is a gimmick.
I've got all those plugins as part of my Waves bundle but I never use them.

Yeah - they do seem a bit too good to be true...

I tried Can Opener with Sonarworks and it seemed to be doing something, I just wasn't sure what!

I use Sennheiser HD600 which are half-decent with calibration, but they are nowhere near the planar headphones.

https://goodhertz.co/canopener-studio/

https://www.sonarworks.com/

octatonic

The issue is translation.

Freebird

octatonic said:

The issue is translation.

They need to get Elon Musk on the case, maybe develop some kind of mixing implant for the brain  

spark240

I mix on cans a lot....I like it that way.

fastonebaz

I mix on headphones alot.  Guess that's why my mixes sound so poor.  Doh

PolarityMan

I sadly mostly have to mix on headphones at the moment..I mean its ok, I feel like Im still the weak part in my mix regardless of if im using monitors or cans but I def dont enjoy it as much.

Bezzer

I mix on headphones all the time too. I don’t really have any choice.

i do play each track on as many systems as possible afterwards and make notes if there are things I need to correct.

I don’t see it as a massive hinderance as long as you check the mix elsewhere, then you learn the headphones. Can’t be much worse than a really shit room with budget tending monitors. 

hollywoodrox

fastonebaz said:

I mix on headphones alot.  Guess that's why my mixes sound so poor.  Doh

Doesn’t matter when you can shred like demon though lol

andy_k

The secret is to understand the relationship between your own monitoring environment, compared to how pro mixes sound on the same speakers / headphones.
After a while you start to trust your own mixes, as you are aware of the problem areas, you can't make good decisions if you can't hear certain frequencies.
I use I louds, in my own space, which is completely untreated, so I hear very limited details through them, but I am starting to trust them for what they are, I check my mixes on Sennheiser HD650's, which are something of an industry standard, much like NS10s, and I am also beginning to get an idea where I go wrong.
It takes a lot of time, comparing and re-mixing to suit what you are learning, the more you do the more you learn.
In other news, Slate just released their VSX headphone, which is a direct competitor to the options mentioned above.
In the US they are available as rent to own for about $40 a month for 12 months, like most of the Slate stuff, it is an ecosystem which will be expanded on. If you can wrap your head around the concept, it seems to be a good one.

thecolourbox

I only mix through headphones really because I'm usually using a laptop on the sofa unless I'm recording. However as nobody ever listens to my stuff, I'm the only person who hears it which is also through headphones (often also on the sofa) so I guess it doesn't matter. I've no doubt a proper treated room and good monitors would make it sound better, but whether it would sound better enough for the outlay and research you'd have to do I guess it's down to the individuals needs

PolarityMan

andy_k said:

After a while you start to trust your own mixes, as you are aware of the problem areas, you can't make good decisions if you can't hear certain frequencies.

One thing Ive started doing recently after seeing it on a podcast or something is to use fabfilter to listen to only the affected band of an EQ so I can for example isolate just below 200hz. Im still not great at it and obviosuly there are still limits to how well the headphones produce the low end but it does at least let you focus on it a bit.