audio interface, mixer as interface or both??

paulmapp8306

PK... Ive been using a soundcraft signature 12 MTK for the last 2 years.   14 in 12 out interface, with 3 stereo channels (one of which is the USB return) and 6 mono.

The mixer itself still works just fine BUT the USB interface has gone tits.  so I need an alternative to get sound out of my PC to my speakers, as well as in when I record (which isnt that often).

Despite the mixer having those 14 ins, I havent really used more than the stereo in.   When I DO record its generally me.  I can sequence my keyboards, or record each part into the DAW individually.   While having multiple ins is "nice" I really don think I "need" them.

So - what to do.    I need the mixer just for general playback - my AFX going into one stereo pair, my keyboards into another, my PC in a 3rd and PS4 onto a 4th.

Options as far as I can see. 

1.  Keep the Soundcraft as the actual analogue mixer, but add something like the scarlet 2i2 just to handle the PC interface bit.   So the main outs of the mixer go to my speakers, with the sub bus going into scarlet to record, and the scarlet outs going to a stereo input of the mixer.  Cheapest option, but an extra box (and as everything goes through the mixer first Im not benefiting from the quality if the Pre Amps)

2.  Just replace the mixer with a new analogue one.   Something like the Prosonus Studio live Arc 12c which is similar to what I have but is a stereo in/out (which as I say is probably enough) - but has more stereo channels that suits my use better.  ** Edit - actually seen this is a 14x4 interface as well... though I cant see if the control room and phones output are independent from the main fader or not.   One of them would need to be.  

3.   Stick with a multichannel interface and just go like for like - or opt for a digital Behringer XAir (we use one with my band and I have a tablet just for controlling my monito mix - which I can use at home as the control surface).

So - given the biggest use I have is actually as an analogue mixer - but need to get audio into the PC on occasion, which is the best way to go here???
 

Musicwolf

paulmapp8306 said:

The mixer itself still works just fine BUT the USB interface has gone tits. 
 

Before you do anything else, have you checked to see whether the drivers are up to date?

octatonic

Very few people use mixers these days- for the reasons you identify.

Better to put all your signals on a patch bay and live patch into an audio interface.

I wouldn't buy anything with fewer than 8 inputs myself but I prefer having a discrete input to the computer for every commonly used device- hence having 64 channels of input and 48 channels of output (for outboard).

Most never need to go down that route- something like a UA Apollo X8 is more than enough for.

The key component is the patchbay- I prefer Audio Accessories bantam models.

paulmapp8306

yeh....  Tried assorts.  Ted different usb cables, different PC ports, uninstall and reinstall latest drivers.   
    
When I connect it the sound device windows menu freezes half the time.    When not I get all the inputs listed, but only half the outputs.  the outputs don't play anything.   At first I thought it was the USB/analogue switch because toggling that brought it back to life - but that no longer works. 

Even did a full windows clean install in case it was windows sound that was playing up.

Been through extensive fault finding, and chaps with Sound craft.  They think the USB interface board has gone and needs replacing. 

paulmapp8306

The Prosonus as nice as it looks has a down side... both headphone and control room controls are tied to the main......  Thats no good because I need to monitor via headphones with nothing going to the mains.   

The yamaha 12xu looks decent enough if stereo interface is enough, though I recall trying one and finding the digital usb output to PC to be very low - like -30db or so.  Not sure If im recalling that correctly now mind.

Stratavarious

I have the 22MTK but get a lot of use out of a Yamaha MG12XU which has stereo USB interface,   It’s a great utility mixer and bombproof interface.  No gain issues on PC or MAC

Monitor routing is great for overdubbing stuff or monitoring live inputs 

Musicwolf

May one enquire as to sir's budget?

paulmapp8306

Anything in and around £500 probably.  Im just about to pick up a Neumann KH750 sub and MA1 calibration mic - which is £1250 (ish) so Im not overly flushed - but I can go to that £500 reasonably enough.

Nerine

Not convinced you need a mixer tbh. 

I’d go for as decent an interface your budget will allow. 

Musicwolf

I'd go with an Audio Interface, forget the mixer.  £500 should get you something with 8 inputs which I'm guessing would meet your needs.   I have a Steinberg UR824 which has served me well over the years and has the advantage of onboard DSP so that I can direct monitor witha bit of 'comfort reverb' whilst tracking.

paulmapp8306

It would, only 95% of the time I'm using the mixer as just that, the only interface bit is pc audio out.  The rest is mixing keys to my monitors.

I don't record often.

Though as the analogue mixer side works, I could keep that, use the interface to gently pc out and have more inputs if I want to record that way I guess.

spark240

Depends on your mixer requirements ...I still use my Presonus 16.4.2 as a mixer interface, it allows me to have loads fo stuff connected all the time and just pick my inputs from the Studio One DAW, ...what Presonus are you looking at that doesn't allow you to have a cans mix unless the main outs are on?...that seem odd

paulmapp8306

Thats probably not explaining things quite right.

I have several ways I use my current set-up.

1.  The mixer is just a way to get audio out of my PC to my speakers when Im watching Youtube, playing games etc.   As the analogue "mixer" side of the soundcraft works fine I can still do this using the analogue outs of my PC, though they are a touch noisy.

2.  When Im practicing keys or guitar (though an Axe-FX) - again the mixer currently takes a summed stereo input from the keys (I have a line mixer on the rig for live) with another stereo from the AFX.   Generally here the PC isnt even on.   Its traditional mixer to speakers.

3.  My PS4 sound to speakers - again Im not using it a lot as I PC game more, but there is a feed into the desk for that.   

4.  Playing to backing tracks - so here Im taking the out of the PC to the desk along with the keys/guitar inputs and then onto the speakers.

5.  Recording - which I do nowhere near as much as I should - and probably 5% if that of my usage.  Even then i tend to take the stereo feed from the desk and record one stereo source at a time HOWEVER having the multitrack on the Soundcraft is helpful, if Im recording something we do live (so have multiple key sources at once) as I CAN feed them to separate channels to mix individually later.

So - the reason I went mixer to start with is only 2 of those 5 "usages" is really suitable for a pure interface (as far as Im aware) - particularly the "no pc" proactive and "PS4" useage.  The interface part was a secondary not primary need really.

Now - I can of course ADD an interface now, and keep the soudcraft as the analogue mixer, and feed THAT to the interface for sound into the PC, and use an analogue channel for the return for sound out.  When it was "interface OR mixer" I couldnt do that - but as I have a working mixer I can here.

So - if I go interface route, 2 in 2 out would satisfy almost all of my needs - though having more for the keys might be nice - though If I have them all separately I have 7 stereo sources... so would need 14 ins.  8 should be useable though I guess - thats still 4 separate synth feeds.



 So - if I add an interface, what are the suggestions.   Smaller is better, and my preference is for inputs on the back - particularly XLR as a pair of those that will be permanently connected to the mixers outs. 

paulmapp8306

looking at the scarlet 8i6 or the M-Audi Air 192/14 at present.

The Apollo twin USB looks nice but a bit pricey for my needs I think.

paulmapp8306

spark240 said:

Depends on your mixer requirements ...I still use my Presonus 16.4.2 as a mixer interface, it allows me to have loads fo stuff connected all the time and just pick my inputs from the Studio One DAW, ...what Presonus are you looking at that doesn't allow you to have a cans mix unless the main outs are on?...that seem odd

Im talking about pure audio interfaces, such as the scarletts 816 and such - not a mixer interface.

paulmapp8306

Ok,  actually got the mixer working, driver issue with latest w10 update.  Had to use there newer notebook drivers.

But, I've decide to get a proper interface anyway and mothball the mixer.  Saves deskspace  and can also ditch my headphone amp/mixer.

Gone for a focusrite scarlet 18i20

Spdif in I can use from axe fx, spdif out I can send to my neumann sub, gain knobs for all analogue inputs as well as channel monitoring.

If I really want a separate input in stereo from all my synths I can add their octopre via adat for 16 analogue ins.

Thanks for the suggestions.