Which MacBook? Sorted

andy_k

Short answer, yes, I gave it 100% and came out of it with a 2.1, and the feeling that a first would have been impossible.
To be clear, it wasn't the same Uni, so facilities could be different, but there wasn't a shortage of facilities.

Snap

andy_k said:

Short answer, yes, I gave it 100% and came out of it with a 2.1, and the feeling that a first would have been impossible.
To be clear, it wasn't the same Uni, so facilities could be different, but there wasn't a shortage of facilities.

So, not University of Salford, doing CMT?

I was blown away by the facilities. Made me feel all funny!!

andy_k

I was at a local Uni doing Creative music Production, an entire floor was devoted to the music department, with 4 fully kitted out studios.
The thing with the course, is a lot of it is written work, which can be done on any machine.
This was all pre-lockdown of course, so I expect a lot of stuff has been moved online, but basically the course was all stored on an online service anyway.
I used the studios and the Macs and PCs on site to do some recording, bands etc, but all my mixing was eventually done on my 2012 MBP with Reaper.
I took the files in to the studio to use their monitors, which is another thing that cannot really be done cheaply, you should budget for some good quality mastering headphones, it makes getting the mixes right a LOT easier.
I went for Sennheiser HD650's, which aren't particularly high end models, but served me well.
She will probably need a cheaper pair for use in classes, and some good quality USB storage is nice.
If I were you, I would try and hold off the large purchases until she gets a term under her belt, it can be a worry carrying around expensive gear, and it is really not that necessary, I wore out a cheap Chromebook, and did the last year with a replacement that cost me £100, inc a 128g SD card ( this is being typed on it )
Have a look for some of the Dell educational models, which are aimed at schools, there is a good chance something like that will serve her well for the academic work, there is a lot of it, and I would even suggest an M1 Mac Mini over a MBP these days.
I think that is what I will end up with, when my MBP dies.

Snap

thanks for all this pal, all good stuff.
However I look at it, it's all coming back to the MBP 14" really. Bite the bullet and do it right I suppose!

andy_k

They do make some pretty nifty hard shell cases for MBP, and the machine itself should be perfect for the use it is planned for, it would be silly to not have some good Apple care / insurance on it though, so that is a must.
The ports will take a hammering, if she does what I did, by taking my own machine into the studios and using their I/O on my machine, Just something else to think about at an early stage.
Think about it as something that will have a 3 year life span, and work out the costs over 3 years, anything after that is a bonus.
I'd also be suggesting a spec of 16gig ram, 1 tb disc, as a good start, anything much less will be struggling in 3 years.

ArchtopDave

A couple of things to add. One, she needs something portable to use, as she'll need it in lecture halls etc, so a Mac Mini isn't suitable. Secondly, I recently bought myself a new iPhone, and discovered that you can now pay for AppleCare monthly if you want, and that it covers you for as long as you pay ... I'm paying £9.49 monthly to cover an iPhone 13 Pro.

roberty

They are amazing these new ones @Snap ;

hollywoodrox

ArchtopDave said:

All I can say is that my daughter did a standard 4 year Scottish Undergraduate Degree, and then a 1 year Master's Postgraduate Degree using MacBook Pro's without problem. She is careful with stuff. Took advantage of Apple Education discount both to get the first MacBook Pro when she started as an Undergrad, and then a new one at the start of her Postgrad year. I took her original one off her for me own use, and it continues to function well.

The only extra advice I would give is that she learnt how to open the MacBook Pro case so as to be able to give the inside a clean out of dust from time to time. A useful skill for keeping a MacBook Pro happy.

That’s cool , I would imagine dust could cause heat buildup and other problems . My ancient snow leopard one from years ago had a fan that made a hellish noise 

hollywoodrox

Danny1969 said:

It's a bit of a minefield now as all the newer ones don't stand up to uni life very well. The USB C system used for charging and everything else is quite prone to mechanical and electronic damage and the proximity of some of the higher voltage rails to data rails means they don't cope with any kind of spill damage or even high humidity at all. Just using one in a steamy kitchen for a recipe can damage it. 
So you kind of need to tell them that these machines are different and all her lecturers banging on about how good Macbook Pro's are for music and general uni are mainly talking about the older magsafe models made up to around 2016. 

Apple care is essential as any repairs are very expensive. The 2 main points of failure aren't covered under warranty. Being mechanical damage ofUSB C socket and liquid damage. There are indicators on the motherboard, these are white when the machine leaves the factory but will turn red and invalidate the warranty if exposed to any kind of moisture. 

Secondhand a used A1502 Retina from 2015  will be fine and cost around £400. Probably outlast a 2021 model too. 

Great bit of advice Danny , I always like to keep abreast of the best of the 2nd hand macs 

hollywoodrox

Snap said:

Update
My daughter now has an unconditional offer from Salford Uni to do the Creative Music Technology degree. 
We have now been twice to check out facilities: they blew my mind. The new music dept building is only 5 years old, has 6 fully kitted out studios, each centred on a huge audient analogue desk. 2 performance spaces, one of which is the rather lovely Victorian Peel Hall. Mac tuition room has over 30 stations in it, and there are more (fully kitted with drums and backline) practice rooms than I have seen anywhere. 450 music students there. I'd no idea of the size of the faculty at all. 

The DAWs that are mainly focused on are Logic and Pro Tools. So, it appears I will have to bite the bullet and go for some form of Macbook. My view is buy right, buy once and it will last for a long time. 

A proud dad, soon to be parting with eye watering amounts of money!

I've been looking a the Pros and Airs. Ouch, they are pricey. thinking about a 14" MBP. Is the RAM upgrade advisable, or will it do the biz on 8GB? I read that the M1 is clever in how it uses RAM

Congratulations to you and your daughter ,what an awesome adventure and opportunity  you must both be really excited .

Snap

thanks all, again.
@hollywoodrox - thanks a lot, yes indeed. On the open day I felt like retiring on the spot and asking to join the course as well!!

Wonderful adventures ahead for her.

andy_k

You can do a degree up to 60 years old I think, I was 52 when I started mine. Just saying.

colourofsound

Apple are about to refresh the 13" MBP Line; assuming she starts in September you have loads of time for the market to mature a bit.

If a music degree nowadays is anything like it was when I did mine, you won't need to spunk £1800 on a 14" MBP. Its overkill.

Theres plenty of videos on youtube of stress tests on the M1 Macbook Air and Macbook Pro - this one is particularly detailed (if you can manage to get through it - )

And there are plenty of more videos pitting the new 14" M1 Pro chips against the 1st gen M1s; and theres not much point having that extra power (and expense)

As for recommendations regarding older Macs - my experience with my 2015 Macbook Pro is that as a day to day machine its great, but load any more than one plugin per track and the CPU starts to wail. I'll be looking at an M1 upgrade soon.

I think to balance performance and affordability, you should aim for a 13" M1 Macbook Pro. I don't think 16GB of RAM is necessary; but might be a canny idea for furture proofing. If you wait for Apple to release a refresh, they will soon put the 1st gen model in their refurbed store, so you can get an previous gen model at a slight discount, direct from the source.

The money that is saved on that could be spent on a decent set of closed back headphones - Audio Technica ATH M50x are a good shout - and you can't go wrong having an SM57 in your bag.

Snap

@colourofsound thanks for the above, food for thought. My thinking on the 14" screen is purely down to screen size as she is working on a 15.6" now and I worry that 13 is too small full stop. Good points on chip too. I'd lean to 16GB RAM for the futureproofing
 
She already has a reasonable PC setup, including a SM58. Closed backs are a good call actually. I've got a pair of AKG 271 MKII which she could have, hadn't thought that far yet.

cheers J

Snap

Bought. 14" Macbook Pro, M1 pro chip, 16gb RAM, 1tb disk. Comes complete with a v large hole in your bank balance.

ArchtopDave

Snap said:

 Comes complete with a v large hole in your bank balance.

This is what daughters are for. After you've finished paying for Uni, start putting a bit aside to help with her first house deposit!! 

roberty

Snap said:

Bought. 14" Macbook Pro, M1 pro chip, 16gb RAM, 1tb disk. Comes complete with a v large hole in your bank balance.

Honestly they are amazing. It will last for several long years and still have resale

Snap

ArchtopDave said:

Snap said:

 Comes complete with a v large hole in your bank balance.

This is what daughters are for. After you've finished paying for Uni, start putting a bit aside to help with her first house deposit!! 

ha, already there mate. This is our youngest daughter!