Worthwhile mods to a Mexican player series telecaster

M1ck

As the title, I’ve recently bought a Fender Mexican Telecaster (s/s config) it’s ok but….. I’m pretty sure it could be better - though probably never in the same league as a full strength USA Telecaster. I know the neck and the nut need a little work (I have a tusq nut on order) but what about pickups and electrics? It’s got the stock alnico 5 pickups and std 3 way switch.  I have a set of Fralins and a set of Seymour Duncan Quarter Pounders that we’re bought for a project guitar that’s showing no signs of being finished anytime soon! I would like to aim for a rock/blues-rock/blues sound if at possible. I have no known aversion to EMGs (other than where to fit the battery) or Bare Knuckles etc. 

Dave_Mc

If you've got those two sets and you can be bothered, you might as well fit them first and see. Worst case scenario, even if you don't like them, it'll let you narrow down specs better for what you might like more.

What Fralins are they?

M1ck

Yeah you’re right! I think I was just trying to shorten the path by asking for others advice - in an ideal world I guess the best way would be to use emg style connectors that would make swapping out much easier and a permanent connection could be made further down the line - I’ve yet to find something suitable for that though,
The fralins are the blues set for telecaster 

SteveRobinson

You need different values pots for EMG and passive pickups so can't plug and play

Dave_Mc

M1ck said:

Yeah you’re right! I think I was just trying to shorten the path by asking for others advice - in an ideal world I guess the best way would be to use emg style connectors that would make swapping out much easier and a permanent connection could be made further down the line - I’ve yet to find something suitable for that though,
The fralins are the blues set for telecaster 

No worries about asking the question, you're quite right, I was just making the point that if you can try them, you'll know more than you do now even if you go for something else eventually.

I've seen stuff on Ebay for solderless connectors, I think. I think Alegree does stuff like that as well.

I haven't tried either the Quarter Pound (don't worry @Funkfingers , I didn't almost add the "er" at the end there!  ) or the Fralins, but I'd make an educated guess that, for what you want to play, I'd probably try the Fralins first- if you want to be more likely to get it right first go. If you're planning on trying both, it doesn't matter. The Quarter Pounds might be a bit hot for what you want (or not, that might be exactly what you want!).

M1ck

@Dave_Mc lol yes your quite right - Quarter Pound (my bad should have checked - though in my defense I think I bought them described as Quarter Pounders) I’ll check out Alegree for solderless connectors though cheers.

@SteveRobinson I’d forgotten about the pot size/value difference between active and passive - Not a show stopper but something to be aware of

Funkfingers

Dave_Mc said: 

The Quarter Pounds might be a bit hot for what you want (or not, that might be exactly what you want!).

Seymour Duncan STL3/STR3 pickups are for people who have a Telecaster but wish that they had something else. Their main advantage is that they are loud enough to keep up with mid-Seventies medium-to-high output humbuckers. The main disadvantage is that the overwinding leaves little or no proper Telecaster dynamics or tone. The smart option would be to get the tapped versions but almost nobody does. Seduced by the promise of increased output, I guess.

M1ck said:

I’d forgotten about the pot size/value difference between active and passive - Not a show stopper but something to be aware of

Actually, it could be. 

250/500/1000k pots put so much loading on low impedance pickups that they kill all of the treble.

It has been so long since I have seen passive pickups connected to 25/50k pots that I cannot remember what happens.

•

The early EMG RT bridge/Treble pickup models are just their Stratocaster designs inside a Telecaster pickup shaped housing. The later variants sound closer to the real thing but never quite get there.

•

I suggest the Fralin pair, via either a Freeway 3B3 or Schaller Megaswitch M selector switch. (These are six- and five-way, respectively.) Either could provide a useful range of sounds without resorting to push-pull pots or the unreliable Fender S-1 switching pot.

NOTE: It will be necessary to modify the grounding path on one or other pickup. The Freeway requires this to be on the neck pickup cover. The Schaller insists that it is done on the bridge pickup baseplate.

M1ck

@Funkfingers ;
Cheers for the info - tbh I bought the SD STL3 & STR3 not really knowing what they were - I’m building a partscaster and thought they might go in that and wasn’t aware they were available tapped. I must admit I was erring more towards the Fralins or possibly EMG TXs (with the appropriate pots ) before I asked the question, I have a freeway 3way blade but I’m not really ecstatic about it - it feels flimsy to me! I might go with the Schaller alternative though.

thanks all for the responses.

Rocker

A setup by a competent tech is never a bad idea. And at the same time, get the tech to fit an Earvana nut (available from Feline Guitars). Then just play the damn thing and don’t go looking for something else to change on the guitar. 

ICBM

M1ck said:

... though probably never in the same league as a full strength USA Telecaster.

You may be surprised that that isn't necessarily so. Mexican Player Series are some of the best Fenders below Custom Shop level in my experience, and although they do vary a bit, if you get a really great one you really won't find a better plain Tele.

Funkfingers said:

Seymour Duncan STL3/STR3 pickups are for people who have a Telecaster but wish that they had something else. Their main advantage is that they are loud enough to keep up with mid-Seventies medium-to-high output humbuckers. The main disadvantage is that the overwinding leaves little or no proper Telecaster dynamics or tone.

I actually think it's the other way round - they're for people who *don't* want to lose the 'Tele-ness' by going to a humbucker guitar. They still sound like a Tele, just a massively fat and powerful one - but unlike any kind of humbucker, they do retain that deep bottom-end punch and twang. I prefer the bridge one fitted with a baseplate (which they don't come with as stock) and then they're probably my favourite 'not trying to be a vintage Tele' Tele pickup. The neck one isn't that useful without the bridge one - it's too dark to mix well with anything less powerful - but the bridge can be useful with a standard neck, if you want to exaggerate the 'pickup selector as overdrive switch' character that Teles have to some extent anyway.

Although I do agree about the tap option - it gives the best of both worlds, especially with the baseplate which makes even more difference on the tapped sound than the full one.

Funkfingers said:

250/500/1000k pots put so much loading on low impedance pickups that they kill all of the treble.

It has been so long since I have seen passive pickups connected to 25/50k pots that I cannot remember what happens.

Other way round - 25K/50Ks kill the output and treble of passive pickups, but 250K/500Ks will work with actives - or at least the volumes will, the tone controls won't do anything much - but they simply reintroduce all the disadvantages of cable loading and noise that you fitted active pickups to avoid...

Dave_Mc

M1ck said:

@Dave_Mc lol yes your quite right - Quarter Pound (my bad should have checked - though in my defense I think I bought them described as Quarter Pounders) I’ll check out Alegree for solderless connectors though cheers.

@SteveRobinson I’d forgotten about the pot size/value difference between active and passive - Not a show stopper but something to be aware of

I was making a joke at @Funkfingers 's expense, not yours! (I did actually type it with the "er" the first time, I just realised and deleted it! ) He's always pointing that out. I don't care, it's not like there's any confusion there  

Funkfingers said:

Dave_Mc said: 

The Quarter Pounds might be a bit hot for what you want (or not, that might be exactly what you want!).

(a) Seymour Duncan STL3/STR3 pickups are for people who have a Telecaster but wish that they had something else. Their main advantage is that they are loud enough to keep up with mid-Seventies medium-to-high output humbuckers. The main disadvantage is that the overwinding leaves little or no proper Telecaster dynamics or tone. The smart option would be to get the tapped versions but almost nobody does. Seduced by the promise of increased output, I guess.

M1ck said:

I’d forgotten about the pot size/value difference between active and passive - Not a show stopper but something to be aware of

(b) It has been so long since I have seen passive pickups connected to 25/50k pots that I cannot remember what happens.

(c) I suggest the Fralin pair, via either a Freeway 3B3 or Schaller Megaswitch M selector switch. (These are six- and five-way, respectively.) Either could provide a useful range of sounds without resorting to push-pull pots or the unreliable Fender S-1 switching pot.

(d) NOTE: It will be necessary to modify the grounding path on one or other pickup. The Freeway requires this to be on the neck pickup cover. The Schaller insists that it is done on the bridge pickup baseplate.

(a) Yeah. I haven't tried those, but based on other hot single coils I have tried, that sounds about right. It's kind of surprising that tapped single coils aren't a bit more popular- they're not quite as good as "having your cake and eating it too", but they're not a million miles away, and work way better than (IMO) coil splits on humbuckers or series wiring on single coils.

(b) I've never tried it but I would guess it would suck a lot of your treble?

(c) Yeah those Freeway blade switches are a lot handier to wire than push-pulls/push-pushes, too! Only thing is if you did want to go for tapped pickups, you'd have to get PPs anyway. Plus if the Tele switch is the same as the Strat one, I was warned that combining tapped singles with the Freeway switch might work, but it also might not- IIRC it might tap the wrong half of the coil or something like that. Not a major problem (presumably) if the tap is bang in the centre of the wind, but if it's not...

(d) Does it? I know with the Strat Freeway switch you can do it on the bridge pickup, but maybe the Tele switch is different (I know it does a few different things on the Tele like phase switching which the Strat one doesn't do).

ICBM said:

I actually think it's the other way round - they're for people who *don't* want to lose the 'Tele-ness' by going to a humbucker guitar. They still sound like a Tele, just a massively fat and powerful one - but unlike any kind of humbucker, they do retain that deep bottom-end punch and twang. I prefer the bridge one fitted with a baseplate (which they don't come with as stock) and then they're probably my favourite 'not trying to be a vintage Tele' Tele pickup. The neck one isn't that useful without the bridge one - it's too dark to mix well with anything less powerful - but the bridge can be useful with a standard neck, if you want to exaggerate the 'pickup selector as overdrive switch' character that Teles have to some extent anyway.

Although I do agree about the tap option - it gives the best of both worlds, especially with the baseplate which makes even more difference on the tapped sound than the full one.

Going by hottish tapped Strat single coils I have, the higher output setting kind of loses its Strattiness quite a bit- though I do agree it doesn't really sound like a humbucker, either. I've got a set of Alegree tapped Tele pickups, though the higher output setting of them still isn't that hot (still 42AWG, just sort of maxxed out so around 8.5k) and even it's starting to sound a little less Tele than I'd like (not a massive problem because that's what I've got the lower output setting for! I only got the higher setting in case the regular setting wasn't hot enough for some things... it probably is, lol).

I also thought my Wilkinson Tele bridge pickup that I used to have in my Fret-King wasn't really "Tele" enough and I measured it around mid/high-7k (admittedly it was supposedly a broadcaster-style pickup, but I thought they were meant to use 43AWG?). So I would guess the STL-3 would be even worse in that respect! I am a bit picky when it comes to Tele bridge pickups, there's a real sweet spot for me around the high 6k to low 7k range where it still sounds like a Tele but has enough grunt for most stuff as well...

M1ck

This is what I love about this forum, lots of good, sound, advice from people I don’t know with far more experience than I have (or will probably ever have!). Sadly my inexperience prevents me from answering s other’s questions which bugs me when I’m part of a group that passes on information so freely. 

Anyway - I bought the Tele on a bit of a whim, brand new still in the sealed box so I knew there would a degree of setting up to be carried out. It came strung with 9’s which are tight in the nut and causing slight tuning issues but I’ll be putting 11’s on when the tusq nut turns up so it isn’t really a problem as such, an earvana nut has been suggested which I would be happy to try but I’ve been unable to find out how it would fit into the slot!.
  My intent is to go through the whole set up from the nut to the bridge hence my question about worthwhile mods - at the end of the day it’s not an expensive instrument so parts of it will have been ‘value engineered’, I just thought if I’m going though the whole thing then it would be a good time to make any worthwhile changes to pickups, wiring, switches etc. (though ‘worthwhile’ is probably subjective dependent upon personal preferences).
  I think I’m leaning towards the Fralin pickups as I already have them for a project tele that’s taking far longer than anticipated to complete then I can leave it alone and enjoy playing it.
  Thank you all for your detailed replies they’ve been very helpful and enlightening. 

Rocker

@M1ck apologies if my post came across as nasty and brusque but I understand from your OP that you bought a Tele and want to improve it. I believe that it becomes easy to spend a lot of money upgrading a guitar, money that might be better spent buying a ‘better’ guitar at the start. 

It was I who suggested fitting an Earvana nut, if you play cleanish sounds, I think it is important that it plays in tune. My USA made Tele plays fairly well in tune but I still will change the nut for an Earvana early next year. My Epi LP really benefited from an Earvana nut, it is now a completely new instrument and worth the cost of the upgrade. I fitted a shelf nut which I got from Feline Guitars. It took about two days for my ears to acclimatise to the sound of the Epi playing in tune but now I wouldn’t have it any other way. 

M1ck

Rocker said:

@M1ck apologies if my post came across as nasty and brusque 

@Rocker No it didn't at all - so nothing not apologise for! Thats always going to be an issue with any forum/email it can be difficult to tell if someones trying to help (as you were) or just trying to be obtuse! Please be assured (as with all the other replies) I took it as a helpful suggestion along with the earvana nut (I knew it was your suggestion but I was trying not to single out anyone in particular as all the replies so far have been so helpful).
I have found out the hard way how costs can run away if you let them - the partscaster project has cost me more then my Tele did - taken 6 months so far and its still not finished!  though when/if its finished I will have learnt a tremendous amount about guitars in general and can sit back and say 'I did that' (though I'm not naive enough to think I could possibly make one from scratch!) Buying a 'better' guitar in the first place was an option and sanctioned by Mrs M1ck the realist in me struggled to justify it, though I do take it seriously I only play for my own amusement/entertainment. 

tanihhiavlt

11s is an excellent mod for a tele  

I really like electro-sockets on my teles - the standard cup socket stresses me, where a chunk of turned aluminium reassures me. 

I also like the Gotoh extra large strap buttons and have them on nearly all my guitars now.

I've flipped the control panel (and pots) so the pickup selector is at the back, so I can change volume/gain on the fly.

I swap the volume pot for a CTS low friction, not too fussed about 250 or 500k, the tone has to be an audio taper (as a south paw reverse audio taper).. and the switch knob is a strat one ...

IMO tele pickup selector knobs are ridiculous, fall off and get in the way of the tone control. So I use strat knobs or a piece of heatshrink wrapped over the top of the bare metal.

My approach to tuning on a tele is based off having a 3 barrel saddle set and an ashtray bridge - I intone for a 4 note per string scale. I don't like the 6 saddles on a tele - mostly a visual aesthetic I guess, I'm happy to change my playing approach to a more restricted style on that one instrument (I've 9 other guitars atm - a buzz feiten on a Suhr classic and an earvana on Tokai ES-120) 

The compensated nuts are great for wide ranging chordal playing and harp harmonics.

Dave_Mc

M1ck said:

This is what I love about this forum, lots of good, sound, advice from people I don’t know with far more experience than I have (or will probably ever have!). Sadly my inexperience prevents me from answering s other’s questions which bugs me when I’m part of a group that passes on information so freely. 

It's never stopped me!  For example, if you're thinking about changing the nut, you know a lot more about setups than I do  

DannyP

Do Seymour Duncans with catchy names get more popular?

Or do more popular Seymour Duncans get catchy names?

Sufficed to say, my Tele had an APTL-1 (which I never hear mentioned) in the bridge when I bought it, and it sounds fab. Tele-ish but capable of warmth with good definition.

Funkfingers

DannyP said:

Do Seymour Duncans with catchy names get more popular?

Or do more popular Seymour Duncans get catchy names?

Customers will tend to ask for products of which they already know. 

Unless you have obsessed over the changes of pickup spec between 1950 and, say, 1955, the difference between Broadcaster, early Telecaster and subsequent Telecaster pickups will mean very little.

ICBM

tanihhiavlt said:

11s is an excellent mod for a tele  

10-52 Light Top/Heavy Bottom is even better .

For me they're the ultimate Tele strings - easy country/blues bending on the top strings, with massive industrial grind and twang on the bottom ones.

If you want even slinkier bending at the expense of slightly less sledgehammer, 9-46 are good too.

tanihhiavlt said:

I've flipped the control panel (and pots) so the pickup selector is at the back, so I can change volume/gain on the fly.

I really dislike a flipped plate - I constantly change volume/gain on the fly with one, when I don't want to .

I always end up scuffing my knuckles on the rough sides of it too.

tanihhiavlt said:

My approach to tuning on a tele is based off having a 3 barrel saddle set and an ashtray bridge - I intone for a 4 note per string scale. I don't like the 6 saddles on a tele - mostly a visual aesthetic I guess, I'm happy to change my playing approach to a more restricted style on that one instrument (I've 9 other guitars atm - a buzz feiten on a Suhr classic and an earvana on Tokai ES-120)

I intonate them for the sharper of the two strings on each saddle - ie the B, G and low E, and let the others be slightly flat. A flat string is much less obvious than a sharp one, and can be compensated for with left-hand technique - even subconsciously, when you get used to it.