Female vocal mic

p90fool

Hi all, I'm a bit out of the loop with this stuff, but my singer is after a new mic. 

We've had pretty good results out of an SM58 and an AKG D5, but I'm wondering whether we're missing anything really good in terms of sound and (crucially) feedback rejection that I don't know about.

Budget is anything up to £200-ish I guess, thanks! 

ICBM

When I did this about fifteen years ago for a female vocalist with a quiet, delicate voice, the answer - possibly counterintuitively - was actually the SM58. The 'clearer' mics which I had thought might sound better with a very pure voice actually just fed back worse at the same volumes.

The Beta 58A is within your budget though, and has even better feedback rejection than the SM58. (Supercardioid rather than cardioid.)

John_P

Sennheiser E 945 or E 935 - sound very detailed and have fabulous gain before feedback.  Imo by far the best live vocal mics under £200

A cheaper option that I keep meaning to try is the se v7.  

maltingsaudio

Best mic for feedback rejection is Audix OM7 worth a look , much better gain befor feedback than a Beta 58
https://audixusa.com/products/om7/

p90fool

Cheers guys, I'll get her to take a look at some of these.

stickyfiddle

Beyer M88 TG is a smidge over budget but can be found in the occasional sale around 200. I find it a little bit richer than an SM58 - really nice mic

Danny1969

Senn E945 has a great frequency response and gain before feedback but you do need to be on it as the patterns quite tight ..being a super cardioid 

If she's on Senn SKM G3 / G4 wireless then it's MMD-945 capsule

I think there's diminishing returns with spending too much though if you are using monitors as most of the mic's goodness in terms of extra detail will be lost preventing feedback. 

p90fool

Cool thanks all.
A bit more background, she's using IEMs and is a very loud singer, but she's not great on mic technique so I'm looking at running a compressor/limiter to try to control things a bit.
We often play in ridiculously tiny pubs and are often extremely close to the main vocal PA cabs.

We don't currently have much of a feedback issue because she's so loud, but I'm thinking compression might exacerbate it a lot.

Consequently I'm thinking something hypercardioid could be a bonus, but I'm open to any suggestions! 

ChrisCox1994

OM5 from audix is a good all rounder for this

Danny1969

If you set the compressor threshold so it only bites on the loud parts and s fairly gentle ratio of around 3 : 1 it should help keep the level of the vocal consistent without causing too much problems feedback wise
All the vocals are compressed in all the bands I play in. 

maltingsaudio

I use compression like Danny does just to control the top of the vocal, if you can hear the compression your using to much unless your using it as an effect. Also don’t touch the make up gain unless your using compression as an effect! It is not a cure all!

Reading the op I would suggest that you try and get the vocalist to improve her mic technique befor investment. If you’ve identified her technique as the root cause of the feedback then this really is where you should start.

p90fool

maltingsaudio said:

I use compression like Danny does just to control the top of the vocal, if you can hear the compression your using to much unless your using it as an effect. Also don’t touch the make up gain unless your using compression as an effect! It is not a cure all!

Reading the op I would suggest that you try and get the vocalist to improve her mic technique befor investment. If you’ve identified her technique as the root cause of the feedback then this really is where you should start.

You're absolutely right of course, but there are fragile egos involved! 

Part of the problem is that despite her volume she seriously lacks confidence and insists on a ridiculously vocal heavy mix in her monitors, meaning she has no way of naturally regulating her level in relation to everyone else. 

She does naturally pull back from the mic on loud notes, the main problem is the overall difference between loud and quiet songs really. 

exocet

Beta 58 takes a lot of beating for live work. 

Stratavarious

John_P said:

Sennheiser E 945 or E 935 - sound very detailed and have fabulous gain before feedback.  Imo by far the best live vocal mics under £200

This.  Def. upgrade to the Shures we used before.  Cardioid and the Hyper if feedback a problem. The hyper will drop off more if she moves from the mic more but might give you more compression range.

But sounds like a one on one re. her mic technique might be needed.  Is there a trusted band leader?  If she sounds bad and it gets back as criticism it won’t help her either if her ego lacks confidence.

Do you have a digital mixer, adjust on phone or ipad quickly for quiet songs?

If you do introduce a new mic you can discuss its ‘characteristics’ as a way in to the discussion on technique.  She might see the drop off of a hyper to be a reason to sing louder.

ESBlonde

If you have the desk Chanels spare split her mic signal in two and process one with comp to FOH, the other stays dry and is assigned to her IEM mix. That way a single comp Chanel can be properly tailored to her foibles without her knowing and she will try to stay on mic for her ears.

p90fool

Some great suggestions here and a lot of food for thought, cheers all!

Danny1969

ESBlonde said:

If you have the desk Chanels spare split her mic signal in two and process one with comp to FOH, the other stays dry and is assigned to her IEM mix. That way a single comp Chanel can be properly tailored to her foibles without her knowing and she will try to stay on mic for her ears.

That's a really good idea

Or (depending on the desk) set the aux send to pre - processing. 

Jeremiah

The trouble with hypercardiod mics is that if the singer moves a bit off-axis there is a much more noticeable volume drop, which could be an issue if her technique isn't that good.

shufflebeat

+1 for Senn e835 & e935. Also consider the sE Electronics v7.

Mic technique learning always results in major payback.

TJT1979

After trying a few my favourite mic for vocals in general is the Lewitt MTP550. Cardioid (needed for head-bobbing guitarists, myself included), and the most natural sound I’ve heard. For the majority of cases I prefer it to a 58, Senn 835 and 935 (not tried the x45 supercardioid models), the V7 and Sontronics Solo. 

It’s open and detailed but warm. I find the Senns in particular a bit strident in the highs, whereas the Lewitt is more detailed than a 58 but warm and natural. 

Excellent feedback rejection too. 

But to be honest it really depends on the voice of a particular singer. 

Also, as mentioned above, better mic technique will make more difference than switching a mic.