Celestion Creamback G12M-65 vs G12H-75 – which one sounds closer to a Greenback?

Yorkie

I am even more confused than I was weeks ago. I have watched some other Zilla shootouts and I am now under the impression that the neo creamback may actually sound far closer to a greenback than any of the other creambacks.

Of all the gear rabbit holes one can go down, speaker change is the one I hate the most

ICBM

Yorkie said:

I am even more confused than I was weeks ago. I have watched some other Zilla shootouts and I am now under the impression that the neo creamback may actually sound far closer to a greenback than any of the other creambacks.

No, it really doesn't. I have one. It's both smoother and more metallic-sounding, somewhat 'halfway to an alnico' with a touch of V30 upper mids and a surprising lack of true top-end.

The G12M-65 is the closest. Trust me.

noisepolluter

H75 and M65 Creambacks come up regularly on here. Get both, keep the one you prefer. 

Yorkie

Got a bit more money. I've discovered Lean and ordered an M, brand new. I'm sure it'll be fine.

Yorkie

Lean have delivered the Creamback in less than 24h  

Will install it on Friday. 

Yorkie

Four days after receiving the speaker I’ve finally found the time to install it. 

First time trying a brand new replacement speaker. The initial 20’ have been unbelievably disappointing. The Creamback was considerably louder than the stock speaker (?), but it sounded… I don’t know, hollow? Then something happened and it started pumping more bass and clearer mids. That got me a bit more excited and I started playing harder, getting more dirt out of the amp… 40’ later, there’s no going back. I can now crank the presence control, crunch sounds glorious. I’ve also got a very consistent sound out of my two amps. 

Jon

Yorkie

Answering the question on whether the valves would rattle on different notes due to the Creamback's different resonant frequency: they don't. I'm getting the exact same rattle and on the same notes.

However.

I have discovered that the valves are much less likely to rattle if I deactivate the onboard (digital) reverb. And I can use my dedicated reverb pedal with little to no rattling happening. I guess they run a different EQ? What a sweet discovery  

Yorkie

Now, I’ve got a question on sensitivities (Hopefully not related to speaker politics  ). 

Creamback: 97 dB. 

Seventy/80: 98 dB. 

Same impedance, the Creamback was noticeably louder. What is going on?

Jon

roberty

Yorkie said:

Now, I’ve got a question on sensitivities (Hopefully not related to speaker politics  ). 

Creamback: 97 dB. 

Seventy/80: 98 dB. 

Same impedance, the Creamback was noticeably louder. What is going on?

Jon

Hey I think it's probably that the Creamback is emphasising frequencies that you are better able to hear. Human hearing is more sensitive to certain frequencies and also this varies from person to person. You can make things sound clearer and louder with subtractive EQ so it could be that the Seventy/80 is pumping out more junk

Winny_Pooh

^^^ as above. DB sensitivity is crude. Often it's using a 1khz tone rather than broadband pink noise or guitar speaker frequencies. Human hearing perceives frequencies in the speech range as louder than they actually are. So high mids/low treble emphasis will make a speaker sound louder

Jonathangus

Because when you heard the Seventy 80, you turned it down?

noisepolluter

Great to hear the speaker swap has worked out Jon. I absolutely love my DSL with the Creamback in it, nothing else really gets a look in these days. 

Yorkie

noisepolluter said:

Great to hear the speaker swap has worked out Jon. I absolutely love my DSL with the Creamback in it, nothing else really gets a look in these days. 

Genuinely happy with it  

Same Greenback vibe with the Marshall character, it’s a fantastic match. 

Jon

noisepolluter

Yorkie said:

noisepolluter said:

Great to hear the speaker swap has worked out Jon. I absolutely love my DSL with the Creamback in it, nothing else really gets a look in these days. 

Genuinely happy with it  

Same Greenback vibe with the Marshall character, it’s a fantastic match. 

Jon

I’m also super pleased that when I eventually need to change the power valves, I don’t need to lug it across town to be biased, thanks to the external bias points. 

Yorkie

Mine is the C version where everything is internal, but at this point I am perfectly happy to bias it myself

ICBM

Yorkie said:

Now, I’ve got a question on sensitivities (Hopefully not related to speaker politics  ). 

Creamback: 97 dB. 

Seventy/80: 98 dB. 

Same impedance, the Creamback was noticeably louder. What is going on?

I think it’s that the Seventy/80 is a stiff, lifeless, mediocre-sounding speaker that sucks the dynamics out of any amp that’s put through it. Perceived volume is as much about dynamic response as overall level.

Why so many amp companies use them I don’t know. (Actually I do - cheapness.)

Yorkie

Curiously, I have re-recorded a few segments at home levels and the difference doesn’t really get captured as much as I perceive it in the room. 

But that’s the stuff that sounded good through the Seventy/80. There’s a bunch of new things I am doing that never sounded good through the old speaker  

For example: Les Paul, neck pickup — my bass lines used to sound hollow and sterile. Not anymore. HUGE tone, so big that my wife came to see what was going on.