Since you all enjoy taunting me for my gear turnover...

Drew_TNBD

guitarfishbay said:

Not knowing how one works - could a midi board + Kemper replace your pedalboard?  Or does the Kemper not do what you need effects wise?  I know there was some kind of switching speed issue when using it as a replacement preamp in some patches, but just used as effects could it be viable?

Kemper doesn't do what I need FX wise, and the gain staging is a little weird when taking the main outputs to the front of an amp. I haven't quite figured out the best way to do it, but I think it's possible. Going from the main outputs is essential, because the reverb and delay are currently locked into position.

Drew_TNBD

dindude said:

Drew_fx said:

Not sure I buy the cheap digital shit argument and anyway, not many decent analog delays with tap tempo!

I'm an analog snob but I still insist on digital delays, my thinking was more Eventide H9, Strymon etc as you mostly seem to be into delays, it just seems a little more fit for purpose, is more compact and will give room to run a few choice analog favourites alongside.

I had an Eventide SPACE. The buffer in it was pretty terrible. Very very noisy, even from it's own power supply. This was into the front of an amp (which is my preferred way of running all effects) so it might be different for others who run it in a loop. So that put me off any of the Eventide stuff.

I had a Strymon Brigadier delay. It wasn't anything special. I don't hear anything in the Strymon algorithms that is really unique, certainly nothing that justifies a £400 price point for a 'single algorithm at a time' delay pedal like the Timeline. They are built well though, I wont debate that.

As my first post kind of indicates, I'm not really finding fault with the sounds that I get from my current setup. But I see an opportunity to simplify it somehow by using a multi-fx for everything. But actually, Bron is completely correct, the reason I sold my first HD500 was because of tone suck. I had kind of forgotten about it!

So I wont be going HD500x. Will most likely stick with my current setup right now.

guitarfishbay

Interesting that the HD500 gear has worse tone suck than the M9.  I would've expected it to be the same.  Things seem to have gone quiet at the higher end of L6 gear since Yamaha bought them, I think everyone is waiting for something to happen.  It would be good for the whole market, it feels like everything has stayed the same for quite a while.

monquixote

guitarfishbay said:

Interesting that the HD500 gear has worse tone suck than the M9.  I would've expected it to be the same.  Things seem to have gone quiet at the higher end of L6 gear since Yamaha bought them, I think everyone is waiting for something to happen.  It would be good for the whole market, it feels like everything has stayed the same for quite a while.

The thing about when Line6 were at the top of their game they were the best you could get, but were also affordable it was like if you could buy an AxeFX for £300. 

I think there is a huge opportunity for them to come up with something comparable in sound quality to a Kemper or AxeFX, but easier to use and cheaper.

steamabacus

Is it because effects are easier to change than band members?



(The source of all frustrations is inevitably other band members)

guitarfishbay

monquixote said:

guitarfishbay said:

Interesting that the HD500 gear has worse tone suck than the M9.  I would've expected it to be the same.  Things seem to have gone quiet at the higher end of L6 gear since Yamaha bought them, I think everyone is waiting for something to happen.  It would be good for the whole market, it feels like everything has stayed the same for quite a while.

The thing about when Line6 were at the top of their game they were the best you could get, but were also affordable it was like if you could buy an AxeFX for £300. 

I think there is a huge opportunity for them to come up with something comparable in sound quality to a Kemper or AxeFX, but easier to use and cheaper.

They're already behind because IMO it is easier to use an Axe FX than a POD HD500x, I have both and the only advantage of the HD500x is the permanent amp EQ.  Once you get to tweaking anything more advanced I find the Axe FX easier, plus if you're on the amp page you've got 5 rotaries anyway - which also reassign when you're in other pages, so overall you probably get more tactile control on the Axe FX too.  I know we probably disagree on this but I'd rather have advanced options than not, in many cases I find them faster to use (e.g. high and low pass on delay/reverb).  The Line 6 parametric EQ doesn't even show you the frequency, it shows you a percentage.  That alone just seems a bizarre design choice.  One which they've never fixed either!

FWIW/Caveat - I use both as entire rigs, so amps plus FX.  I'd prefer to use a normal board with a valve amp, mostly because my needs are very simple.

digitalscream

Drew_fx said:

So can any of you scary scary people tell me precisely why I decided to sell the Pod HD500? I can't really remember. Was it just boredom? Even though I've got an M9 and have just updated the footswitches, I can't shake this notion that I could simplify all of this:

Nope. Since nobody's going to remember with total accuracy, you should probably buy another one. The answer will probably become apparent after a week or so.

Drew_TNBD

guitarfishbay said:

Interesting that the HD500 gear has worse tone suck than the M9.  I would've expected it to be the same.  Things seem to have gone quiet at the higher end of L6 gear since Yamaha bought them, I think everyone is waiting for something to happen.  It would be good for the whole market, it feels like everything has stayed the same for quite a while.

Yeah I do strongly recall it now. The low-end was abruptly cut off, quite severely with the HD500. It's worse in 4cm too, because it happens twice.

Drew_TNBD

digitalscream said:

Drew_fx said:

So can any of you scary scary people tell me precisely why I decided to sell the Pod HD500? I can't really remember. Was it just boredom? Even though I've got an M9 and have just updated the footswitches, I can't shake this notion that I could simplify all of this:

Nope. Since nobody's going to remember with total accuracy, you should probably buy another one. The answer will probably become apparent after a week or so.

tone1

I had a M13 and although I loved the heavy drive and delays I found the rest of it a bit dissapointing. I sold it and now use Mooer's for modulation, tc flashback for delay and feed my gas with dirt pedals. Seriously the Mooer's blow line 6 out of the water IMO although the line 6 m5 is still drawing me in for a 'just incase' but im still resisting as I'm very happy with individuals.

ICBM

Drew_fx said:

Yeah I do strongly recall it now. The low-end was abruptly cut off, quite severely with the HD500. It's worse in 4cm too, because it happens twice.

Ah, now that's interesting.

I have to admit I've never liked most of the Line6 units at all, but in all honestly I never really got beyond "plug in… set a sound… doodle doodle… this sounds shit… set another sound… (repeat from step 2 several times)… unplug and put it away… shrug…"

I never really listened closely to *why* they sounded bad, although "thin" would definitely have been part of it. But even though I use much less "bassy" sounds than you do, I really like that deep low-end - more for 'feel' than tone - and so if it's severely cut off, that might go partly to explain why I don't like them.

Must pay more attention next time!

Drew_TNBD

As an exercise, I've just priced up the following:

Strymon Timeline x2
Strymon Mobius x1
Strymon Big Sky x1
Rocktron Midimate x1

And that would cost £1618. Arguably that would give me some absolutely amazing possibilities, would meet all of my needs for my past tones, future tones, and would allow me to construct presets for every single tone. But fucking hell is that a lot of money!

Then you need a board big enough to hold it all. Eek! Just don't think that is financially doable for me.

digitalscream

Drew_fx said:

And that would cost £1618. Arguably that would give me some absolutely amazing possibilities, would meet all of my needs for my past tones, future tones, and would allow me to construct presets for every single tone. But fucking hell is that a lot of money!

It's no more than you've already spent on the AxeFX II, but while there are some amazing possibilities it's also far less flexible.

monquixote

It does make the new Fractal product seem more reasonable. 

I think it's only going to be a matter of time before Strymon do a proper multi.

digitalscream

monquixote said:

It does make the new Fractal product seem more reasonable. 

I think it's only going to be a matter of time before Strymon do a proper multi.

When the only way to make your gear seem reasonably priced is to put together a Strymon board, you might have a bit of a problem

Actually, a MIDI-controlled Strymon board could have another problem: MIDI latency, if you're using the MIDI THRU to chain the control signal together. You might have to get a repeater of some sort to make it work snappily.

Drew_TNBD

digitalscream said:

Drew_fx said:

And that would cost £1618. Arguably that would give me some absolutely amazing possibilities, would meet all of my needs for my past tones, future tones, and would allow me to construct presets for every single tone. But fucking hell is that a lot of money!

It's no more than you've already spent on the AxeFX II, but while there are some amazing possibilities it's also far less flexible.

I think if I did it, the rig as a whole would be almost as flexible as the Axe, certainly enough flexibility for me! Remember, the thing I didn't like about the Axe was how overly complicated it could get.

Given that my *actual* effects needs are pretty limited - ie... I only need two types of phaser, one type of reverse delay, one type of forwards delay, and one type of reverb - doing an entirely Strymon board seems financially wasteful to me (when did that ever stop me though?!?!) because it will be capable of sooooooo much... but I'd be using very little of it.

monquixote said:

It does make the new Fractal product seem more reasonable. 

I think it's only going to be a matter of time before Strymon do a proper multi.

Yeah definitely. To be honest.. I don't think the Fractal unit is that badly priced. When you compare it to your average pedalboard with 8 pedals on it... you're going to be in a similar ball-park price wise. I just think for me and my personal needs, it's too much to spend. Well.... that's where my head was at when I found out the rough price in USD anyway.

Drew_TNBD

digitalscream said:

monquixote said:

It does make the new Fractal product seem more reasonable. 

I think it's only going to be a matter of time before Strymon do a proper multi.

When the only way to make your gear seem reasonably priced is to put together a Strymon board, you might have a bit of a problem

Actually, a MIDI-controlled Strymon board could have another problem: MIDI latency, if you're using the MIDI THRU to chain the control signal together. You might have to get a repeater of some sort to make it work snappily.

Hadn't considered that. You'd bloody well hope that the Strymon units didn't bottleneck the midi bandwidth like that!

The thing that really fucks me with all this is the need for two delays at once and my tap-tempo needs. It has always been my Achilles heel when it comes to setting up pedalboards. It never used to be that way! When I started Tacoma, I used two Malekko analog delays and didn't even give a stuff about reversed delay! *sigh*