Helix Flavours?

Haych

Potentially looking at acquiring a Helix of some description.  Mainly for playing at home and for recording.

I like the rack form factor but appreciate the versatility and practicality of the floor unit.  I like the price of neither.

I know there's like a huge thread on the Helix a couple of posts down, but I don't have time to digest 400 odd pages, so hoping someone can provide some simple wisdom and experience in short form.

So, riddle me this - is there any reason to choose either the rack version or floor version over the LT?  

From what I can gather, the LT has most of the same features but a little less of the connectivity of the rack and floor?  Is that about right?  I think the mic pre is also dropped.

Ta very big.

guitarmangler

I’ve got a lt. I love it. The helix proper has the mic input and the better scribble strips,, more loops for external pedals, too. Which is nice. 

The rack (and foot controller) would be good if you wanted slightly more floor space for playing live. 

There all very good, tbh. 

fretmeister

It’s all the same software.

If you need more loops and the mic pre then get the Floor or the rack. If not, then the LT will be fine.

I got the rack as it’s the hub of my recording set up, and if I giggled again it keeps the brains off the floor away from the beer.

Haych

Thanks both, sounds like the LT will do the job more than adequately then.  I'd still prefer the rack form factor if I'm honest and I don't really need the foot control capability as I don't gig.  But, if it can do the same thing for considerably less money then it could be a compromise worth making.

Will consider my options over then next couple of months.

fretmeister

You might find a used rack if you are patient.

I do have the foot controller and I do use it when recording or playing along to youtube etc but I can put it away when I'm recording most of the time. It can be useful for using a pedal to turn on and off noise gates as needed in a take, if I want a really aggressive gate for some staccato stuff.

I am very much a luddite when it comes to recording. I usually record with effects rather than add them later. I like a more live feel.

When you record then the USB7 output is a clean through. So always record with that as well as whatever sound you create and you'll always have something to reamp with other plugins or even back through the Helix.

Mine does all my PC audio - even when watching Netfix.


One thing that the foot controller can do (or the others with f/s) is that there is actually a preset that has midi control for controlling youtube - PLAY / PAUSE etc. That's very handy for playing along!

UnclePsychosis

If you don't need foot control, and you don't gig, you should strongly consider helix native. 

Its the same sounds as the hardware units, but in a software plugin and quite a bit cheaper than a rack! 

Also, if you do buy a hardware unit, you get a massive discount on native. 

TheMarlin

I have a HX FX, and I think it’s an incredibly capable box of endless possibilities………with all the joy sucked out of it. 

Hate it.  It’s the second one I’ve had. I keep trying to convince myself I’m wrong and this is the way forward, but it’s not for me. 

There is more joy to be had in a Strymon El Capistan than in any part of the HXFX. 

And, I believe it to be the same with any modelling setup. One good amp, a few pedals, that’s joy and perfection.  Not endless selections of ‘good enough’. 

I’m a Luddite

Musicwolf

Haych said:

So, riddle me this - is there any reason to choose either the rack version or floor version over the LT?  

From what I can gather, the LT has most of the same features but a little less of the connectivity of the rack and floor?  Is that about right?  I think the mic pre is also dropped.

You've pretty much got it.  The hard part is knowing which of these features is / is not important to you.

Floor / Rack / LT.  Under the hood they are the same.  Same amps, effects etc - they all do the same thing and sound exactly the same.

Control.  The Rack would need either a separate, dedicated, controller or a MIDI controller.  The Floor and the LT are built around the controller, but the big difference is that the Floor has scribble strips.  If you are playing at home this probably doesn't matter but, for me at least, playing live this was a godsend and the reason why I went for the Floor.  The Expression pedal on the Floor is also a little more robust than on the LT.

Inputs and Outputs.  The LT has less than the other two, either one stereo or two mono send and returns.  I've never used more than two but other players may.  The LT lacks the Mic input.  Personally, I've never used this.

chrisj1602

TheMarlin said:

I have a HX FX, and I think it’s an incredibly capable box of endless possibilities………with all the joy sucked out of it. 

Hate it.  It’s the second one I’ve had. I keep trying to convince myself I’m wrong and this is the way forward, but it’s not for me. 

There is more joy to be had in a Strymon El Capistan than in any part of the HXFX. 

And, I believe it to be the same with any modelling setup. One good amp, a few pedals, that’s joy and perfection.  Not endless selections of ‘good enough’. 

I’m a Luddite

For live use, I prefer amp and pedals (that being said, one is now a HX One) but for home practice and recording I’ve really enjoyed using a HX Stomp XL or Helix LT and they work so well for that.

TheMarlin

chrisj1602 said:

TheMarlin said:

I have a HX FX, and I think it’s an incredibly capable box of endless possibilities………with all the joy sucked out of it. 

Hate it.  It’s the second one I’ve had. I keep trying to convince myself I’m wrong and this is the way forward, but it’s not for me. 

There is more joy to be had in a Strymon El Capistan than in any part of the HXFX. 

And, I believe it to be the same with any modelling setup. One good amp, a few pedals, that’s joy and perfection.  Not endless selections of ‘good enough’. 

I’m a Luddite

For live use, I prefer amp and pedals (that being said, one is now a HX One) but for home practice and recording I’ve really enjoyed using a HX Stomp XL or Helix LT and they work so well for that.

Do you play with lots of gain?

I don’t. My perfect starting point of edge of breakup.  Pick lightly, clean, dig in, bit of hair. 

I don’t know why I can’t bond with it.  Maybe I just prefer cables and inconvenience (as @dazzajl says)

Danny1969

One thing I found when trying to record with my Pod Go ... which allegedly is the same amp models and cabs as the Helix ... is that there's something strange going on in the upper mid. The basic amp sounds to my ears didn't sound that realistic to me. So I started using my pedal board going into the Pod and that improved things. But now I was basically using a £300 Pod just for the speaker emulation. So I plugged a Nux MP into the last pedal on my board and then USB'ed that into my PC.And actually preferred it.

Yesterday I had a very old Marshall 9004 solid state rack pre amp in the workshop. Hadn't been used for 20 years and all the knobs were seized.  I gave them some contact cleaner and fired it up and straight away it sounded pretty good. This thing has 7 opamps and 4 transistors ...that's it but it sounds great. 

If I get time I want to do a video playing through all 3 to see if it's just me who prefers almost anything over the Line 6 tones. 

  

Zapple

TheMarlin said:

I have a HX FX, and I think it’s an incredibly capable box of endless possibilities………with all the joy sucked out of it. 

Hate it.  It’s the second one I’ve had. I keep trying to convince myself I’m wrong and this is the way forward, but it’s not for me. 

There is more joy to be had in a Strymon El Capistan than in any part of the HXFX. 

And, I believe it to be the same with any modelling setup. One good amp, a few pedals, that’s joy and perfection.  Not endless selections of ‘good enough’. 

I’m a Luddite

I really like my HX effects! Mainly as a control centre and it's brilliant for bread & butter effects. But I also have one loop running a couple of drive pedals (or amp loop when not running into front of clean amp) and the other is running a delay pedal. The drives on the HX are very good as are the modulation effects (for me anyway). And it's super flexible and easy to edit on the fly. 

On the flip side of this I've had a very love/hate relationship with the Helix amp modelling on Stomp/LT/Floor. Loads of people love it though!!!!

But again, as a control centre for a bigger rig the Helix Floor with 4 loops, scribble strips, etc is pretty unbeatable. Still got a broken Helix Floor (screen doesn't work) that sits under my DAW desk and is used mainly as a foot controller for punching in and out.

Clecko

TheMarlin said:

My perfect starting point of edge of breakup.  Pick lightly, clean, dig in, bit of hair. 

Have you tried the new Helix original amps in the 3.7/3.71 update. Some cracking, quick to get sounding just right options in there. 

Voxman

TheMarlin said:

I have a HX FX, and I think it’s an incredibly capable box of endless possibilities………with all the joy sucked out of it. 

Hate it.  It’s the second one I’ve had. I keep trying to convince myself I’m wrong and this is the way forward, but it’s not for me. 

I kind of get this. I have a Pod Go, which is a good mfx but takes effort to get good tones from. Line 6 has always gone for upgrades with ever more amp and fx.  But in all honesty there are so many now, that a lot are sounding very samey and not all are good. There are too many options, and mic choice and set up are a pain.

I recently had a Valeton GP200 for a few weeks. It has it's pros and cons and I returned it because it didn't meet my gigging needs....in brief, you can't see what effects are being activated by the control footswitches. 

But you know what, it sounded great and was just more fun to use.  It had no mic choices, you just select an amp and cab which was so much easier.  It had some real knobs for tweaking amp models and overall there were far less parameters to worry about.  Not as sophisticated as Pod Go but just more enjoyable to use with 11 fast access buttons to amps, cabs, fx and NR.  

normula1

I have the rack version and foot controller with expression pedals. It's got a midi controlled loop switcher in loop 1 which has multiple racked pedals along with a pair of amps / load boxes for when I feel like a bit of hot glass. Send two feeds a Neo Ventilator 2 which is streets ahead of the Helix ones and loop 3&4 is a stereo pair which via a small mixer returns the Vent, the output of a Roland GR55 synth and a full size TC Ditto so I can loop the synth and guitar tones at the same time without wasting an FX block and foot switch. The guitar out from the synth feeds the aux in.

I wasn't sure about the footcontroller as I have a very good MIDI controller and Helix is pretty pi$$ poor in comparison for MIDI, but I got won over by the scribble strips which is the one thing my old controller lacks.

It sounds really good to my ears, although if I'm honest I barely use more than 10% of the models it has and once I find a virtual rig I like tend to just play. I only ever really spend a good amount of time with option paralysis when a firmware update comes out and I go through them again. Even when I choose a given FX sound I rarely go much past a small tweak or two.

I'd love a floor version as well for use outside my office / playroom, but can't justify it.

Haych

Hmm, so mixed opinions it seems, although erring on the positive side.  

Thing is, it's not one of those bits of gear you can easily try out in a music shop - even if you purchased one online and exercised the 14 day cooling off period allowed in consumer law (which would still be a crappy thing to do), unless you had a good few days off work and without distraction, you'd still be hard pushed to explore its full potential in ever scenario in which you'd want to use it.

So it remains an expensive and risky purchase.  I've watched lots of YouTube vids and it seems impressive from what I've seen and heard, but I don't know how long those players have spent with the unit and how long they've spent tweaking their sounds.  But, it does seem very capable - I just don't have a very good track record with complicated pieces of gear that have lots of menu options.  I tend to get option fatigue very quickly and my tolerance for scrolling through menus is low.

Thank you to everyone who has chipped in, I'll give it some thought and probably make an impulsive decision as I normally do.  There might be a cheap Helix for sale in the classifieds soon, lol.

bloodandtears

maybe start with a used Pod Go/HX Stomp and see if you run out of blocks and need the big full fat version?

mudslide73

It's been said already.. but if you don't need to control anything just get Native. I get what @TheMarlin is saying but once you get some sounds you're happy with there's no looking back - the stereo delays and reverbs are worth the price of admission alone imo.

I also use it to get my presets right before I export to my Stomp, then just adjust slightly when I play with the band. (I'm just using the effects into the front of my amps.) My co guitarist is disparaging about digital kit but then complements my sounds when he can't tell if it's the Helix or not. I've gone "Stomp only" now so there's no denying it

Musicwolf

mudslide73 said:

It's been said already.. but if you don't need to control anything just get Native.

You can download a trial version of Native for free (it lasts for something like 15 days).  This is what I did before I purchased my Helix.

I should say that I was already quite experienced with modellers at this point but I loaded Native into an aging computer, with poor latency, but I got sufficient feel for the Helix workflow to enable me to make up my mind.

willo

I'm a very happy LT user. 

I would say:

1. For years I didn't need the extra connections of the full Helix. Now I'm doing guitar lessons online, I wish I could plug a mic in to the Helix. You can do that on the full Helix. A minor thing though. 

2. If you want to minimise complexity and menus, it might be worth looking at either the UA pedals or the Boss IR2. The Boss also functions with headphones and as an audio interface I believe.

guitarmangler

willo said:

I'm a very happy LT user. 

I would say:

1. For years I didn't need the extra connections of the full Helix. Now I'm doing guitar lessons online, I wish I could plug a mic in to the Helix. You can do that on the full Helix. A minor thing though. 

2. If you want to minimise complexity and menus, it might be worth looking at either the UA pedals or the Boss IR2. The Boss also functions with headphones and as an audio interface I believe.

I used my lt with a mic ( using an adapter) plugged into the input of loop one for online lesson during lockdown. It was fine.