Best way to quieten down a 5E3?

Lebarque

I love a 5E3, but they're LOUD for home use, especially with my preferred Celestion Blue.

What's the best way to quieten it down for home use? Anyone with experience?

Attenuator?
Bit of a PITA reaching around the back but...
Best one for 5E3? @ICBM mentioned Dr Z Brake Lite is good, but they're expensive for what they are.

Master Volume?
Seems like a common mod. How does it work? Does it promote preamp distortion rather than power amp? Sound good? 

Power scaling?
Increasingly popular. Bizarrely the Lazy J version only takes it down to 5/6 watts which is still too loud for bedroom use. One or two knob?

5F1
I much prefer the 5E3 sound and want to use it for rehearsals and small gigs anyway.

dazzajl

You might as well be asking the best way to water down your beer. I’ve had several 5e3 amps and derivatives and not found a way to have that feeling without the earthshaking that comes with it. 

The Time for Tweed and the Quest for Quiet are not compatible sadly

springhead

I use the same power scaling circuit in mine that is in the Lazy J. He just uses the circuit Dana Hall published years ago as VVR. Mine goes below 5W, maybe he’s sitting the power pot a bit above ground to limit the lower limit. 

I think it sounds very good. I was in a rehearsal room with a band with it yesterday and it’s great for taking the volume down a bit but preserving the tone. It’s done a number of gigs like that. Any method that hugely reduces the volume is going to have a tonal impact though. The speaker and your ears will behave differently at that point.  

rze99

I use an attenuator to record with mine it's deafening. I use a THD Hotplate. 

MikeP

Vvr/ power scaling will def go lower, it just begins to sound a bit crap so I'd say that's why lazy j limits to 5w so the reviews don't say it sounds crap at full attenuation. I use the vvr on an 18 watt works great. 

Lebarque

MikeP said:

Vvr/ power scaling will def go lower, it just begins to sound a bit crap so I'd say that's why lazy j limits to 5w so the reviews don't say it sounds crap at full attenuation. I use the vvr on an 18 watt works great. 

That's interesting. I hadn't thought of that. 

Modulus_Amps

VVR/attenuators/master volume all have the same issue, they are only good to knock it back a bit before it really starts to change the sound in a bad way.

Master volumes do work well in a 5E3, but you don't get the power supply sag and sponginess.

If you are after tv level 5E3 the best option IMO to get great tone at low volume is to run it into an inductive load and re-amp it with another amplifier. Something like a suhr load going into a magnum 44. The bonus is that you can use the setup with with  most amps. 

Dominic

Dr Z brake-lite sounds great with mine

hotpickups

I used an L-Pad that I got made for me for my Lazy J20 when I had it. I could turn it down while I’m watching TV with that thing. Didn’t cost much either tbh 

Whistler

I have a Fender 5E3 combo and the best quiet version of its full sound is with a Quilter soundblock Superblock US which has the valve sag in its limiter function. The soundblock Superblock has 1w and 25w. Try one out and compare it with your 5E3 amp; you may be as pleasantly surprised as I am.

Edit: @Secret_Sam spotted my error. Thanks.

RandallFlagg

Headphones and a good modeller

Secret_Sam

Whistler said:

I have a Fender 5E3 combo and the best quiet version of its full sound is with a Quilter soundblock US which has the valve sag in its limiter function. The soundblock has 1w and 25w. Try one out and compare it with your 5E3 amp; you may be as pleasantly surprised as I am.

Superblock (not Soundblock) I guess? Blame the spell checker,!

Winny_Pooh

L-pad in the cab.

Whistler

Secret_Sam said:

Whistler said:

...

Superblock (not Soundblock) I guess? Blame the spell checker,!

Thank you, you are quite right. It was well past midnight so blame me and my tired brain. The spellchecker is, in this case, innocent!

BahHumbug

Something I find amusing - the youtube 5e3 demo vids.  Bloke sitting on a sofa, serenely playing right next to the amp, absolutely no mention of how ridiculously loud it is!

ICBM

If you want to go down the different-amp route…

Amazingly - or not if you understand what it was designed to do - the much-maligned Drive channel on the Hotrod Deluxe will do it, with the right speaker. I once directly A/B’d a tweed Limited Edition one with a Jensen speaker and a boutique 5E3 copy with one, and the Hotrod could nail the 5E3 sound both louder and quieter than the 5E3. You do need to dial it in specifically to do that, which is different from how you normally would for the best clean sound - hence why I think the Drive is usually so derided - but I’ve always found it quite amusing that one of the most desirable amp sounds and one of the least desirable amp sounds are… the same .

To do ‘5E3 with Blue’ you would need an Alnico Cream, since the Blue won’t handle 40W.

If you want it really quiet you would need a Dr. Watson Lion Tamer in the FX loop as well.

Lebarque

Some great suggestions thanks, folks.

A slightly different train of thought:

I also love the 5E3 clean sound with volume on 3. That's still LOUD with a Celestion Blue.

I came across the video below of a 5F1 with a 12 inch WGS G12Q. To me it sounds similar-ish to 5E3 cleans and less Champy. Also sounds a bit alnico even though it's not. Love this tone, especially the neck pup from 1.25.

The G12Q also has the bonus of 96db, so much quieter than a Blue.

Maybe I should explore this route. I'd need a pedal for dirt of course.

Cue shouts of "just get a Victoria 5112" 


   

DrCornelius

There's a cheap Morris Tweed for sale on here (ex @JerkMoans and myself) that I felt nails that clean sound if thats what your after 

victorludorum

MJW Bantam with 5E3 preamp and power soak.

ICBM

Lebarque said:

I came across the video below of a 5F1 with a 12 inch WGS G12Q. To me it sounds similar-ish to 5E3 cleans and less Champy. Also sounds a bit alnico even though it's not. Love this tone, especially the neck pup from 1.25.

The G12Q also has the bonus of 96db, so much quieter than a Blue.

Maybe I should explore this route. I'd need a pedal for dirt of course.

Cue shouts of "just get a Victoria 5112"

The Victoria 5112 doesn't sound 'Champy' at all. I owned a '59 5F1 Champ, and always had a love-hate relationship with it - it was a lovely clean amp in the house, but cranked up it had one sound and one sound only - great if you want raspy bluesy rock'n'roll, no good for anything else. The speaker completely dominates the sound and makes it very unresponsive to guitar type or even pickup selection.

The 5112 is the polar opposite - very transparent, extremely responsive to guitars, pickups and playing dynamics. If I didn't know the amp circuit was identical I wouldn't believe they were the same at all... it's that big a difference. However, it's also loud for a 5W amp, if you're going to crank it - not that far off the 5E3 really.

p90fool

While I do agree that the HRD drive channel is in the same sonic ballpark as a 5E3 it doesn't feel anything like it at all to me, it feels harsh and clangy and is absolutely no fun to play. 

You can get somewhere near with some light compression in the loop, but it never induces the same grin.